Genesis Chapter 25 Discussion



 
  • Ishmael returned only for the funeral of Abraham - in Reply on Genesis 25
    What does Genesis 25:9 mean?

    Genesis 23 describes in detail Abraham's acquisition of the cave of Machpelah immediately following the death of Sarah. Now Isaac and Ishmael reunite to bury Abraham's body in that cave alongside Sarah.

    Abraham had sent away Ishmael, along with his mother Hagar. Ishmael was 16 or so and Isaac was around two ( Genesis 21:8-14). Now the step-brothers would be somewhere around 89 and 75, respectively. Ishmael's presence at Abraham's burial may imply there was some contact between Isaac and his birth family over the years.

    Despite this meeting to honor their father, God's prophetic remarks about Ishmael would prove true

    ( Genesis 16:11-12). Ishmael's descendants would become the Enemies of Israel.

    Genesis 25:1-18 adds details before describing the deaths of Abraham and then Ishmael. Abraham has taken another wife, (not Hagar) other than Sarah, and has six sons with her. He gives them gifts but sends them all away to the EAST.

    Isaac will be his sole true heir. Still, when Abraham dies and is buried at the age of 175, Ishmael joins Isaac for the funeral. Ishmael's 12 sons are listed, along with a description of the region their tribes settled in. Finally, Ishmael dies, as well, at the age of 137.
  • Scott on Genesis 25
    I read where Hagar Sara's hand maiden and Ishmael left in chap 25 verse 9 I read where Ishmael helped Isaac bury Abraham. When did he come back?
  • GiGi again on Genesis 25
    And again, the story of Jacob and Esau is referred to again in Hebrews 12:14-17, where believers are exhorted to pursue peace with all people and holiness, warned to avoid any root of bitterness from springing up to cause trouble, which defiles many and leads many to become fornicators and/or profane like Esau. The text in Hebrews goes on to tell how Esau sold his birthright for a morsel of food, and then later, wanted to have the inheritance back with its blessing but he was rejected due to his lack of repentance. From these N.T. Scripture we can consider that Esau di not wish to follow the ways of Isaac and his grandfather, Abraham. He wanted to run his own life his way. He is described as a fornicator and profane. This may be literally so or figuratively so, or both. Either way, Esau was rejected by God as the heir of the promise for reasons God knew in His perfect wisdom inn election of some to be vessels of his wrath an others to be vessels of his mercy. ( Romans 9:22-24) I suggest reading the whole section in Romans 9:1-33.

    So, apparently God in his foreknowledge elected Jacob the heir of the promise, and Esau, in his free will choice to depart from the way of faith of his father and grandfather, was not elected. For me, I do not wrestle much with this matter, as I trust God's way and wisdom. If I was an unbeliever and read these Scriptures, I would be disturbed and either reject God or seek how to be saved, which depends, ultimately, on God's foreknowledge and election. God will never turn away a contrite heart who desires to be saved. He will make a way for this person to hear the gospel and give faith to believe by grace. Jacob was not a perfect brother, by any means. But, would become a man of God as he grew in grace and knowledge of God in his lifetime. I am reminded that later in history, God will identify himself as the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. They were elected and blessed by God despite their failings, but acted on the faith God seeded in them
  • GiGi again on Genesis 25
    It says that Esau was born first and he was red and hairy. it doesn't describe Jacob. So, we do not know what Jacob looked like. It seems that they were fraternal, not identical. This description of Esau will be important in the next chapter.

    As they grew up, Esau was a skilled hunter, and Jacob, a shepherd. They continued to dwell in tents, still needing to move their flocks from pastureland to pastureland Esau was the stronger, and Jacob supposedly was mild in demeaner. The parents favored one child over the other, Isaac favoring Esau, and Rebekah favoring Jacob. Since Rebekah never conceived again, each parent could spoil their favored child. I am sure this caused a lot of problems. Both children could be seen as heirs to God's promises, both being of the promised seed. The firstborn would customarily have the birthright blessing and the other a secondary blessing. It seems that Esau did not value the birthright very much. Maybe he knew that the birthright would include following after God like Abraham and Isaac. he may have not been interested in spiritual matters as much as Jacob was. Esau was willing to trade this treasured birthright blessing for a bowl of lentil stew when he returned from a hunting excursion famished, stating her was near death with hunger, probably an exaggeration. Jacob was cunning and took advantage of his brother.

