Bible Discussion Thread

Geneis 2:16: And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:



Note, the Tree of Life is in the garden, and man may freely eat thereof.





GENESIS 2:17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.



Thus, the Lord told ADAM he may not eat of the fruit of the tree of knowledge, and in my understanding on that day ADAM would seal his fate with death. But, this was prior to the birth of Eve. The Tree of Life was not forbidden, and also in the Garden. If there were something preventing Adam from eating of that tree, it is not stated, at least at this point. Therefore it is up to individuals to speculate as to the reasons why Adam may not have eaten of the tree of life.





GENESIS 2:23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.





GENESIS 2:24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.





Perhaps, as Adam and Eve are "one", the rules of the Fruit of the tree of knowledge also apply to Eve. For the sake of my view, let us assume that Eve is also bound by the rule applied to Adam prior to her creation.



Genesis 3:3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.



Importantly, while the only record of God's statement comes prior to God's assertation, Eve is aware of it and feels it applies to her as well.

Man is the head of the woman or wife as God is the head of the man .

Only God is incorruptible . Therefore anything that God created being not God is or can be corrupted .

Man was not created corrupted nor was it Gods will that man be corrupted ( and die) For it is written " Man shall not LIVE by bread alone but by every word that proceedeth from the mouth of God "

The Word of God to Adam was " of all the trees in the garden you may freely eat "

This then included the tree of life .

But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil thou shalt surely die for in the day you eat of you shall surely die "

Thus God revealed HIS will for man that he should live and not die .

Moreover God also revealed that man was free to eat of the tree of life .

Thus God by that word that came forth from His mouth gave Adam His knowledge of what was good to eat and what was evil to eat .

It was the rejection of Gods word as to what is good and what is evil and believing the lie' thou shalt not surely d" that they died .

Man is still doing that which is right or good in his own eyes and in doing so is faced with its consequences .

God is not a tyrant . Nor indeed is He democratic .

But while He is not a tyrant nor democratic He does have His own imperatives .

You MUST be born again ,"not of corruptible seed but of the incorruptible seed which is the Word of God "

For by one man's disobedience all die .

Likewise by one man's obedience do all men live .

Thanks for your thoughts, Gerald. I'm trying to the way I read and think about Genesis to Genesis itself.

Regarding the tree of life:

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

I take from this that it was within Adam's power to eat of the tree of life at any time.

To prevent Adam from eating of the tree, God kicks Adam out of the garden for the express purpose of preventing him from eating from the tree of life:

Genesis 3:23 Therefore the LORD God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, . . .

This seems plain to me, that Adam could have eaten of the tree of life, but had not, and the LORD God decided to prevent him from being able to.

Would you agree Adam could have, but had not, and that the LORD decided to prevent him from eating of the tree?

Hi Dante.

You are right in saying God didn't command Adam not to eat of the tree of life, He commanded they couldn't eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil as mentioned here in Genesis 2:16-17.

"And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:

But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die."

But how do we know that they didn't eat of the tree of life BEFORE they disobeyed?

Here's all we have that is written.

Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, Behold, THE MAN IS BECOME AS ONE OF US, ((TO KNOW GOOD AND EVIL)): and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

Perhaps God forbidden them from eating of the tree of life AFTER their disobedience.

The results of their disobedience is that they knew they were naked and they tried to cover themselves. Now naked is also used throughout scripture to mean " Sin exposed" Here's one of several.

Revelation 16:15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.

These garments is the covering of the blood of Christ. "White robes"

Christ was ordained to come into the world before the world began, to be the sacrificial Lamb. For Adam too!

Scipture doesn't say Adam "BECAME" naked after he disobeyed.

Scripture says he KNEW he was naked after he disobeyed.

See here ;

Genesis 3:10-11 And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself.

And he said, WHO TOLD THEE THAT THOU WAST NAKED? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat?

I believe the issue is what would he do with that knowledge!

They tried to cover up their guilt and shame with the product of their own efforts. This may have been the first attempt at a works salvation.

Just my thoughts.

GB.

alex1939...Interesting Dante...Lemme give ya my slant on these 2 trees...One is the written word the bible the mana that is good for bread that we may eat all we want...As there a zillion Churches on every corner...But Jesus said your fathers ate of that bread from heaven and are all dead..This Tree of knowledge answers to the tree of Knowledge that New Covenant that cannot be eaten till the book is opened that Jesus wrote with his own blood...I will KNOW them ALL from the least to the greatest and their sins and iniquities will i remember no more..Thats the New Covenant that answers to Jeremiah 31 :34...That Book that he wrote with his own blood...As Isaiah said this KNOWLEGE IS GONNA COVER THE EARTH AS THE WATERS COVER THE SEAS...An intimacy with God that is gona result in the Children of the Kingdom...An thus a flood of his spirit which is the H.G. Our fruit unto God via that tree of Knowlege..Our new heart and new spirit...Thus no body cd eat of this tree of knowledge till Jesus shed his blood on calvary...Thats y he has to Know us a Spiritual knowledge...But we cd not partake of this knowledge that tree of Knowledge ETC

.....These 2 trees were in the midst of the Garden of God...But now under this New Covenant these 2 trees are planted in our hearts....As Jesus said the good ground is your hearts where that good seed will be sown...Thus under this NEW covenant the kingdom will be with in us...Which answers to that Tree of knowledge in the midst of our hearts that Garden of God...Thus we answer to Eve that is symbolic of the Church the bride...Bone of his bone and flesh of his flesh...And her Children are spirits the H.G. that is gona be as the stars of heaven in multitudes...as Jesus said...Unless ya receive the Kingdom of God as a lil Child you will in no wise enter there in..This tree of Knowledge is gona result in the Children of the Kingdom...As Jesus said the good seed are the Children of the Kingdom...Thus an Israel of God..From the Tree of Knowledge.

