"WATER" in Bible Discussions

 
  • Richard H Priday - 12 hours ago
    Ezekiel 18:25-28 states:

    25 Yet ye say, The way of the Lord is not equal. Hear now, O house of Israel; Is not my way equal? are not your ways unequal?

    26 When a righteous man turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and dieth in them; for his iniquity that he hath done shall he die.

    27 Again, when the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness that he hath committed, and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul alive.

    28 Because he considereth, and turneth away from all his transgressions that he hath committed, he shall surely live, he shall not die.

    These verses at first glance seem to contradict the idea of the Grace of God. A basic argument that holds some water here is that the Spirit of God didn't work at it does today ( John 16:8) with a permanent indwelling as this and other verses promise.

    We could also look at such instances as King Hezekiah in 2 Kings 20:6 who apparently had a righteous life and God heard his prayer to continue 15 more years. One good study is with Saul's foolishness which ended with an early death after he saught wisdom from the witch of Endor in 1 Samuel 28. We see other wicked kings as well have a shortened life; perhaps also Solomon. Of course we all die physically; and some would argue the soul dies also only the spirit goes on to eternity. I would add the solution is in verse 31 of Ezekiel 18 which mentions getting a new heart and spirit. This only comes through the Lord ( Ezekiel 36:26-27). Without this we can superficially ask forgiveness every time an outward sin is found; but this doesn't make us able to do good because of man's sin nature; and ignores sins of omission as well as one's we aren't aware of. It also shows how we shouldn't boast how long we haven't sinned as some foolishly proclaim; ignoring warnings in 1 John about the fact that we are a liar if we claim we have no sin. God's children are corrected even through their sin in the sanctification process.
  • Ronald Whittemore - In Reply - 1 day ago
    Hey Sonofman1973,

    As S Spencer said, this is an interesting question, just some last thoughts and whether or not we have enough Scripture to know the complete answer. Scripture is relatively silent about the eternal past, even in the New Testament, where the clearest and fullest light of God's revelation shines. Very few passages reach backward in their scope further than the foundation of the world at the beginning of the ages of our time. God's plan was before the foundation of this earth was laid.

    God is light and there is no darkness in Him at all, 1 John 1:5, and we know from Job 38 that the angels and the principalities and powers in heaven were created before Genesis 1. A thought, God created darkness as a place to put the earth outside of the third heaven, the earth was without form and void, this would be empty of all life and covered in surging water of chaos enclosed in total darkness that God's Spirit moved upon and God said let there be light, God called light out of darkness His light moved into the space of darkness.

    God called out of this darkness everything there is below the third heaven and the time we live in. My understanding is different on Lucifer in Isaiah 14, and something happened between Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2 but that may be for other discussions.

    Thank you for these questions, they inspire study.

    God bless,

    RLW
  • S Spencer - In Reply - 2 days ago
    Hi Sonofman.

    That's a very interesting question! "What came first? Light or darkness?"

    I believe when God created the heavens and the earth he also created "Time" and from our point of view that started with darkness. (And the evening and the morning were the first day.)

    However, there is more to it when considering what they represent spiritually.

    We can gather references out of John 1.

    I haven't gave much thought or study on this but I believe "spiritually or otherwise" one cannot exist without the other.

    Genesis 1:2-4 it reads, "And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

    And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.

    Here I don't believe darkness and light "being created" is not in these verses but their existence is present. (God spoke and "brought in the Light." and darkness as well already existed. "Again, this is from our point of view and the beginning of time.

    However Spiritually, Psalms 139:10-12 may give us a glimpse of what it's like from God's point of view and spiritually.

    "Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me. If I say, Surely the darkness shall cover me; even the night shall be light about me. Yea, the darkness hideth not from thee; but the night shineth as the day: the darkness and the light are both alike to thee.

    Also. Genesis 1:2 can read "And the earth (Became) without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep.

    I'm interested in your full take.

    Thanks and God bless.
  • Momsage - 1 week ago
    Revelations 21: 22-27

    22) And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it. 23) And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof. 24)And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it. 25) And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there. 26) And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it. 27) And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh it a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

    Revelations: 22: 1-7:

    1) And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb. 2) in the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations. 3) And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him: 4) And they shall see His face; and his name shall be in their foreheads. 5) And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God give the them light: and they shall reign for ever and ever. 6) And he said unto me, "These sayings are faithful and true: and the Lord God of the holy prophets sent his angel to shew unto his servants the things which must shortly be done.

    (verse 7 is in red) "Behold I come quickly: blessed is he that keepeth the sayings of the prophecy of this book.
  • Richard H Priday - 1 week ago
    Whole counsel of God: Reading the Bible and prayer

    There is the old saying "you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink." The same principle exists with the Word of God. Psalm 119 for instance is the longest chapter in all of scripture and incessantly talks about loving God's law. Hungering and thirsting for the Word is something said to characterize the last days ( Amos 8:11-12). This verse talks of a famine for God's word; but we also see Jesus talking about "hungering and thirsting for righteousness ( Matthew 5:6).

