Hi Donna, I think that basically, we are to believe what it says-that those who believe that Jesus came from the God to save humanity from sin will be saved and have eternal life instead of judgement.
Is there something else that you are thinking about this Scripture?
I guess what I'm asking is if we take the name of God and replace it with Jesus [because they are teaching Jesus IS God] it doesn't make sense like a lot of the other scripture
I don't believe we can just replace the word God for Jesus. I believe that uses of God in the Bible sometimes implies the trinity, but other times is used solely for God the father. I believe this is one of the common sources of confusion. Also, Jesus is Lord, and the use of the word Lord of the Old Testament sometimes seems to include God the father. I'm interested in anyone else's opinions on this. So, the three are one, the same, but also different. While this is hard for us simple humans to understand how much the same they are and how much different they are, it says it in the Bible and we must choose whether we want to trust and believe what it says.
About the word begotten in John 3:16:
I'd like to borrow from a Got Questions answer on this as I find them scripturally based most of the time. They say the original Greek word 'begotten' or (monogenes) has 2 meanings:
1. The first definition is "pertaining to being the only one of its kind within a specific relationship." Hebrews 11:17 like Abraham's son.
2. The second definition is "pertaining to being the only one of its kind or class, unique in kind." See John 3:16, John 1:14, 18; 3:18; 1 John 4:9.
Beware of anyone distorting the word to assume it means Jesus was 'created' later. This is not what it means. Scripture already debunks that in John 1:3, 1 Corinthians 8:6 (Jesus made all things), John 1:1 (Jesus was there in the beginning), John 5:18 (equal with His father), Jesus is the John 8:58, "I AM", Exodus 3:14, Revelation 1:8
I am looking forward to seeing Jesus face to face and being able to understand more how God is three person's but one in Being or essence. You are right, our humanness is unable to comprehend the Godhead.
But we have Jesus as our brother and as our Lird to bridge this immense gap between our physical existence as creatures and the transcendent nature of our holy and wholly other God.
Jesus is our connection to the Father and to the Spirit.
How he condescended to be one of us and God with us. And to think, he chose this condescension for our benefit for all eternity.
I found your comments interesting. You mentioned the word trinity. Could you please show me where this word is used in the bible?
You mentioned John 5:18. Jesus never said he was God. The Jews said he made himself equal with God. Jesus then goes on to explain his standing with God.
Joh 5:19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.
You need to understand that our Lord Jesus is not the only Son of God. See Luke 3:38
In John 10:33 Jesus was again accused with making himself God. How did Jesus respond?
Joh 10:34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?
Joh 10:35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;
Joh 10:36 Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?
Jesus is directing them to Psalm 82. It is dealing with the rulers of the nation of Israel. They are called Gods.
This idea "Sons of God" is used a number of times in the New Testament. Here are some of them.
Joh_1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
Rom_8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
Php_2:15 That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;
You initiated a reply to me. I'm not sure how interested you are in my belief, but I am happy to dialogue with you as long as it is respectful and grounded in the truth of God's word, not man's opinion. You shared scripture which is great, I believe all the scripture you shared, but I don't believe your interpretation of it. I believe you have misinterpreted it and I can be very specific to the exact reasons why for each point if you are genuinely open to it. For the scripture you shared there is more scripture that says Jesus is God. He's not God the Father, but God the Son. I believe this, because the scripture says this, not because of feelings, bias, or agenda, but because it literally says Jesus is God in John 1:1. Do you believe John 1:1?
Your comment began with a question not about the trinity as the Bible says in 1 John 5:7. But your question wasn't about what the Bible says in 1 John 5:7, but the word 'trinity'. Since we don't know each other I don't know your motive for saying that, but I can say that some others use it as a common straw man argument to deceive others in order to discredit Jesus. The word the "Bible" isn't in the Bible either, so is it not a Bible? The word used in 1 John 5:7 is the three are 'one', so if you can use that if you don't like the word trinity.