    Isaac and Esau are spoken of later in the N.T. in Romans: 9 where it speaks of the true Israel not being children of the flesh, like Esau, even though he is a seed of Abraham. Rather it was the children of the promise that are the true Israel by election, elected before they were born and had not done good or evil. This election is not of works, but of God's purpose and calling. This encounter about the birthright was not the event that determined the election of Jacob, not Esau. It was determined before they were born. God was not going to make a people for Himself out of two brothers, but out of one of them.
  • GiGi again on Genesis 25
    Isaac and Ishmael did reunite and buried their father together. How much interaction they had prior to this or after is unknown. Notice that it was after Abraham died that God blessed Isaac. He was now 75, the same age that Abraham was when God called him to leave Ur. isaac was blessed by God through Abraham during his life, but now he was the family patriarch. He had been living at Beer Lahai Roi, in the Negev, southwest of Mamre (Hebron). Beer means well, Lahai Roi means "of the Living One who sees me." This very well may be the well that Hagar found when the Lord appeared to her when she was sent into the wilderness at Sarah's request. At the time, the wilderness area had plenty of game animals.

    The next part of the chapter gives the lineage of Ishmael and account of his death. He had twelve sons (princes), just as prophesied, and the descendants dwelt across Saudi Arabia. Some of Keturah's sons' descendants also settled in northern Arabia, as well as to the east in what is later called Midian. Ishmael lived 137 years, living about 50 years longer than his father, Abraham. It says he died in the presence of all of his brethren, perhaps all of his sons.

    The next section is an account of the birth of Jacob and Esau. Again, like Sarah, Rebekah was barren for some time, at least 20 years. She was probably a teen when she married Isaac, as was customary. Both new of God's promise and covenant with their father, Abraham. Therefore, they must have expected to have had many children within that 20 years. But no, none. Isaac pleaded with God concerning Rebekah's barrenness. God answered his prayers in His time. The pregnancy was unusual, as Rebekah felt that there was "wrestling" going on within her womb. She was concerned and asked God to give some explanation. He spoke to her (before it seemed that God spoke only to Abraham, but here He speaks to a woman) telling here that two nations are within her, twins, and gives a prophecy about the children.
  • GiGi on Genesis 25
    Such and interesting chapter. And the comments were informative. Even though I am very familiar with this story, I am learning new things each time I revisit. It appears that Abraham married another of his concubines, Keturah. We do not know how long she was part of Abraham's household, but she was young enough to bear 6 sons which probably took about 12 to 15 years or so. Verse 6 said that he had sons from his concubines, so he may have fathered sons from women other than Keturah, as well.

    These sons were old enough to set out on their own. Abraham knew his time of death was near. that is why he gave everything to Isaac (the inheritance and blessing) and made sure that the sons from Keturah were well gifted so they could start out on their own away from Isaac and Rebekah. These sons of Keturah settled East of where Abraham, Isaac, Rebekah, Jacob, and Esau lived (west of the Jordan River) (The twins were born when Abraham was 160 or so, since Isaac was 60 when they were born.) Abraham lived almost 50 years longer than Sarah. So we do not know if these sons were all born after Sarah died or before, or before and after, since Keturah was already his concubine, but made her his wife. There is a lot we do not know about this time of Abraham's last 50 years of life.

    Just as Ishmael was sent away after the child of promise (Isaac) was born, these sons of Keturah were sent away because the promised was through Isaac's family line. We do not know the ethnicity of Keturah like we did with Hagar (Egyptian), but most likely she was not from Abraham's kin, Nahor. Abraham knew God who the promised lineage should descend from and he protected that. Abraham lived to a ripe old age of 175. Jacob and Esau would have known him, being 15 when he died. He was buried in the cave with the body of Sarah. Thus it became known as the Cave of the Patriarchs and is still there, though it may not be able to be accessed by the public.
  • Chris - in Reply on Genesis 25
    Gerald, you may need to research that one, as there could be differences in opinion. The one I came across is Saint Linus (from 64 to 76 AD). No doubt, sainthood was granted to him & some popes after their demise. However, Roman Catholics will disagree, as they believe Peter, the apostle of Jesus, was the first one, to which I disagree.
  • Gerald on Genesis 25
    Who was first pope
  • Nate on Genesis 25
    "Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."
  • Lauren - in Reply on Genesis 25
    Chris, I really appreciate your manner of teaching and your tone. I find it easy to learn of a calm, quiet spirit. Thank you. I am new to this KJV site, and it has been such a blessing to learn more, and be more in the Word. Blessings to both you and Bill, and thank you for stirring up my love of the Scriptures....
  • Chris - in Reply on Genesis 25
    Thank you for your voice of disagreement, Bill. We have stated our positions - let others who are acquainted with this account be the judge of the matter.
  • Chris - in Reply on Genesis 25
    Well Bill, you've stated your point with some strong language. I see that you clearly condemn Esau in what he did, by selling his birthright - and I agree that was very wrong for him to do such a thing. And then you placed the deception on Esau by him not telling his father Isaac what he had done with his birthright. Yes, I can see that also. And then you wrote further on his misdeeds.