    It seems counterintuitive or a "no brainer" to consider reading scripture and prayer as something a believer should do; but it has been my experience the enemy will use all sorts of tactics to dissuade believers from focusing on the Word and probably even more so on prayer. It is easy for the enemy to allow us with minimum distractions to read the Word of God because we can easily go into our own error in making it merely an intellectual exercise or feed off it to divert to the latest conspiracy theory or politics or whatever is trending. Prayer of course has it's own ways that it can deviate from scriptural standards; but from my experience it is the lack of prayer that seems to be a common denominator in many congregations. Yes; someone can try to use prayer as a means of spreading gossip or trying to get attention. It seems that too often there is a planned schedule for prayer and it is almost unheard of for it to extend any length of time beyond that planned timeslot even when nothing is pressing. Just to find one or two people who have an urge to pray before a service or for others when needs are expressed and can do it "on the fly" in my mind can literally mean the life or death of a local congregation. If we can't be as a weapon of warfare prepared at all times then we simply will in one way or another be compromised and heading for defeat in having any real impact on individuals or a local community.
  • Richard H Priday - 1 week ago
    Whole Counsel of God: Baptism

    I was in a very odd situation with a former OPC church I attended where I was granted a sort of "partial" membership without ascribing to their stance on infant baptism. There are a couple other issues which would keep me out of a similar place in the future (that church shut down 6 or 7 years ago due to lack of attendance). I will say that it wasn't required that I believed in their stance on Postmillenialism; although I may have mentioned here in the past when it was brought up how foolish it was to believe in the Antichrist and Mark of the Beast in one of their sermons and I took them up on that they sort of backed down. It wasn't a requirement to adhere to their eschatology, although it was a rather cliquish sort of mentality at that place. I agreed to disagree with them without such banter so I thought it only fair; however of course it was their belief.

    In any case; infant baptism has cast a rather nebulous picture in my mind as to explanations; somehow holding what children or infants were commemorated with when they become adults and rebel as if they had some sort of inherent partaking of a covenant; I suppose equivalent to the Israelites who were "baptized" by crossing the Red Sea. ( 1 Cor. 10:2). No one I know actually thinks someone is saved through infant baptism but nonetheless they seem in my mind to have carried on a Catholic tradition through the Reformers in the past. I also had a "rebaptism"; having argued beforehand the sprinkling of water should also be legitimate ( Ezekiel 36:25). In my case I had it done that way along with my wife at the time because she had a balance issue going totally underwater; but I rededicated myself to a commitment as a church member when I had an immersion at the founding of a church I used to attend at its inception almost 10 years ago. Seeing how quickly Philip baptized the eunuch in Acts 8; and the jailor with his family ( Acts 16:33) it should follow salvation quickly.
  • Ronald Whittemore - In Reply - 1 week ago
    Hi Bennymkje,

    I know you are an author and your vocabulary is greater than mine I will try to respond but to be truthful you are hard to follow. First MOU my understanding is a nonbinding agreement between parties stating their intentions. How can that be a covenant a covenant is a relationship between partners either conditional or unconditional and this covenant is between God the Father and God the Son. Would not the Holy Spirit be a part of this covenant and the will of God that the Son completes? John 6:38 It is God's will not Jesus's like He said in Luke 22:42.

    If God is a triune God, would it not be the will of all three with no difference in authority or knowledge? Why the need for a covenant between them since all three are God and all three are equal?

    At the beginning of each day, God said what was to be, the spoken word of God, and it was so. Other than speculation how can we say the Son was in agreement? Isaiah 45:18 In Genesis 1:28 would be an unconditional covenant, more of a blessing, God placed man above all that was created on earth and man was given dominion over it. God delegated the rule of man over His creation and no consequences were stated, we see how that turned out.

    I agree Jesus did not need to be water baptized for remittance of sin, but He did need the anointing of the Holy Ghost/Spirit to become the Messiah/Christ. The word of God was in Jesus and by the Holy Ghost/Spirit Jesus did the works of His Father therefore Jesus was the tabernacle of God, the image of God for every word Jesus said was not His but the word of God the Father. John 4:34 John 5:30 John 12:44-45

    Philip was the first to bring the gospel to the Samaritans.

    I hope you can make sense of this.

    God bless,

    RLW
  • Bennymkje - In Reply - 1 week ago
    Hi Ronald

    " Genesis 1:26 many apply the Trinity to this verse but then we must ignore verse 27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. This could also easily be first-person plural." No it is not. "

    I, God changeth not"(Mal.3:6) Neither does He give his glory to another. Ge.1: 27 says " So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them." Ge. 1 refers to the MOU or the everlasting covenant between God the Father and God the Son. Thus the Will of God in v.26 and the Son completes it. "It was so" at the end of each day is as though the Son in agreement.(v.7)

    The v.28 God blesses them (man). The covenant is between God and Man. In primary sense it is man say Adam. In secondary sense it is set down by the Holy Ghost in terms of God as Being as well as in terms Christ and the Church.