John 1:1
1 John 5:7
Genesis 1:26
Genesis 11:6-7
John 10:30
John 8:19
John 1:1
Philippians 2:5-8
2 Corinthians 5:19
John 1:3
1 John 5:7
Matthew 28:19
1 Peter 1:2
2 Corinthians 13:14
Deuteronomy 6:4
John 14:10
John 20:28
1 John 5:8
1 John 2:22-24
Isaiah 7:14 - Jesus is called Immanuel which means "God with us"
Matthew 1:23-25
Hebrews 1:8 "But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom."
Isaiah 44:6 - Lord is King of Israel, Besides me there is no God.
I'm not interested in what you belief but I am interested in what the true belief is according to the word of God. If you are interested I am willing to discuss with you according to the scriptures. I realize this can be a very touchy subject but I believe it is very important to have a true understanding about God.
You mentioned about the word Bible and the word trinity and that neither of them is mentioned in the book we call the Bible. The word Bible is describing a book that we believe God is the author of where the word trinity is describing God. These are two totally different things. There are probably a number of things we could call the book that is called the Bible. But I think we would be in agreement as concerning of the book we call the Bible. The thing is that if the author didn't use the word trinity to describe himself we need to be very careful using words that he didn't use. I agree that just because something isn't in the bible doesn't mean it shouldn't be considered. I believe there is a unity in the bible which involves not only God and Jesus Christ but all true believers.
One of the passages you used is 1 John 5:7 This passage is not used in later versions. Why? But for argument sake lets say it should be there. What is it actually saying? They are one. One in thought and one in action. Jesus did exactly as his father wanted him to do. That verse in itself is not enough to prove what you are saying. It proves unity between the father and the son. John 1:1 again proves that Jesus did everything his father wanted him to do. The verses in Genesis shows God and his angels at work in the creation and John 10:30 again shows the unity between The Lord Jesus Christ and God. I would go one but I'm running out of space. I'd like to show you a few passages to consider.
John 1:1 already said Jesus is God. That's all I need to know. When it says the Word was God, do you think it means the Word was 'not' God? If that is your interpretation, can you please explain how you honestly arrive at that?
I noticed you didn't comment on the more than 20 verses I posted previously. Did you hover over each of them? Each support that Jesus is God. For instance the plural 'we' in Genesis.
So, let's pretend for a moment that the 4 verses you last shared flat out said Jesus isn't God. If that were true we would then have 20 or more verses supporting that He is God, and then your 4 supporting that He isn't. Which do you then choose to believe: the one with more scriptural support, or the one with less?
But your four verses do not say Jesus isn't God, you are just interpreting that way. It also takes some mental gymnastics in my opinion to arrive at that. It must involve ignoring and absolutely disregarding much scripture, like the 20+ verses I shared. There are many more not yet shared which also support Jesus being God. There are so many pieces of evidence throughout the Bible, like the miracles, perfection, dying for you, resurrection, He was worshipped as being God ever since being a baby, people calling Him Lord and God, on and on.
1 Timothy 2:5 - the man Jesus Christ. He did become a man and He is a mediator to the Father. Both man and God. Titus 2:13
Let's say that you honestly read the entire Bible and weighed all the evidence and support, and prayed for wisdom about it. If you found that the Bible has more support for Jesus being God would you choose to believe it?
Do you believe God has limited power, or do you think God has the ability to be in a form we created beings don't have a framework to understand? For example of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit were one, 1 John 5:7.
Do you believe Jesus is Lord as Romans 10:9 says? Do you believe He died for you for the forgiveness of your sins?
You said that John 1:1 says that Jesus is God. Jesus name is not mentioned in that verse at all. In fact nowhere in the bible does it say that Jesus is God. (Jesus will be exalted by God.) Many times does it say that he is the Son of God. The expression "God the Son" is not found in the scriptures. The "word was God" is correct but it does not say Jesus is God. The word was made flesh is talking about the Lord Jesus Christ manifesting his Father perfectly. He is a manifestation of his Father. If he were God why is he not called God the Son? The passages I showed you showed his reliance on his father.
