Hebrews Chapter 8 Discussion

  • Vance M - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 1 year ago
    It is not God who takes away life. That is not what he does, he is the giver of life. Not the author of death.

    That is the devil, to believe it is god that takes away blessings is a lie from the pit of hell.
  • Richard H Priday - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 1 year ago
    Pretty clearly this is describing the destruction oif the wicked. Their souls will never see the light of life again; should they die in a lost state. Much like the story of Lazarus and the rich man; whose name isn't even mentioned in the account of hell.

    It seems strange; with all the descriptions of hades in the Psalms and other O.T. verses that people only seem to pay attention to the N.T. on the subject. This is much like Jesus quoting that it is harder for a rich man to enter the Kingdom of heaven than a camel to go through the eye of a needle. It can be done; but only if we consider our possessions to belong to God; and to put Him first as well as restoring any wrongs such as Zacheus did. There are many verses about riches being a snare and a trap; such as in the parable of the sower and the seed. It also bears importance for us to consider how in the last days the cares of this world will be a trap for those who are proclaiming "peace; peace" (when as Isaiah stated there is no peace for the wicked).

    We are given our lot in this life; whether rich or poor according to His foreknowledge. Those who have been blessed with a lifetime of such; especially when God doesn't speedily judge makes men complacent; and they risk a fate such as the man who was planning to build bigger barns for himself that their soul will be required that night. Our possessions do us no good after we are gone; and those who don't plan ahead will sometimes have the rightous attain some help; if their descendants don't inherit money or property. We can look at the parable of the two sons; and realize that the one who squandered his money at least learned a proper respect for a rightous father; and that was worth more to him as a servant without any more inheritance than it would have perhaps to the other son who always behaved. It is God who givest; and God who taketh away; and we surely naked we come into this world; and naked we depart (until the Rapture).
  • Phil on Hebrews 8 - 1 year ago
    What psalm 49 v 18 19 20 mean
  • S Spencer - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Amen Philip.

    spot on!! And welcome back.

    God bless.
  • Philip Christian Parks on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Regarding Hebrews 8:5 = GOD commanded Moses to construct the Old Testament Tabernacle as the instrument of HIS presenting HIMSELF to Israel ( Exo. 25:22; cp. 30:6 & 36):

    "There I will meet with thee, and I will commune with thee from above the Mercy Seat, from between the two cherubims which are upon the Ark of the Testimony, of all things which I will give thee in Commandment unto the children of Israel."

    This verse ( Heb. 8:5) records three terms which demonstrate the purpose and value of the Old Testament Levitical Priesthood and of the Tabernacle that GOD commanded Moses to replicate on earth. These terms provide a comprehensive perspective "figure" ( Heb. 9:9) of that which is "of Heavenly Things".

    1st, they served as "the example of Heavenly Things", meaning an exact copy or reproduction of the original and "True Tabernacle, which The LORD pitched, and not man" (v.2). Compare the terms "figure", "pattern", and "fashion" in the following references: Exodus 26:30; 27:8; Numbers 8:4; Acts 7:44; and Hebrews 9:9;

    By design, the example demonstrates the purpose and value of the original. This example is not a counterfeit, but rather a replication of the actual Heavenly Tabernacle which speaks of the saints dwelling in the very Presence of CHRIST ( Rev. 13:6; 15:5; 21:3).

    2nd, they served as a "shadow of Heavenly Things", meaning it only typified, symbolized, represented, and pointed to the Heavenly Tabernacle. A literal shadow is intangible which reveals simply the outline or profile of the actual object. The earthly Tabernacle simply revealed "a figure for the time then present."

    3rd, they served as GOD's earthly "pattern" which was enforced only temporarily until CHRIST established HIS "more Excellent Ministry" (v.6) as exclaimed in Hebrews 10:9-12.
  • English sacha - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Hi Harry , "experimental outpatient " surely that's a warren song ? If it isn't it should be ! Hubby is a total softy , he honestly believes that warrens songs kept him together when I had cancer , he genuinely loves him . I honestly believe that if you are a Christian you should treat all your sufferings as lessons ,Heb ch5 V8 . Suffering is extremely important to us , it smooths off our sharp edges . Suffering is valuable experience for us , or it should be . I learned for sure that I am not my body . On the morning of my 4th chemo I woke up and my body said to me , loud and clear : please don't do that to me again today , I don't like it , I had to psychologically force myself to go and have it and the other two sessions that I had . I now know that I am not my body . It can be very hard to be happy in this world , so many people needlessly suffering , it's hard to accept that as individuals there's not much we can do other than be as kind as possible to everyone who crosses our path . A favourite American writer of mine , Kurt Vonnegut says that the two most dangerous things for us are lonelyness and boredom because these two paths can lead us into terrible trouble if we are not carefull . I've never felt lonely and as an only child I have always known how to amuse myself . Books , especially the best book ever ! I've always loved reading , music is such an instant fix of joy and films . I feel very sorry for anyone who doesn't know how to be happy on their own . Thankfully hubby loves the same stuff as me . He's an only child also . I wonder if that's significant . May God bless you and may He keep you very close to Him always .
  • Harry - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    English Sacha,