    As Being what is God? He is one. ("Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord"-De.6:4) Jesus Christ as the visible image of the invisible God is both glory as well as body in Trinity. The Father Son and Holy Spirit are not considered separate entities but manifestations of the same Being. The Son of man expresses the Word become flesh. Similarly the Word was God. The same Spirit but expressed as separate. Jesus did not require baptism by water but in obedience to the Word and in human likeness he undertook so in all things he was as human as you and me.

    When we say that the scriptures must be fulfilled Jesus in his humanity met the criteria. The third office in Trinity serves by bringing events, persons connect according to the divine Will. He therefore brought Evangelist Philip to meet the Ethiopian. The entire scripture is organized on a reconstituted time.
  • Giannis - In Reply - 1 week ago
    Richard, 2/2

    A good example is likening God to a tap of water. We drink as much as we wish. We turn the tap as much as we want, The tap is there, the water is there, but we drink as much as we turn that tap. The more we turn it the more we drink. It is up to us. God is always there. As simple as that.

    About the kids brother, the problem with kids nowadays is not only a matter of overprotectiveness and lack of punishment. I think it is mainly of what people teach to their children. On top of that nowadays kids get their standards in life, not from the family, or the church and the Word of God, but mostly from the internet. Often from the rich and famous, the celebrities, who usually are drug or alcohol addicts, violent (don't you see how the gangsters are heroized on TV?) with broken families where fornication and adultery are the usual thing. Sex and violence is what the Kkids eat nowadays. As there is no censorship on the net, kids see and learn all sort of weird things there and then spread them to others.

    And as there are no borders nowadays the sin is propagating from one country to another very easily. Sin is like a virus, a spiritual covid, that goes from a place to another easily if there is nothing to stop it. And nowadays there is nothing to stop it. It is written that the people of the end times will be the worst of all times. And we see that in our countries, don't we?

    Wel,l maybe I say the same thing as you do but with different words. GBU
  • Bennymkje - 2 weeks ago
    Matt.27 Ungodly world

    We have in this chapter a few dilemmas created by wicked men.

    1.Dilemma of 'other man's riches'

    v.5 " And he cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself." Judas realized all too late his actions were irrevocable. Thirty pieces of silver did not help him to clear his name or conscience. Money was other man's riches so the chief priests hired him to do a job would not want to touch it; the enormity of guilt over betrayal of an innocent man's blood, no money could handle. Satan is the designated 'other man' since value of thirty pieces of silver has also changed. Who shall price an abstract thing as conscience? Chief priests whose piety was in observing traditions of their fathers set a price accordingly as 'unclean'. "And the chief priests took the silver pieces, and said, It is not lawful for to put them into the treasury, because it is the price of blood." Instead bought the land thereby fulfilling the scriptures. "Then was fulfilled that which was spoken by Jeremy the prophet."

    2 Dilemma of duty imposed by ungodly man.

    Pontius Pilate despite of honor and authority was a pawn or a loser. " For he knew that for envy they had delivered him." He was a clever and worldly wise to have risen the ranks of a brutal regime, where dog eats dog principle prevailed. Envy killed you as well as slip of the tongue cast you down at any moment. He saw through the hypocrisy of the religion. He believed that Jesus was innocent. All he could do was wash his hands. "When Pilate saw that he could prevail nothing, but that rather a tumult was made, he took water, and washed his hands before the multitude, saying, I am innocent of the blood of this just person: see ye to it."(v.24). If life was as simple as that but Judas realized it was not. He as well as Pilate were accountable to a Just God who could cast their soul to death and hell. Man in honor abides not.(Ps.49:20)
  • Bennymkje - 2 weeks ago
    Matt.26:36-45 "flesh v.spirit" (2 of 2)

    Heart of a man who neglects his heart can be a treacherous place. He is a sluggard and void of understanding who quenches the Holy Spirit freely given from above. Instead of a well watered garden,"And, lo, it was all grown over with thorns, and nettles had covered the face thereof, and the stone wall thereof was broken down."(Pr.24:31)

    Jesus in his passion told his disciples to watch with him. "And he took with him Peter and the two sons of Zebedee, and began to be sorrowful and very heavy./ Then saith he unto them, My soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death: tarry ye here, and watch with me."(26:36-39). We see the same conflict of the flesh with the spirit. "O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt." The pain principle makes the flesh cry out,"Spare me from this pain" but the Spirit of Christ ever watchful to the Word and its fulfillment would want to submit. It was a crisis to which the disciples were not not well tuned to. In lab tests if an electrode is introduced an amoeba want to avoid pain. Flesh and spirit of man similarly seeks pleasure and takes the line of least resistance. It is thus the way to hell is paved.