    And you think that Rebekah & Jacob did no wrong in all this? Are we reading from the same Scriptures? Where was the brotherly love of Jacob when seeing his weakened brother beg him for food? Even the vilest person this day will have some compassion for his siblings. What did he do? He took advantage of Esau's physical predicament to trade food for his birthright. And if this is not enough for any to cringe with amazement & anger, we read further in Genesis chapter 27 of Rebekah & Jacob's further sins. Sins of deception & lies that lay in their hearts.

    Esau well said in verse 36, "Is not he rightly named Jacob? for he hath supplanted me these two times: he took away my birthright; and, behold, now he hath taken away my blessing." And yes, Esau was equally to be blamed for his loss. But the Plan of God had to come to pass ( Genesis 25:23, "And the LORD said unto her, Two nations are in thy womb, and two manner of people shall be separated from thy bowels; and the one people shall be stronger than the other people; and the elder shall serve the younger."). In spite of God's Plan, man is still accountable for the conduct of his life and he will not be held guiltless for his sins.
  • Bill Ben Yasrael - in Reply on Genesis 25
    I totally disagree with you, Jacob did not deceive Esau, Esau sold his birthright for some pottage (red stew), you people keep putting out this false information. Esau knew what he was doing and did not care, you must be of his lineage. Esau did not respect his birthright established by: "THE MOST HIGH". He wanted his cake and to eat it. To make matters worse he deceived his father Isaac, he could have told Isaac: "Father I sold my birthright to Jacob for some pottage. He was an arrogant disobedient son, look what he did married foreign women his father told him not to and: "He caused Isaac and Rebekah grief". You are incorrect Esau's behavior and that of his progeny give us Great cause to reflect on his evil deeds. All his seed does is go in to countries, kill the native people, make wars and spread hate and pollute this world, but his reign of Terror is over, now is the time of: "Jacob" says: "THE MOST HIGH".
  • Ron on Genesis 25
    Genesis 25:1 I've sometimes wondered why the concubine Keturah had to come into the picture here. Abraham had questioned whether he could father a child at 100 years of age ( Genesis 17:17) and he is about 140 by this time. Isaac, his true heir and the son of promise, was at least 40 and had married Rebekah to insure the continuation of the lineage. And one of these sons of Keturah, Midian (verse 2) was presumably the father of the Midianites, who caused Israel so much grief later on ( Judges 6)
  • Chris - in Reply on Genesis 25
    No Stacey. Esau, as his brother Jacob, were the offspring of Isaac & Rebekah. Satan does not bear physical children - He bears spiritual children, of which we all were once when we obeyed him rather than the living Holy God. When Jesus accused the religious leaders of their wickedness, He said that they were the children of the Devil ( John 8:44): not that the Devil was their physical father, but was their spiritual father as he filled them with his words & works of evil.

