Judges Chapter 21 Discussion

  • Richard H Priday on Judges 21 - 2 years ago
    This most depressing section of scripture; from Judges 19 thru 21 can be best summarized in the last verse of chapter 21- "In those days there was no king in Israel; every man did that which was right in his own eyes."

    Chapter 19 gives the miserable story of a man and his servant traveling with what had become his wayward concubine. Such a tradition of concubines was never really mentioned by God; it apparently was tolerated although hardly sanctioned as a marriage covenant was; or even as multiple wives was recognized despite the many troubles ensuing from such relationships. In any case; as we get to chapter 20; there is a narrative almost identical to that of Sodom; where the men decide to want to have relations with other men; and the "collateral damage" ends up being the concubine. This time there is no angelic reprieve and she is raped by multiple men; and left dead at the man's doorstep. The act of these "men of Belial" who are either a subset of the Benjamites themselves or integrated into their community bring the wrath of the rest of Israel after the concubine is cut into twelve pieces and sent out to the tribes. It is clear with the great casualties on both sides that it was not like the battles of old; although Israel was declared to have eventual victory; probably because of this tolerance of the Sodomites in the land. This left the perdicament of chapter 21 where it was promised no women would be given as wives to the Benjamites from other tribes. This left the kidnapping routine during a festival dance as the only way to obtain a wife for them. This is truly a sad period of time in Israel.
  • Chris - In Reply on Judges 21 - 2 years ago
    Hi Neil. Benjamin was the youngest son of Jacob (Israel), by his wife Rachel. Each of the twelve sons of Israel (i.e. their descendants) were allocated portions in the Promised Land. Benjamin received his small portion which was located on the West side of the Jordan, just North of the Dead Sea. The name, Benjamites, apply to the people descended from Benjamin.
  • Neil on Judges 21 - 2 years ago
    The Benjaminites were part of the settled land of Promise , were they one of the 12 tribes ?
  • Kaylee on Judges 21 - 2 years ago
    Hi ummm I'm trying to find a website of how to know if god is trying to communicate with me because my head is hearing weird things and I told my doctor and she said its just fine and I think its god so ya I'm just asking for if you could help me find a website or something thanks
  • Murray ellis on Judges 21 - 3 years ago
    Verse 25: one of the major problems today is that people do what is right in their own eyes.
  • Carleton - In Reply on Judges 21 - 3 years ago
    Since my thread did not end up here, I will repeat it. I think my thought was frivolous and I am sorry.

  • Ron - In Reply on Judges 21 - 3 years ago
    Hi Skip, hope you don't mind, I agree with your "wonder to the angels". I have not read anywhere in scripture that angels will be replaced. In Matt. 25:41 we read the lake of fire was prepared for Satan (devil) and his angels and like everything else, most likely before the foundation of the world, the plan of God. We read in Job1:6 Job 2:1 Satan still has access to heaven, Satan and God are having a conversation about Job. We also see God puts restrictions on Satan.

    I Luke.10:18 we read Jesus saw Satan fall as lightning from heaven.

    In Revelation 12:10 we read the accuser of our brethren has been thrown down. Satan did not fall in Revelation 12, he was cast out of heaven "neither was their place found any more in heaven". We also see in Revelation 12:11 the reason they were able to cast Satan out. "And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony"; This shows this is at least after the crucifying of Jesus, more likely in the future. Also, in Revelation 12, it is permanent, they are rejoicing in heaven Satan will no longer have access to heaven. When Satan is cast out down to earth he gives his power to the beast in Revelation 13.

    In the Bible, we can read angels left their first estate and their own habitation and are locked in chains of darkness until judgment day. Jude 1:6 and 2Pet.2:4. Some scriptures say there are demons, evil spirits on the earth, and how they got here there is little information in the Bible how. You have to go outside the Bible and compile a bushel of speculations and pick one but be careful.

    Some things are not answered by scriptures but do not affect our salvation. The things we do need are in bold print.

    Isaiah 46:10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:

    Thanks Ron
  • Carleton - In Reply on Judges 21 - 3 years ago
    Thank you Skip, just before you posted I sent another message for my thought.

  • Carleton - In Reply on Judges 21 - 3 years ago
    Maybe my though was frivolous. Thank you.
  • SkipVought - In Reply on Judges 21 - 3 years ago
    Carleton & Darren,

    Who says that any must be replaced?

    The redeemed, paid for by The Blood of Christ, have no obligation to replace them.

    It seems that what's going on now is a wonder to the angels. In addition to Eph 3:10 are other allusions including...

    "Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you: Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow. Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into." 1Pe 1:10-12

    Point being that God has greater purposes than have been revealed to us. My ways are higher, eye hath not seen, etc.
  • Darren Croft - In Reply on Judges 21 - 3 years ago
    Dates back to the middle ages. Some say the elect will replace the angels, but who will replace the place of Satan in heaven?
  • Carleton - In Reply on Judges 21 - 3 years ago
    A third of the Angels of Heaven were lost forever with Lucifer. How will the redeemed replace this loss?
  • SkipVought - In Reply on Judges 21 - 3 years ago

    There is little direct evidence why Lucifer was cast to earth.