    "Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:/Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it."(7:13-14)
  • Bennymkje - 2 weeks ago
    Matt.26:36-45 "Flesh v. spirit" (1 of 2)

    "Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak." The spirit that Jesus speaks here is of the spirit of man which St Paul finds as an essential tool, and he asks,"For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God."(1 Co.2:11) St Peter's flash of brilliance by fits and starts brought Jesus to commend him on one occasion, "Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God./And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven."(16:16-17). When God breathed into the nostrils of man he made him a living soul and thereby he opened a way for the Spirit to work with Him. The Spirit of Christ for instance moved holy men of old to seek the path of righteousness. Jesus refers to it as 'dry places' so when an unclean spirit prompted Peter to speak a little later on it raised his master's ire. "Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee./But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men."(16:22-23). Peter was capable of savouring things that be of man' equally as that of God. Jesus spoke a Parable, let me quote, "When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places,"(12:43-45) is where the prince of the power of the air can move about. But the heart of a child of God is qualified as Isaiah says,"And the LORD shall guide thee continually, and satisfy thy soul in drought, and make fat thy bones: and thou shalt be like a watered garden, and like a spring of water, whose waters fail not."(Is.58:11)
  • Bennymkje - 2 weeks ago
    Matt.25:41 "everlasting fire"

    Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels."

    Now we may identify what does right and left hand of the most High indicate. We covered the throne of the Lamb in terms of the Throne of God. (Re.22:1). The Son of man who sits on his throne of glory has holy angels in his attendance. Separation of light from darkness according to the everlasting covenant now is set. Holy angels signify everlasting life while the devil and his angels are earmarked for everlasting fire. This fire we came across first in the night vision of Daniel which is needless to say denotes the Alpha aspect where the same Father figure is repeated in the inaugural vision of St John. "And his voice as the sound of many waters." (Re.1:15)

    Waters in the Omega aspect of his voice is the Word sent forth before the beginning.(Is.55:11). The throne of God upon the floods inform us who is in control. "The voice of the Lord divideth the flames of fire." (Ps.29:7,10)

    Separation of Water and of fire is pendent on this verse. "the judgment was set, and the books were opened." Daniel describes the throne, "his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire." Similar device as a water wheel so it sends fire streaming, " A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him."(Dan.7:9-10)

    Ge.1:7 gives us separation of waters. One signifies the Father of all mercies while the waters below becomes a byword for wicked nations. (Is.57:20) Sin has muddied the mercies of God that speaks of the earth. Meanwhile waters above heaven ,runs along and we see it coursing through the middle of the Throne of God and of the Lamb. (Re.22:1-3). This stream marks time. Fire everlasting likewise from the throne covers a period of time. The lake of fire is an indication of God's judgment. "These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone."(Re.19:20)
  • Bennymkje - 3 weeks ago
    Matt.23:13-22 Hypocrisy

    v.13 "For ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in." Scribes and Pharisees cause others to stumble to which Jesus had commented on another occasion, "But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea."(18:6)

    v.14 " hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer." Hypocrisy of Pharisees is to sound holier -than- thou while they hear only the sound of money coming in.

    v.15 "for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves." Church planting is well and good. After big fanfare and cheers who shall water them daily and attend to their growth do get lost. St Paul faulted churches in Corinth and ensewhere on their partisan spirit. Heresies find a fertile ground in this spirit of contention.

    vv.16-18 :Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold?" Wherever the vitality of the doctrine of God is glossed over from Christ to the tradition of man it becomes idolatry. In the age of televangelists it is what celebrities thrive upon. The disciple pointed at the temple in admiration "And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down."(24:2). Glory of what is seen is temporal and shall fade off. Without taking two worlds of the Spirit and of the body as one and our everlasting life is assured on jour Redeemer Lord what we witness about us is hypocrisy. The Pharisees and scribes were content with praise of men and God swept them off as filth from the face of the earth.
  • Bennymkje - 4 weeks ago
    Matt.21:42-46 "Fall of Babylon"

    In the Book of Genesis God separated the waters above from water below (Ge.1:6-7)which is a signal for the rise and fall of nations,- and the vision of Daniel on the banks of Ulai in Dan.12 gives us a river of time so history of these are set, and it leads us to the throne of God and of the Lamb and beyond to the saved nations on the earth.

    According to the Abstract First day set two nations of light and darkness. Second day provided us the heaven a label for the world of the Spirit. God blessing Abraham (12:3) sends him along and his looking for a city was spiritual insight so faith explains what Abraham deprived of the Promised Land because of the sin of Amorites, could still thrive despite of it. " For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God."(He.11:10). It is thus we consider the cloud of witnesses which validates heroes of faith as the double for the Son.

    The fall of Babylon described in St John's vision explains the fate of Jerusalem and the nations which rejected the Son. "And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder./ And when the chief priests and Pharisees had heard his parables, they perceived that he spake of them."(v.45). Specific to the nation of Israel we have this verse, "And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus:"(Re.17:6; Matt.23:35-36)

    vv.14-18 "These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful." In their opposition to God they are as one and yet Jerusalem shall be destroyed by the Gentiles. Re.18:21 the "stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all."(18:21)
  • Bennymkje - 4 weeks ago
    Matt.21: 33-46 "Parable of the Wicked Tenants"

    "He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons." (v.41)

    The vineyard is Jerusalem. It is set on a fruitful hill. Isaiah's Song of the Vineyard (5:1-7) gives us the key. "For the vineyard of the Lord of hosts is the house of Israel, and the men of Judah his pleasant plant: and he looked for judgment, but behold oppression; for righteousness, but behold a cry." Prophet Zechariah refers to Jerusalem which is elevated not by natural causes but the day of the Lord calls for their destruction and it is to be let out to other husbandmen. In one level the song "Now will I sing to my well-beloved a song of my beloved touching his vineyard" is about the everlasting covenant and it is this elevated ground called New Jerusalem we are concerned about.