    I read your 1st message with the same understanding of your 2nd message. I instinctively know what you said, so no worries. Bless your heart for double-backing around to safeguard my fragile feelings, lol. Bob Dylan has a tune called "License to kill", and has some typical Zimmy lines about man's fall. It's about a woman (Christian) sitting on the hill (Mt Olives) waiting for Jesus to come and take away man's license to kill. "Maybe a noise maker, spirit maker, heart breaker, back breaker, leave no stone unturned, maybe an actor in a plot that might be all that you got, till you error you clearly learn". The Stones make a horse-meat pie sound scrumptious in a song that rhymes with "itch". Too bad it wasn't a corned beef pie, my dad would be 1st one at the table.

    I don't consider my brief challenge of ailments a bad thing considering I could have it much worse. I pledged yearly donations to the hospital annex facility years before I checked in as an experimental outpatient, and I requested they treat me the same as a non-paying client, from a disadvantaged background. The Lord has blessed me beyond my dreams, so I can share the joy with other like minded souls, into the vapor. Cheers to your husband for the well wishes upon a stranger; he's a rock standing out in an ocean of doubt, without compromise.
  • English sacha - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Hi Harold , this is my second reply to you . I was worried I might be misunderstood , what I meant by : we cause these illnesses ourselves was that we , humans , have damaged our environment and filled the earth with all kinds of things that poison us and cause us to be ill . I panicked when I read my first message to you , I was worried you might get the wrong end of the stick as we say in England .
  • English sacha - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Hi Harold , it sounds as if you have had a tough time and I'm very glad to hear you are on the up , I hope you can be happy and healthy again , hubby sends you a manly hug , I've never had a problem taking any treatments . God knows and has always known everything . He already created cures for our ailments before the ailments existed , He also knew how we would poison ourselves and cause these illnesses Gen ch1 v31 and Rom ch14 v14 . I hope none of your white coats is a nurse Ratchet ! I know for an absolute certainty that the harder we lean on Jesus the tighter he keeps hold of us . John ch16 v33 , and it's not horse meat pie , that's a French delicacy ,it's Stargazy Pie , look it up , it's disgusting !
  • Harold - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    English Sacha,

    You just cheered me up, I like how you have that effect on me. I have/had clinical depression, however, you and magic mushrooms lift me up to where I can see the light of day. I'm in a micro-dosing study at the local university, and never felt better. My brain scans show normal activity where it used to be sparse, meaning my brain has been, forgive me, "raptured". The white coats call me an excitable boy, (I'm almost 60). God put cures out there for the taking, alternative medicines are a life saver.

    I missed you and hoped you were safe and sound, nibbling on a horse meat pie, enjoying every sandwich. Tenderness on the block is hard to find when you're searching for a heart. I say this because my dad, in Wallasey, England, as a teen during WWII spent years eating only corned beef. I once bought him a 12 lb corned beef for his birthday and he promptly launched it off the balcony, into the pool.