    So Esau was Isaac's son but because of the deception by his brother Jacob & therefore missing out on the blessing from Isaac, Esau left the home, married foreign women, became wealthy & became the father of the Edomites, as also likely, the Kenizzites & Amalekites. Eventually, the brothers did reconcile (Genesis chapter 33), but it remained that Esau's progeny were never included in Jacob's line. Because Esau did what he did, does not give us any warrant to ever think of him as a product of some demonic relationship.
  • Stacey Haigood on Genesis 25
    Is Esau the son of Satan
  • Alex on Genesis 25
    Comments by Alex about Gen. 25 Jacob and Esau. I love this passage about Jacob stealing Esau's birth right it was just a metaphor that the 3 rd person the H.G. is gonna steal our birth right which was death, The soul that sinneth shall surly die that was our birth right in the spritual realm, that which is born of the flesh is flesh our 1st innerman,our evil and adamic nature but our newman takes him by the heel ( the heart ) In in the natural Jacob stealing esau's birth right was a terrible thing, But in the spirit its the H.G. STEALING OUR OLD BIRTH RIGHT WHICH WAS DEATH. Jacob was the 3 rd person in rank with the H.G. the 3 rd person that is gonna steal our birth right. Behold i come as a thief in th night . Jesus had to die that we might get anew birth right th blood that red pottage. Unless ya drink my blood you have no life in you. Scripture says how are the things of Esau sought out. The H.G. (JACOB )HAD ESAU BY THE HEEL READ ISIAH 49 YOU SEE ANOTHER JACOB A HEAVENLY JACOB. Remember Issac asked Jacob how is it that you have found it so quickly and he answered the Lord has given it to me, This whole Jacob and Esau thing has spritual implications gotta run bbl.
  • J. - in Reply on Genesis 25
    The bible said esau i hate and jacob i love esau was of birth right and jacob was of the promise of god esau blessing came from man jacob blessing came from god it not what man say but god amen
  • Kenyon Israel on Genesis 25
    I don't know what any of y'all talkin about because my understanding ain't y'all understand I mean no disrespect but I only know one nation of people that's red and hairy all over today they red when they laugh they red when they cry they red when they's mad and they Hairy all over we Caucasian people period and there is no description of Jacob because Jacob looked like everything else on the face of the Earth at that time which was Brown the Bible is not hard to read it's simple man and woman make it hard to understand but God's understanding is clear at least to me it is
  • Bobby on Genesis 25
    That's not true, kindly checkout when Muslims came into existence breathren. Kindly listen this wonderful story by brother veath, it's history. The devil is a liar do kindly explain what u mean by saying that the edomites sre like Muslims today... Go you tube and type in , the origin of the muslims and the Catholic Church by brother Veith
  • Ongom - in Reply on Genesis 25:1
    Good evening Mr. Mulenga! How do you enjoy reading the Bible if you don't have one? I mean, where are you enjoying your reading from? Just asking!
  • Charley on Genesis 25
    essau despised his birthright. jacob have i loved essau have i hated, essau was part of the edomites who were a type of the muslims today,edomites are descendants of esau history repeats itself the the middle east will never have peace till the lord jesus christ will come and settle the issue with great vengence. 2ndthess1-8-9
  • JOHN MCKOY - in Reply on Genesis 25
    God knows what you going to do before you do it .god dont make you do it but knows your answer to what you will choose to do.it was already plan before you was born.that why he is god
  • Me again on Genesis 25
    NO JASON.
    ESAU DESPISED HIS BIRTH RIGHT. The Scriptures tell you that.
    Gen 25:34
    "Then Jacob gave Esau bread and pottage of lentiles; and he did eat and drink, and rose up, and went his way: thus Esau despised his birthright".

    ITS RIGHT THERE.

    And God ALREADY TOLD HER WHO was going to have the birthright. It was GODS plan. ESAU WAS ALREADY HATED AND SET FOR DESTRUCTION by GOD.
  • Biblical Speaker on Genesis 25
    I love this site, it makes it so easy to live my life knowing I have a bible at all times with me in my pocket. I will raise my children in the name of god, I will obey his every word, I will be his servant. He is my shepherd. I am not perfect, I am nowhere near perfect. But I am a servant who serves in the name of The Holy Savior. He is my life, my love, my father, my friend. No love compares,God
  • BSP on Genesis 25
    Verse 21~Children are a gift from God as shown here when Isaac was entreating Jehovah God in regards to Rebekah having a child.
  • Leigh on Genesis 25
    It wasn't about which son was stronger.
    Two nations were in her womb and one people would be stronger than the other.
  • A disciple on Genesis 25
    No Jason, you are wrong! The Scriptures say that God loved Jacob and hated Esau. Why? Because Esau hated the things of the LORD and despised his sacred heritage; choosing instead to be heathen like the Canaanites his neighbors, and Ishmael the wild man who despised his father Isaac. Esau thought more of his pride and his natural appetites than the holy promise of Christ, and God's covenant!
  • Jason on Genesis 25
    Incorrect. You say Esau gave up his birthright because he despised it.I dont think that's true at all.Isaac like Esau but loved them both. Rebekah was plotting with Jacob to be deceiving. It's in other scriptures.That's why when Esau said he was hungry Jacob instantly jumped right to him wanting his birthright.The most high NEVER SAID the younger was stronger.Esau was clearly the stronger one.
  • A disciple on Genesis 25
    Teri Greene; It was Esau who despised his birthright and the things of God. Because Jacob saw that as a very real aspect of his brother's character, that his mind and heart was only ever toward the pride of the heathen; he took him up on his own hostility to the spiritual things of the Family's Divine Inheritance. God said that Jacob, as a Prince, has power with men and God, and has prevailed!


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