    In the previous post we considered the pure water of life with the tree of life on either side of it, and it is how we track house of Israel on a fruitful has its double in the world of the Spirit. Thus the night vision of Daniel shows one like the Son of man is' the well beloved' in the Song of Isaiah. The river coursing through the middle of throne gives the river of time with worlds of the body and of th Spirit carrying the destinies of nations. This key shall explain the last chapter of the Book of Zechariah as well.

    "In that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea." This living waters refer the pure water of life in St John's vision.(Ze.14:8-10)

    There shall be no more sea (21:1) The waters are for the saved nations. "And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely."(Re.22;17)
  • Bennymkje - 4 weeks ago
    Matt.21:43-46 "Nations"

    "Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof./ And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder./ And when the chief priests and Pharisees had heard his parables, they perceived that he spake of them."

    'A nation bringing forth fruits' is not any specific nation but children of light collectively called a nation, and its hallmark is determined by fruits. "Either make the tree good, and his fruit good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit."(12:33). Do we see any nation producing fruits that may be called as good?

    Re.21:23 presents us nations walking under the holy city which is set up in mid-air so 12 foundation mentioned earlier gives us a rainbow as token of the everlasting covenant renewed between God and Noah, "for perpetual generations"(Ge.9:17).This is the sign now established by their own merits to which Jesus and his disciples serve for signs and wonders.(Is.8:18). Zion is above and not on the earth. Only those whose names 'are written in the Lamb's book of life,'(21:28) shall have access to it.

    "And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: and the Lamb is the light thereof".

    However the pure water of life cannot be hanging in the midair but serves a purpose. There shall be no more curse but healing of nations would require the tree of life. "And on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations".(Re.22:1-3)

    "And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain."(Ze.14:17) Gates to New Jerusalem are open (21:25)
  • Bennymkje - 1 month ago
    Re.11:7 "The beast" (1 of 2)

    "The beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them."

    First point to note is that the beast is a composite figure as the two witnesses represent the saints to whom Jesus Christ gave power according to the promise of God, and are called and blessed in his Son.. "The Lord shall send the rod of thy strength out of Zion: rule thou in the midst of thine enemies."(Ps.110:2) These enemies on the earth are caused by 'the war in heaven.'(Re.12:7). And the consequence of it we read in v.12. "Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time."

    This short time is clearly set by the Spirit even as the earthly ministry of Jesus and of the two witnesses. 42 is a number designated by God so the time of the Gentiles or heathen is likewise determined. John was sent as a messenger who was killed by the sword. Herod Antipas, it must be stressed was a vassal king to Caligula as another Herod, Herod Agrippa would have James killed. One killed because of his oath and the other killed James because he wanted to please the crowd. in whichever case the beast is associated with qualities totally antithetical to Jesus. The beast rising out of the sea (Re.13:1) is from below the earth as Jesus is from heaven. He is the king," The Lord sitteth upon the flood."(Ps.29:10) What is the characteristic of the sea? The beast represent the wicked," But the wicked are like the troubled sea, when it cannot rest, whose waters cast up mire and dirt."(Is.57:20). While we have the likes of Herod whose power is derived from some one else as enemies to Christ, the two witnesses represent an angel a man so the golden reed is their measurement and signify the everlasting gospel entrusted to them. Herod also gave rise to a political movement in the days of Jesus. (Matt.22:15-16)
  • Bennymkje - 1 month ago
    Re.11:4-7 "The two witnesses" (2 of 2)

    The '1260 days' is a tag supplied the Spirit to indicate the earthly ministry of Jesus Christ. By the same token the Gentiles are allowed to operate for 42 months. The 42 months' similarly is a tag. In an earlier post we saw 'the hour" during which the power of darkness prevailing over the children of disobedience. ( Luke 22:53). The beast as well as the enemies to Jesus who took him in the night belonged to the son of perdition. Judas Iscariot belonged to this group. This conflict reveals two laws, of the Spirit and of the sin.