    "According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:" Eph 1:4

    Jesus chose believers to be "in Him before the foundation of the world."

    So if Lucifer was cast down to the earth, that had to be AFTER the foundation of the world. Hmmmmmm? We were chosen BEFORE and Lucifer was cast down AFTER the foundation of the world.

    Lucifer was involved with Adam and Eve and The Fall.

    Lucifer and the angels that fell with him, were not offered repentance and redemption for their rebellion. However, mankind has been offered repentance and redemption for their rebellion.

    Jesus defeated Lucifer in The Cross and The Resurrection, bringing redemption to mankind.

    "And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it." Col 2:13-15

    And this was hidden from Lucifer.

    "But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory: Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory." 1Co 2:7-8

    And now, even the angels in heaven marvel at what God is doing.

    "To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God," Eph 3:10

    So why did God cast Lucifer to earth? He had a plan to rescue humans, created a little lower than the angels, by Himself becoming one of them and dying for their rebellion, something He didn't do for a greater creation.
  • Brenda on Judges 21 - 3 years ago
    Where in the king James version Bible or Golden Arrow mentioned
  • Sacha - In Reply on Judges 21 - 3 years ago
    There is a line in judges about everyone doing what was right in their own eyes ,thats an indication of what was like then ,yes ,it does seem a bit like a mr terrantino film .
  • Eric Lopez on Judges 21 - 3 years ago
    I'm confused. I thought Israelites were doing evil and God left them for their enemies. Now we have Israelites gathered to do good against Benjamin over unnamed Levite's lies about his concubine cut into pieces? The Bible is like a Quentin Tarantino film lol.
  • Murray on Judges 21 - 3 years ago
    So if God did not approve of the trickery of the 11 tribes giving back wives to the tribe of Benjamin did he punish them for this deceit? Thanks Murray
  • Mishael - In Reply on Judges 21 - 3 years ago
    There's nothing on your thread. Who are you talking to and are you discussing Judges 21?
  • John Wheat III on Judges 21 - 3 years ago
    He is powerful enough to make you believe a lie. How do you justify thinking Gods grace and work on the Cross isnt sufficient you devil?
  • Ann Anglin on Judges 21 - 4 years ago
    Comments on judges chaps 20+21
    Sometimes we as humans make hasty judgment without seeking Gods advice and so we faulted and cannot take back our words, our tongue is sharper than any two edge sword and cannot be tamed. Without Gods mercies.
    We need always to be prayed up n Waite on The Lords answer before we strike our task, Be Bles Sed U'All
  • Stanjett - In Reply on Judges 21 - 4 years ago
    There's no verse in the bible that says once saved always saved. Jesus said about saved people, that no one can pluck them out of my hand. As long as you stay in his hands, yes but he also gave us freewill. We still can chose to not follow him. Why would we not follow him? Satan is very powerful.
  • Stanjett - In Reply on Judges 21 - 4 years ago
    I used to think that once saved always saved. But then I came across lots of that little word "if". If you do this or that you will live and not die. And many more like verses in the bible' He that endues to the end shall be saved. He that overcometh shall live.
  • Anne on Judges 21 - 7 years ago
    According to Proverbs 14:12 there is a way which seems right to a man but its end is the way of death(destruction). We must continue to seek God's face in all of our decisions.
  • April on Judges 21 - 7 years ago
    Hmm,so I wonder,why didn't they seek GOD on what to do 4 finding wives for the house/tribe of Benjamin?,they asked if they should keep going after them in earlier chapters or cease,so why did they think kidnapping women was the answer during that time?,I get vs25 and all but,how they could seek GOD for help then,but not for that moment is beyond me,I don't always get things that happen n Bible...
  • TerryF on Judges 21 - 7 years ago
    I think the key to this whole incident is found in the last verse: "every man did that which was right in his own eyes."

    When we keep in mind what Jeremiah 17 says about the heart of man that it is deceitful above all things and desperately wicked, it is not surprising that man left to decide what is right in his own eyes, ignoring the clear laws of God, gets it totally wrong as both sides did.
  • Jacqueline on Judges 21 - 8 years ago
    When we fail to follow the commandments of God then we open to the temptations of the ruler of this world. This is a hard chapter to digest however it gives us a clear picture of what will happen when people are disobedient to God. God is still a loving and just God because He could have blotted out the whole tribe of Benjamin. He shows compassion on those who truly repent.
  • Dewey J on Judges 21 - 8 years ago
    Franklin, the Israelites still had excellent spiritual leadership Phinehas the grandson of Moses' brother Aaron and other fine spiritual leaders by their faith the Ark of the covenant and the Holy Ghost was still with them. Read judges chapter 20. Glory be to God in the highest through our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ! Amen.
  • Philimon Makasani Chauke on Judges 21 - 9 years ago
  • Fridah on Judges 21 - 10 years ago
    the other tribes of Israel Lamented for Benjamin meaning they still considered them a brother in Israel however they could not associate with them because as in the other chapters they did a detestable thing so they did not give their wives to the Benjamites
  • Kingsley E. on Judges 21 - 10 years ago
    When we make any vow to God we must honour it Also we should learn to live by God s standard

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