    We can talk about the Lord's business next time around. I just wanted to catch up for now. My rides here, gotta hasten down the wind. Bless you and your loved ones.
  • English sacha - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Hi Harold , so sorry for the late reply , I had a bad luck streak in dancing school and I was mistaken for s p a m , I do hope that you and all yours are ok . We do not belong to this world so try not to let it wind you up , we have a lot to look forward to so stay strong and cheerfull , keep your eye on the prize ! Much love in Christ .
  • Rick - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Lex The question is not Gods ability to forgive the question is the persons being honest in their Heart about what they are doing or want. Getting born again and changing is not lip service! God knows everything omnipresent therefore the only one who's being played with is the individual not being honest in His spiritual life or walk with God. Also God does not produce fear or terror 2 Timothy 1:7 For God hath given us the spirit of fear, but of power and of love and a sound mind. 1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. Conscience is habit pattern so if you continue in same corrupt habit pattern there has been no change of Heart towards respecting or obeying Gods word. So for that individual the sacrifice made by Jesus christ for sins means nothing, not a good place to be in mentally. So make up your mind 1 John 1:9 In His Service
  • Lex - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    If one errs from the truth and wants to return to Christ but fears they have fallen away (in reference to Hebrews 6) do you think that the fact that they find it hard to experience godly sorrow means that they are unable to be brought back to repentance? I have read it explained a few ways: those who have completely fallen away don't want to repent, or they don't believe so they do not, but my concern is what if someone who has fallen away does want to repent but God in His power basically says no? God doesn't contradict Himself but that notion has kept me awake before.
  • Harold - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    English Sacha,

    I like your attitude towards the authentic. Splendid Isolation draws me in at a time when America's decline and subsequent dismantling is inevitable. How can this possibly be a Mystery when it has been written?
  • Jen - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago

    I'm sorry, I really only responded to a small part of what you wrote:

    I also have a good friend who is a believer but lives by the ways of the world. And I also take the bible - every word of the Word - literally and seriously. I'm with you in worrying, I know it's hard to see the people you care about wandering off the narrow path. But if they're practicing sin, they are backslidden. If they think they know better than God what's right and wrong for them, or what's good and what's bad for them, they are committing original sin. That's the pride of life, and the very cause of the fallen state in which we all find ourselves. God can help them, He will leave the 99 to retrieve the 1, that's a promise! And He is faithful to keep His promises.
  • Jen - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Hi English Sacha,

    There are definitely some people who come to church to be seen, and that's always been the case. People tend to expose their bodies for attention (which they think of as love), or for money; sometimes both (like with actors and actresses on TV). The world has trained everyone to think we need carnal attention or else we're not valuable. All we need is to be pleasing in the sight of God, but we forget that and try to be crowd pleasers. I also wear a little bit of mascara and I color in my eyebrows lightly, because I'm pale and I rubbed off a lot of the hair on my brows trying to fix them when I was younger - doesn't want to grow back, now. But I talk to God about it in my mind pretty frequently, I apologize for thinking I could do a better job than He did on putting me together. :- And I thank Him for being my eyes and guiding my hands while I attempt a slight enhancement - on my own, I can get ham fisted and heavy handed about it. Not to mention asymmetrical. At any rate, I hope He forgives me my little vanities and I do my best to keep my thoughts humble and grateful. He blesses me with so much and keeps me from the struggles I would otherwise create for myself.

    Images are an obsession for people in the world, everyone wants to be seen as their best possible image, we just can't see very clearly and don't understand how others are perceiving us. If someone looks like they're lost in worldly ways, they probably are, and we should pray for them to delight in pleasing God instead of striving for the carnal attention of a world that only wants to eat them alive. It's hard, though - I'm not a big fan of mostly naked women parading around town, either - I just keep reminding myself that I don't have any control over it, but God has all the power, and He hears my prayers.
  • Jen - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Hi Adam,

    Of course we are tempted. We don't want to fall prey to temptation. I am very familiar with Paul, who said that he does what he doesn't want to do, and doesn't do what he does want to do.

    We are tempted to sin, but we don't want to sin. I should have been more clear about that, I apologize. :)

  • Free - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Hallo dear friend in Jesus. Ty for your information and im so glad. Becouse u tell about the peace, the thru, the light and what christian supposed to do, who is not likely easy to live after. Understand me right, we have the Holy Spirit who tell us the law! Who tell us right things too do. Thats all about the life Christianity stand for. And forever we will do the right things. What we really do is a different thing. . . If so we need to confess.

    What we bring in too the churches for example?

    And here we need too look at each other with fully Love. Becouse all have grown differently with God. Some is a new born all the life. Some is seriously reading and studying the scripture from early morning too late night. Someone take the service of pray, and some lay they're hands on other ppl too heal them and soo much more. Some is singing for the Lord, and some are reading. Nowone is not useful. He Ia the Head.

    And all is happy about that way of living. It doesn't make one more worthy anyway. We need too see the Lord in each other. See the Spirit of God, see the Love. And carry over with each other, always! A scripture who follow me is when Jesus wach the feet in

    John 13:14

    If I then, your Lord and Master, have washed your feet; ye also ought to wash one another's feet.