    Let us look at the characteristics of the two witnesses. They are representatives of several prophets coming under the earthly ministry of Jesus who is the fulfillment of the law. They were "clothed in sackcloth'. It echoes the mourning of Daniel for three weeks,"(Dan.10:2-3)

    "And have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will." This recalls to us the seven plagues of Egypt" and of Elijah, "These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy." In short these two witnesses present a composite picture of heroes of faith(He.11:33-38)

    On the flip side the number 42 months gives the beast who is a composite figure. John the Baptist was beheaded under a Herod and we have the beast in the Acts of the Apostles, "Herod the king stretched forth his hands to vex certain of the church./And he killed James the brother of John with the sword./And because he saw it pleased the Jews, he proceeded further to take Peter also."(Ac.12:1-3)

    Finally " Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein." This temple is not anything extant but what was founded on Zion. (1s.28:16) We see its culmination in Re.21.22-23

    And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it./... for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof."
  • Bennymkje - 1 month ago
    Matt.18:13 "Lost and Found" (2 of 2)

    Holiness of God is a name, glory of which is invested in his testimony which is the glorious gospel entrusted to his Son. So when He sent his only begotten Son what is the Will of God? " Even so it is not the will of your Father which is in heaven, that one of these little ones should perish." His concern is for the glory of everlasting life that the one sheep carries. God so loved the world is to bring the glory of the cloud of witnesses match exactly with those who are in the world of the body.

    "I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word."( John 17:6)

    "That they may be one" is what the ministry of reconciliation yet remaining. "And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them./And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are".(vv.10-11).And when Jesus Christ says,"It is done" it is a signal that way to the tree of life is found. "And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb./In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life."(Re.22:1-2)
  • Bennymkje - In Reply - 1 month ago
    Who are these two witnesses?

    In the wilderness the Israelites were led by pillar of cloud and of fire. They represent the two witnesses in Re.11. Baptism of water and of fire: one is John and the other 'an angel' the little one could be any saint, representing the world of the body prepared for the Son.
  • Bennymkje - 1 month ago
    Matt.17:1-5 "The bright cloud" (1 of 2)

    "While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him."

    On the seventh day with which we have Jesus transfiguring before his disciple the curtain falls on the first event. The Spirit is isolating the glory of blessings of man in his Son. So God blesses the seventh day. (Ge.2:3) Here the bright cloud serves a vital function: God the Father is ratifying the Abstract and the cloud is not simply a cloud but the glory of saints in the world of the Spirit. These are the cloud of witnesses we read in He.12:1 .

    Gospel of St Matthew or any other Gospel is not to be confused with the style of narrative we are accustomed in secular literature. Evangelist Matthew is not relaying on what happens in Malachi to carry the narrative forward any more than John who is referring to 'In the beginning' to thicken the plot of Luke to keep the interest of the reader unflagging. 'The Word was God' needs to be heard. God the Father is testifying as with the bright cloud of the glory awaiting His children in his Son. This is how we approach the phrase,"After six days' in v.1.

    The cloud serves as a witness. Ps.19:1 has its flip side. Mercy of God makes a way which declares the glory of God and it flows from above the firmament. "Notwithstanding, lest we should offend them, go thou to the sea, and cast an hook, and take up the fish that first cometh up; and when thou hast opened his mouth, thou shalt find a piece of money: that take, and give unto them for me and thee."(17:27)The truth of Lam.3:22-23 owes to the waters above. It is of the Lord's mercies we are not consumed. So this fish was prepared as God had prepared one for Prophet Jonah. Water serves as witness. "Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof."(Matt.6:34)
  • Richard H Priday - 1 month ago
    Further insight on idol worship and witnessing.

    In my last post; I discussed the concern over graven images in Catholicism; but in reality this is evident in Greek and Russian Orthodox and many other denominations as well. A key factor here is to consider that all which is worthy in regard to any true saint of God is Christ Himself who has taken up residence. This does tie into an individual soul and spirit submissive to that authority and rewarded for faithfulness accordingly; but we cannot adequately represent that either. Going beyond saints who are in scripture or designated by man we have those who keep images; whether pictoral or sculptural of deceased loved ones; whether professing believers in life or not. Those who are not have no chance whatsoever of bringing the true God into the equation when we focus on remembering their lives or "sensing their presence." That at best is our imagination; and oftentimes are demons who trigger these memories and try to control us. I have not found it beneficial or edifying to always bombard people who have such keepsakes but don't think much about it but nonetheless the danger is very real. And objects that are directly correlating to demon gods or goddesses of course are going to invite evil to fill a household with all the curses inherent with such things. Getting into an exhaustive list of all these items is beyond the scope of this post; but this would include anything with "supernatural powers" such as scapulars; holy water; images; etc.

    In witnessing; therefore we must be attentive in particular to cultures from Eastern religions that have these sorts of things tied in with family possessions. This of course involves those who practice polytheism in this countryu and ranges from seemingly innocuous items with New Age mystics to overtly Satanic items actually used in rituals.

    In the next post I will discuss the idols of this culture as to media magnates; rock stars and entertainers.
  • Richard H Priday - 1 month ago
    Idolatry: Exodus 20:4-5 state:

    4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.

    5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;

    Recently; there was an issue in regard to an artist that I have befriended in my local church. It seems another brother agrees with me; that images representing Christ or anything in the Godhead are included with any created item when it comes to worship. We cannot adequately represent a depiction of an omnipotent; omnipresent and omniscient God. Even if it doesn't cause us to worship it; we shouldn't tempt others who may be from backgrounds or denominations where such imagery is worshipped.