You mentioned that I didn't comment on all your passages. I will try to do that. Gen 1:26 Nowhere is Jesus mentioned there. You are saying that's what it means. Gen 11:6-7 Again Jesus is not mentioned in this passage. John 10:30 Jesus and his Father are one. Not a problem. Jesus doesn't say that he is God, instead at John 10:34-36 when he is accused of making himself God verse 33 he tells them to read Psalm 82 where the rulers are called Gods by God. If he was actually God then why didn't he say so? John 8:19 God is his Father. I believe that. It does not say that Jesus is God. Phil 2:5-8
Again Jesus not called God. In fact he is called a man in verse 8. Verse 9 God highly exalts him. 2 Corinthians 5:19 God was in Christ. Of course he was. The Holy Spirit was given to Jesus without measure. Jesus not called God. Consider 1
Corinthians 15:27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
1Co 15:28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
We are told here that even our Lord Jesus Christ will be subject unto God.
Deut 6:4 and Isaiah 44:6 They prove my point. God is one there is no other God.
Do you believe Jesus is Lord and died for you for the hope of salvation?
John 5:22-24 these verses might be interesting to read.
You said that John 1:1 doesn't say Jesus is God, but it does. I broke it down before, but it seems we are not on the same wavelength.
There are many verses saying Jesus is God in various ways, but no where in the Bible anywhere does it say Jesus is not God. Not only that but Jesus never once said He was not God. So, it seems unusual to arrive at such a conclusion with no evidence for it and with all the evidence for the opposite.
Have you carefully read the whole chapter of John 1?
14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
Since you don't think the Word is Jesus, who else do you think the Word is?
Who else do you think fits that description of being sent to earth in the flesh, to live among us, and to die on the cross for our sins?
15 John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me.
John 3:28 John said "I am not the Christ, but that I am sent before him."
Matthew 3:16 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:
That clear sign along with the voice made it obvious that Jesus was He.
John 1:29 John acknowledges it is Jesus: Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
John 1:36 "And looking upon Jesus as he walked, he saith, Behold the Lamb of God!"
Do you believe Jesus is the Lamb of God as it says?
The next chapter Matt 4:7 Jesus is tempted and says to satan: Jesus said unto him, It is written again, "Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God." There again Jesus refers to Himself as Lord and God. Do you agree?
Hi Billy, if you read the thread it will probably make more sense. To make a point I used his own words against his own position so perhaps it would be recognized as such. He came up with an arbitrary expectation which I believe is based on a logical fallacy and demonstrated that the same expectation can be used against his position. I believe scripture means exactly what it says and usually doesn't require advanced mental hurdles in order to know what it means. Children can read and understand. I think Occam's razor applies. God will also provide understanding to those who seek Him.
Apologies Billy. I read your comment to Adam in a different way.
You're correct, Jesus' Name is not seen there in John 1:1-14, but who then is John the Apostle writing about? I can't think of anyone else that fits that description. John wrote about the Word of God: that which was with God & God Himself (v1). This Word was involved in creation (vv3,10) - notice John begins to use a pronoun (He, Him) describing this Word. In this Word was both Life & Light (v4). When John the Baptist arrived on the scene, he bore witness of that Light (v7). That Word Who was with God & was God, was made a man & lived the life of a man (v14). That Word came to His Own people but they rejected Him (v11), but those who received Him were made sons of God (v12). These are not separate accounts; this whole passage is consistent in its subject matter & implications.
This passage of Scripture is talking about God's Word. It's not about Apostle John or John the Baptist, or anyone else. The only Person Who could fit the bill is God's Word, Jesus Christ: He is the only One Who could be the giver of Life & Light & be the Creator of all things (also Colossians 1:15-17). He is the Only One Who could ask His Father ( John 17:5: "O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I HAD WITH thee before the world was."). He is the only One Who could state ( John 6:38: "For I CAME DOWN from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me."). And He is the only One Who could tell the Jews ( John 8:58: "Verily, verily, I say unto you, BEFORE ABRAHAM WAS, I AM.").