    John 13:6

    Then cometh he to Simon Peter: and Peter saith unto him, Lord, dost thou wash my feet?

    We need too see the mercy and live after it, as good as we can. That is one of the Spirits. Becouse in another script Jesus said.

    Luke 9.54And when his disciples James and John saw this, they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven, and consume them, even as Elias did?

    55But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of.

    56For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them. And they went to another village.

    God bless Love u all in Jesus name.
  • English sacha - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Hi Jen , I enjoyed your post very much . I cannot tell you how many times I have seen people , to be honest women , in a church , with half of their flesh on display , reeking of too much perfume and with a two inch thick mask of make up on their faces . It makes me very sad to think that they feel that this is what they should look like . I'm getting on a bit now and starting to look my age , I wear a tiny bit of mascara and maybe some powder to cover my shiney nose , I dye my hair so it's not grey . I do these things so that people don't think that I'm my husband's mum ! So many men also in expensive suits and jewelry and too much aftershave . I don't understand it . Of course God looks at our hearts and not our outward appearance and these people I am criticizing may be very faithfull Christians , I shouldn't judge , I know that . I'm much more comfortable around slightly scruffy people , I like to see some ones real face .
  • Adam - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Hello, thanks for sharing your opinion. You used the word 'we' as though you have grouped yourselves with others, assuming others have the same opinion. I could use 'we' also.

    I'd like to question one of your assumptions: "Children of God don't want to sin"

    Is that true?

    Do you believe is Paul a child of God? In my view, Paul became one of the strongest Christian evangelists in world history. He was absolutely dedicated to preaching the message of Jesus Christ, and wrote more books than anyone else in the Bible. He also wrote the following which he admitted to struggling with sin:

    Rom 7:14-19

    Do you have any evidence for where the belief that Christians don't want to sin or aren't tempted by sin comes from? Currently, without further Biblical support I tend to believe Paul and what he wrote. God bless.

    I know dozens of Christians living in sin right now and they are enjoying it immensely. They are taught they don't have to try to avoid it- that human effort is 'bad', so they follow the world and its desires, assuming they're following Christ. I know some assume there's nothing to worry about since they assume they're 'saved', but I am worried for their souls based on what the Bible says. John 14:15-17, ROMANS 11:6, Hebrews 10:26, James 2:19, 1 Cor 9:24-27. Is it 'wrong' to take the Bible verses literally and be concerned for one's salvation? Is it 'wrong' to believe in the Bible?
  • Jen - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    I think we're talking about the multitude of sins we committed every day before we were saved. If we weren't really saved, our nature hasn't changed (we're incapable of changing ourselves very much at all, maybe eating and exercise habits or other disciplines, but fundamental changes in the nature of our minds and hearts are God's work), and we're probably still clinging to sin in the darkness.

    If we consider ourselves saved, but still wonder if it's okay to commit the sins in which we used to partake freely and which, frankly, the world only encourages, we have not actually received conviction and are not converted. Children of God don't want to sin, it breaks our hearts and makes us ashamed of the carnal nature, we hear other people cursing or witness violence between them and apologize to God because we can feel His grief. We see the flesh of the demonized dead exposed all around us like meat on grocery store shelves for public display and we turn away to give them the respect they don't know they should have for the bodies God gave them and to keep ourselves unpolluted by lustful or judgmental thoughts. If God hasn't spoken into our lives about His definition of right and wrong and about how He feels - or if we don't care about how He feels - it is no small wonder that we see merit in arguing over whether or not grace grants the liberty to sin. The bible says it doesn't, several times over, but we shouldn't need it to. Not if God is our father. We know whose child we are by the one we desire to emulate in our lives. There's no need to wonder, it is evident. We didn't make any of this up, there are only 2 sides to be on, and no gray areas in between. If our preference in life is toward sin, we are still children of the devil, and we should ask God with sincere hearts to deliver us from the evil one. We don't reluctantly submit our lives to Christ, we do it with overwhelming joy and gratitude. If we are reluctant, our nature hasn't changed, and we need saving.
  • Jesse - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Brother Spencer,

    Yes,amen. Every believer who belongs to Christ will stand before the judgment seat (Bema) of Christ. At that judgment, we will be judged, not for heaven or hell, because Jesus already purchased our salvation. We will be judged to determine our reward. That which is of Christ, we will be rewarded for and that which is not of Him will burn. This judgment is separate from the Great White Throne judgment that takes place after the thousand-year reign of Christ.