    Much of this type of logic is attempted to be justified in Catholicism; where we see images of Mary who according to their own theologians is supposed to be honored rather than worshipped. "How We Honor Jesus Through Mary" by Dave Armstrong written July 1 2015 states: " St. Louis Marie de Montfort, one of the giants in the history of Marian devotion, wrote: "We never give more honor to Jesus than when we honor his Mother, and we honor her simply and solely to honor him all the more perfectly. We go to her only as a way leading to the goal we seek-Jesus, her Son."" Such is the logic of the author Carl Keating a leading Catholic apologist. In practice though we see people worshipping the images of the Virgin Mary and those indoctrinated in that believe in her perpetual virginity and that she was sinless; which is not recorded in scripture. In fact we see scriptures of Christ's brothers and sisters mentioned (see Mtthew 13:56; and John 7). Perhaps a depiction of a saint isn't an issue for us but we also shouldn't cause another to sin because of it
  • Bennymkje - 1 month ago
    Ze.13:7-9 "Shepherd and the little ones" (2 of 2)

    Day decreed for the Son has two divisions: unto this day and that day. "This is your hour" concerning Israel has similarly two divisions namely the power of darkness referred to the first part and "a fountain opened to the house of David and to the inhabitants of Jerusalem for sin and for uncleanness" shall be marked by the appearance of the Son of man. " Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen"(Re.1:7) It opens the eyes of all left behind. This passage refers to the same hour, "And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,/Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters./And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen,"(Re.14:5-7) The name Babylon Jerusalem Sodom and Egypt are interchangeable.

    Ze.13:8-9 refers to one third a remnant. The command number Three refers to the Son. "And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The Lord is my God." This is incomplete without mentioning thsi: "And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour."(Re.8:1)*

    "And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath."(Re.16"19)

    * Half an hour refers to the left behind church stepping into the breach.Re.7:3-8, 14) the remnant
  • Oseas - In Reply - 1 month ago
    Bennymkje

    The Holy Spirit-the God of the earth-Re.11:4-take a look,he does not confound himself with what He Himself speaks and writes, with the things the spirit that is in man also speaks and writes, according the spirit of man that is in him,it means, in the mind or heart of man.Heb.4:12-13 reveal how he discerns thoughts and intents of the heart(of man). What does the Word of GOD say? John 3:31-34:

    31 He that come from above is above all(the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Truth sent by JESUS who proceede from the Father- John 15:26 combined with John 16:12-15.Take a look):he that is of the earth is earthly,and speaks of the earth.He that comes from heaven is above all.

    32And what he has seen and heard,that(only that)he testifieth; and no man receiveth his testimony.

    33He that hath received his testimony hath set to his seal that GOD is true.

    34For he whom GOD has sent speaks the words of GOD:for GOD gives not the Spirit by measure unto him.

    That said,who will believe in the messenger sent here by JESUS from the part of the Father-Joo 15:26-, to announce the everlasting gospel,unto them that dwell on the earth,and to every nation,and kindred,and tongue,and people?(Re.14:6 combined with Re.11:15-18,and 1Thes.4:16,and Daniel 12:1-3,and Luke 18:8, and 21:24,and Re.11:2.Take a look)

    What is the message of the everlasting Gospel?The angel MUST walks in the midst of heaven(heaven?Eph.1:3-8),having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation,and kindred,and tongue,and people,SAYING: Re.14:7, with a loud voice,Fear GOD,and give glory to Him;for the hour of His Judgment is come(the righteous Judgment of GOD, the Judgment Seat of of Christ):and saying:worship Him that made heaven(next heaven, the 3rd- Luke 20:35-36),and earth(Israel-the true Israelites saved and sealed-Re.7:1-8:),and the sea(Gentile nations-peoples,and nations,and multitudes of all tongues)and the fountains of waters(the Holy Scriptures- John 7:38.Take a look.
  • Bennymkje - 1 month ago
    Ps.23:3-4 "Abiding in Christ" (2 of 2)

    Fulness of Christ does not restrict his glory to one aspect of human existence. "Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him."(Ro.6:9)Both worlds of the Spirit and of the body consist of this completeness."And by him all things consist."(Col.1:16-17) So writer to the Hebrews refer to where the Good Shepherd is leading us to. "Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:/Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they."(He.1:3-4)

    Those who deny the works that Jesus Christ from the right hand of the Majesty on high are leaving for the false shepherds license to muddle the still waters of Shiloah, which is very much how the enemy would want it to be understood.

    "he leadeth me in the paths of righteousness for his name's sake." Holding truth in unrighteousness, those who have begun well have shown to be liars. "Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?"(Gal.3:3) Another place we read, "For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ: whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things."(Ph.3:18-19). Look at all the culture wars who stoke them but Satan?

    "But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption."