I always wonder how folk consider these verses that I've shared here. I'm sure Jesus is not lying to us by saying those things. Do people read those verses as I do or in some other way that I'm missing? Or, should we determine that since the incarnation is 'impossible', therefore all these Scriptures are meaningless? Even if Christ's Deity is hard to understand, we can't simply reject it.
THE GODHEAD SCRIPTURES are PROOF - In Reply - 2 years ago
Romans 1 is the one chapter that mentions GODHEAD. We cannot separate them. God, Jesus's Father
Jesus the Word that SPOKE creation into existence.
The Holy Spirit who performed it. He is also the Spirit of Christ.
GODHEAD. The scriptures that prove it.
The Scriptures about the Godhead. Sometimes called "Let Us..." in some passages. These scriptures are evidence of all 3 persons of the Godhead speaking to each other.
Genesis 1:26, 3:22, 11:7
Isaiah 6:8
Romans 1:20
Colossians 2:9
Acts 17:27-30
1 John 5:7
John 10:30
"For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and GODHEAD so that they are without excuse:"
Genesis 1:1
The Father purposes
The Word (Jesus) speaks. ( John 1:1)
The Spirit (Holy Spirit) executes the spoken word. Action.
All working together. Jesus came to show us the Father, as Emmanuel.
Matthew 1:23
Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, GOD WITH US. [Jesus]
1 Corinthians 12:1-31 explains all the gifts, titled, administrations that God gives to the Church that Jesus has planted on earth Now.
Those that He calls, he anoints for the work. Luke 4:18. The Bible says the gifts and callings are without revocation. If we try to operate without the Holy Spirits anointing; we will not bear good fruit. Can even become apostate.
It's not something to treat carelessly. The Head of the Church is Jesus Christ. All parts of the Body are connected to the HEAD, Jesus.
Dear "Jim". 1 John 5:1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.
2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.
5 Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?
6 This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.
7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.
The words are there to "eat" my friend in peace. Be very blessed in the Lord and in His righteousness we have eternal life. Be blessed in the Holy Name of Jesus Christ, the Son of God, and now in the Kingdom of the Holy Ghost. Remember that the prayer of a righteous man has great power. Amen.
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For God [Jesus] so loved the world he gave his only begotten son So that whoever believes in him should not perish but have everlasting life.
What am I supposed to do with that?
I would read it for what it says.
God gave his son.
Maybe we need to rethink our understanding of Jesus and God.
John 3:17
Remember all scripture is given by inspiration of God.
2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
Is there something else that you are thinking about this Scripture?
I don't believe we can just replace the word God for Jesus. I believe that uses of God in the Bible sometimes implies the trinity, but other times is used solely for God the father. I believe this is one of the common sources of confusion. Also, Jesus is Lord, and the use of the word Lord of the Old Testament sometimes seems to include God the father. I'm interested in anyone else's opinions on this. So, the three are one, the same, but also different. While this is hard for us simple humans to understand how much the same they are and how much different they are, it says it in the Bible and we must choose whether we want to trust and believe what it says.
About the word begotten in John 3:16:
I'd like to borrow from a Got Questions answer on this as I find them scripturally based most of the time. They say the original Greek word 'begotten' or (monogenes) has 2 meanings:
1. The first definition is "pertaining to being the only one of its kind within a specific relationship." Hebrews 11:17 like Abraham's son.
2. The second definition is "pertaining to being the only one of its kind or class, unique in kind." See John 3:16, John 1:14, 18; 3:18; 1 John 4:9.
Link
Beware of anyone distorting the word to assume it means Jesus was 'created' later. This is not what it means. Scripture already debunks that in John 1:3, 1 Corinthians 8:6 (Jesus made all things), John 1:1 (Jesus was there in the beginning), John 5:18 (equal with His father), Jesus is the John 8:58, "I AM", Exodus 3:14, Revelation 1:8
God bless...
Thank you for the good explanation.