    From my understanding, when Christ comes for His church, the dead in Christ will rise first, and the we will be caught up with them to meet the Lord in the air. And then we will stand before the Bema Seat of Christ to receive our reward. The wicked dead will not be raised until the thousand year reign. They will stand before the Great White Throne judgment and will then be cast into the lake of fire (Hell)
  • S Spencer - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Brother Jesse

    Here we have "ONLY" two groups, one group works abide after testing by fire, and they received an award.

    The others works burned up and they suffered loss but they themselves are saved.

    No Mention of anyone going to Hell!

    1 Corinthians 3:13-15. Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

    If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.

    If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: BUT HE HIMSELF SHALL BE SAVED; YET SO AS BY FIRE.
  • S Spencer - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Amen Brother Jesse.

    I believe it's widely held that the judgment seat is called the Bema seat throughout scripture in other places.

    Paul was brought up to the judgment seat in Acts, That judgment seat is called the Bema seat.

    Acts 18:12. And when Gallio was the deputy of Achaia, the Jews made insurrection with one accord against Paul, and brought him to the judgment seat,

    Judgment seat is the same as Bema seat "Greek"

    Judgment seat of Christ is the Bema seat of Christ in Greek as mentioned in

    2 Corinthians 5:10. For we must all appear before the JUDGMENT SEAT OF CHRIST; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.


    Transliteration: bma

    Pronunciation: bay'-ma

    Definition: From the base of G939; a step that is foot breath; by implication a rostrum that is tribunal: - judgment-seat set [foot] on throne.

    KJV Usage: judgment seat(10x), throne(1x), to set (one's) foot on(withG4128)(1x).

    Occurs: 13

    In verses: 12

    Thank you Brother for all you do! You have been a blessing to many in sharing.

    God bless.
  • Jesse - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Hello English sacha,

    No, you have not offended me at all. Prior to posting an answer to a person's question, it is sometimes difficult for me to determine whether or not that the person asking the question is a "babe" in Christ or someone who has been studying the word for a while. When I read the question "Will we see our loved ones again in judgment," I had no way of knowing if this person has ever heard of the Bema Seat of Christ or not. That is why I asked which judgment they were speaking of, because there will be two separate future judgments.

    I do realize that the KJV does not use the word Bema because it is a Greek word. But the KJV is a translation, and the original Greek text uses Bema. The translators translated Bema Seat of Christ into judgment seat of Christ in our English text. I am wondering if I am the only person here that has ever heard of the Bema Seat? Hopefully someone else has heard of it. I'm especially hoping that the person I responded to has heard of it, or at a bare minimum looked it up to make sure I was not just making words up that simply do not exist. It is a real word, not something I made up.

    The word Bema is a biblical word. It comes from the original text, before the King James translation existed. There are no Greek words in our English bibles, but those words do exist, and Bema is one of those words. I probably should have stated that Bema Seat of Christ is the same as saying judgment seat of Christ. I did not mean to confuse you or cause anyone to search the entire bible looking for a Greek word that's not there.

    Sometimes I just make an assumption that in our day and age, most people know how to do a Google search to look up words or biblical phrases and where they come from. I do that at times if there's something someone posts that I never heard of. I will be careful to state where the word comes from in my future posts. Thank you for pointing that out!
  • Rick - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Adam By your reply you didn't read all my comments, and that's okay. God Bless
  • Adam - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    That's your choice, and I agree that quarreling should be avoided, but discussing the Bible for better understanding of God's word is profit and does give God the glory. Those who are trying to teach others on this discussion forum should have scriptures to back up their claims. God bless.
  • Rick - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Adam Hi did you read my reply?
  • Rick - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Hi Adam Brother with all due respect I have watched on this site where people have backed up there belief with scripture and still disagreed so there was no point. I can give all the scripture I know concerning what I stated and anyone else can say that's not what I believe, and that's there privilege. So my point is I won't argue because what's the profit or who gets the Glory. In His Service
  • Rick - In Reply on Hebrews 8 - 2 years ago
    Hi English sacha With me sister I don't get into it until the question is asked, I personally like the indepth research but my bottom line is share the Love of God that was given through Jesus Christ and let God do the rest. Or Let the Word do the Work. In His Service

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