    Psalm 23 as with Ps.2 are to be studied from both worlds holding together in his Son. Here we see him as the Good Shepher while Psalm 2 Jesus Christ as the king of kings.
  • Bennymkje - 1 month ago
    Psalm 23 "I shall not want"

    "The Lord is my shepherd; I shall not want".

    Gospel of John explains why. "And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace." (1:16) St Paul has this to say,"For who maketh thee to differ from another? and what hast thou that thou didst not receive? now if thou didst receive it, why dost thou glory, as if thou hadst not received it?"(1 Co.4:7)God having foreknown us in his Son has also blessed so it is from both worlds of the Spirit and body. Faith is one so we speak trusting fully that all that is needful for our life and godliness has been met in our abiding life. He is the Good Shepherd and we are his flock.

    "He maketh me to lie down in green pastures: he leadeth me beside the still waters".

    St John writes,"I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture."(10:9)

    Still waters of Shiloah that goeth softly is how God of all Mercies has blessed the land to which the Spirit sets a heavenly pattern,-"There isa river, the streams whereof shall make glad the city of God, the holyplaceof the tabernacles of the most High."(Ps.46:4). Jesus as the Good Shepherd knows his sheep since it is his Father has put them under his care. "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:"(10:27). In following his path bearing our cross daily this pasture is in the now. Our physical bodies may be aching and we may be experiencing bereavement, ill health and calumny from the world but his grace does wonders as St Paul experienced when caught up to the third heavens and this unspeakable glory of Jesus as the restorer of our souls. St Paul's malady is ours too. The enemy is at the gates while our weak bodies are most vulnerable but what is our 'pick-me-up? "My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness."(2 Co.12:2,9)

    "He restoreth my soul: he leadeth me in the paths of righteousness for his name's sake."
  • Bennymkje - 1 month ago
    Re.3:20-21 "Knock" (1 of 2)

    The knock mentioned here is different from this verse."Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:"(Matt.7-8) Jesus here mentions the door to salvation. " and to him that knocketh it shall be opened." The next verse sets this in context. "Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone?" Jesus is referring to his Father who is in heaven while what Jesus refers in the key verse is the door to the heart of a believer who is saved but is yet to be counted as an overcomer.

    The Lord is my shepherd (Ps.23:1) In the Gospel of John we see the same idea put in context of the Father Son relationship. Jesus as the Word become flesh is the Good Shepherd so when he claimed, "I am the way" it explains why his Father sent him to the world. "But he that entereth in by the door is the shepherd of the sheep."( John 10:2). So his authority is as that of the legitimate, the only one whose actions are taken in truth."I am the truth" explains this aspect As the faithful witness and true he promises to all seven churches, where he stands. He demands his rightful place in their heart, a spiritual space, representing the face upon which the Spirit moved before the commencement of the creation. "And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.(Ge.1:2b)

    "if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me." (3:20)

    In the Matthew quote, salvation dealt with ask, seek and knock. The door accordingly opened a straight and narrow path for the seeker to find his pasture. Here Jesus Christ in his majesty offers a supper set in an intimate one to one basis."I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture." This pasture is doing the will of God so meat and drink refers a life in heavenly places. "My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to finish his work."
  • Oseas - In Reply - 1 month ago
    Dear Chris, thank you for your kind replay.

    This discussion started for myself when Adam quoted Isaiah 12:1-2, and appeared the pseudo name of Jehovah, which was inadvertently added into the translation from the original source.

    Comparing what Adam quoted from Isaiah 12:1-2 in the translations of Scriptures, with the Complete Jewish Bible, here's the difference:

    Adam quoted: Is.12:1-2:

    1- And in that day thou shalt say, O Lord, I will praise thee: though thou wast angry with me, thine anger is turned away, and thou comfortedst me.

    2 Behold, God is my salvation; I will trust, and not be afraid: for the Lord JEHOVAH is my strength and my song; he also is become my salvation.

    From Complete Jewish Bible-Is.12:1-2: (Comparison-see the difference)

    1And you shall say on that day,"I will thank You,O Lord,for You were wroth with me;may Your wrath turn away and may You comfort me.

    2Here is the GOD of my salvation,"I shall trust and not fear;for the strength and praise of the Eternal the Lord was my salvation."

    So, Isaiah didn't cited the name of Devil when he preached the message to the people of Israel.Isaiah had the Spirit of Christ, understand?He was a messianic prophet,you know of this.By the way,JESUS still was in the bosom of the Father- John 1:18

    You said I should supply my references that you may research this too,I agree,but I did not still do this because the site doesn't accept to post links.My assertions were based from a source called chabad,try to find it: It's Tanakh, the Hebrew Bible, Ketuvin(Scriptures).

    As you said, it certainly is a serious matter if both Jews and Christians(then and now)are reading corrupt copies of the original.

    Between both Scriptures above quoted,which of them is approved by the Holy Spirit?Only one is true,and approved by the Spirit of Truth.In my vision is the original source,but I'm referring strictly to this portion of Scriptures- Isaiah 12:1-2.

    Therefore with joy shall we draw water out of the wells of salvation.


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