Thanks for your thoughts. I'm trying to limit myself to the words in Genesis, not as those clarified and/or modified in later texts.

From my reading of Genesis, there was nothing stated that prevented Adam or Eve from eating of the tree of life. That to me is an important point in my personal interpretation of Genesis.

Projecting, as I read Genesis, that Adam chose mortality to eternity without Eve is supported as an interpretation. It's an interpretation that has much meaning to me.

Hello Dante, I agree that Adam and Eve were free to eat of the tree of life, just as they were free to eat of any other tree in the garden, even the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. They opted to eat of the one tree forbidden to them instead of eating from the tree of life. I don't know it they knew that this tree would make them immortal or not. But they opted not to eat of it prior to eating of the tree forbidden to them. They desired what they were not supposed to have and broke God's good commandment to them instead of being satisfied with all of the fruit from the other trees in the garden, including the tree of life.

In just looking at what Genesis says, we are not given information about what Adam and Eve thought or the motives of their hearts even. We can infer about these, but we truly don't know their hearts, bit God did. Eve did say that she saw that the fruit of this tree was good for foo, was pleasant to the eyes, and desirable to make one wise when the serpent tempted her. Other than that, we do not know what Adam and Eve's true relationship with God was like nor how much they knew about Him. they did not know what sin was until they sinned. And most likely did not know about the evil one.

Gigi,

First, thanks for your thoughts. Your agreement with some of my views, such as there was a DECISION by God, indicates something quite surprising in Genesis that I cannot untangle yet.

In my view, there are two questions. It seems Adam COULD have eaten of the tree of life either prior to the tree of knowledge or after he became a man, but prior to God's discovery.

At the time of Adam's eating of the fruit, he knew two things:

1. Eve would surely die

2. If He ate, he too would surely die.

The LORD God said so.

Yet, even still, Adam at of the fruit. While the Bible does not express motivation, I state that a consistent and supported interpretation is that Adam decided that he would rather bind his fate to his other half, and die, than to have Eve die while he lived.

To me, that is a very beautiful thought, and it makes life meaningful, that EVEN with death, the alternative of living a life without love is WORSE than living life with it, and dying. That the life of half a man is not meaningful, and ONLY with the union with woman, is life worth it.

It is my view there are elements to Genesis that support this notion. And furthermore, there can be nothing that gives solace to our mortal lives than that realization. That LOVE is more important even than eternal death.

Hi Dante.

Now I see you what you are suggesting.

"Adam purposely bit of the forbidden fruit so he would be in the same condition as Eve.

That is a view that some hold.

Who knows?

The view is that Adam knew exactly what he was doing. He rather chose to join her in her predicament than to be without her.

They draw this from

1 Timothy 2:11-15 "Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.

But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

For Adam was first formed, then Eve.

AND ADAM WAS NOT DECEIVED, BUT THE WOMAN BEING DECEIVED WAS IN THE TRANSGRESSION.

Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety".

Again, Who knows?

God bless.

Hi Gigi.

I'm sure you meant to say Adam and Eve was forbidden to eat of every tree BUT the tree of Knowledge of good and evil, correct?

Genesis 2:16-17. And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:

BUT OF THE TREE OF THE KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD AND EVIL, THOU SHALT NOT EAT OF IT: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

God bless.

Hi S.Spencer. I meant what I said, that Adam and Eve were indeed free to eat from any tree in the garden, but we commanded not to eat of the tree of knowledge. They were free to choose to obey or not. So that is why I said they were free to eat of any tree in the garden, but were also forbidden to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. I was referring to their free agency, having a freedom to will what they wished. But that freedom led them to disobey. Adam and Eve were the only humans to truly have completely free agency (apart from Jesus). Everyone descended from Adam and Eve (except Jesus) had a fallen nature and their agency is depraved compared to Adam and Eve before they sinned. All of us since Adam are conceived being enslaved by the sin nature and cannot on our own free will turn to God, obey Him, nor even seek Him unless He draws us, the Spirit regenerates us, and Jesus gives us His righteousness.

Hope this helps clear up my prior post.

Hi Gigi.

You were speaking of his free will, I see it now.

Thanks for your reply.

God bless.

Hello,

I would state it is not that they ate of the tree of knowledge in preference to the tree of life, but merely they ate of the tree of knowledge for whatever motivations compelled them.

Whether they ate of the tree of life, it seems was not within God's control, but left to Adam and Eve.

It seems to me, for instance, there was time between the eating of the tree of knowledge and God's understanding they had. During this time, through whatever mechanism, they could have eaten of the tree of life. Or, even before. There is no indication of anything to prevent them from having done that.

Indeed, God decided to remove Adam and Eve from the garden LEST they eat of the tree of life. Which to me means it was a possibility they would in God's assessment, but only they had not.

This is one of my thoughts. Adam and Eve could have eaten of the tree of life in the time starting their residence in the Garden of Eden, and when the LORD God decided to evict them. Indeed, the LORD decided to evict Adam and Eve lest they eat of the tree of life. An outcome he decided he did not want, as they too would become like Gods. And the LORD did not want that, a decision he made.

My thinking is these words mean that it was unknown to God whether or not Adam and Eve would have eaten of the tree of life. God stated there were no consequences to it, OR they could have eaten of it after Eve's "seduction" by the serpent.

Thus, from the LORD'S perspective, it would have been possible for Adam and Eve to have eaten of the Tree of Life either before or after their taking of the tree of knowledge.

This to me is intensely meaningful. I also think it is at minimum not contradicted by the words: in fact, it is supported.