I am looking forward to seeing Jesus face to face and being able to understand more how God is three person's but one in Being or essence. You are right, our humanness is unable to comprehend the Godhead.
But we have Jesus as our brother and as our Lird to bridge this immense gap between our physical existence as creatures and the transcendent nature of our holy and wholly other God.
Jesus is our connection to the Father and to the Spirit.
How he condescended to be one of us and God with us. And to think, he chose this condescension for our benefit for all eternity.
Blessed be His name!
I found your comments interesting. You mentioned the word trinity. Could you please show me where this word is used in the bible?
You mentioned John 5:18. Jesus never said he was God. The Jews said he made himself equal with God. Jesus then goes on to explain his standing with God.
Joh 5:19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.
You need to understand that our Lord Jesus is not the only Son of God. See Luke 3:38
In John 10:33 Jesus was again accused with making himself God. How did Jesus respond?
Joh 10:34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?
Joh 10:35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;
Joh 10:36 Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?
Jesus is directing them to Psalm 82. It is dealing with the rulers of the nation of Israel. They are called Gods.
This idea "Sons of God" is used a number of times in the New Testament. Here are some of them.
Joh_1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
Rom_8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
Php_2:15 That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;
Thanks for your time
for the gap, let me know if that communicated. At times I don't hit the mark the first time b ut I keep going for batting
a thousand. Thanks again.
You initiated a reply to me. I'm not sure how interested you are in my belief, but I am happy to dialogue with you as long as it is respectful and grounded in the truth of God's word, not man's opinion. You shared scripture which is great, I believe all the scripture you shared, but I don't believe your interpretation of it. I believe you have misinterpreted it and I can be very specific to the exact reasons why for each point if you are genuinely open to it. For the scripture you shared there is more scripture that says Jesus is God. He's not God the Father, but God the Son. I believe this, because the scripture says this, not because of feelings, bias, or agenda, but because it literally says Jesus is God in John 1:1. Do you believe John 1:1?
Your comment began with a question not about the trinity as the Bible says in 1 John 5:7. But your question wasn't about what the Bible says in 1 John 5:7, but the word 'trinity'. Since we don't know each other I don't know your motive for saying that, but I can say that some others use it as a common straw man argument to deceive others in order to discredit Jesus. The word the "Bible" isn't in the Bible either, so is it not a Bible? The word used in 1 John 5:7 is the three are 'one', so if you can use that if you don't like the word trinity.
John 1:1
1 John 5:7
Genesis 1:26
Genesis 11:6-7
John 10:30
John 8:19
John 1:1
Philippians 2:5-8
2 Corinthians 5:19
John 1:3
1 John 5:7
Matthew 28:19
1 Peter 1:2
2 Corinthians 13:14
Deuteronomy 6:4
John 14:10
John 20:28
1 John 5:8
1 John 2:22-24
Isaiah 7:14 - Jesus is called Immanuel which means "God with us"
Matthew 1:23-25
Hebrews 1:8 "But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom."
Isaiah 44:6 - Lord is King of Israel, Besides me there is no God.
"Sons of God" isn't THE Son of God.
Do you believe these verses?
I'm not interested in what you belief but I am interested in what the true belief is according to the word of God. If you are interested I am willing to discuss with you according to the scriptures. I realize this can be a very touchy subject but I believe it is very important to have a true understanding about God.
You mentioned about the word Bible and the word trinity and that neither of them is mentioned in the book we call the Bible. The word Bible is describing a book that we believe God is the author of where the word trinity is describing God. These are two totally different things. There are probably a number of things we could call the book that is called the Bible. But I think we would be in agreement as concerning of the book we call the Bible. The thing is that if the author didn't use the word trinity to describe himself we need to be very careful using words that he didn't use. I agree that just because something isn't in the bible doesn't mean it shouldn't be considered. I believe there is a unity in the bible which involves not only God and Jesus Christ but all true believers.
One of the passages you used is 1 John 5:7 This passage is not used in later versions. Why? But for argument sake lets say it should be there. What is it actually saying? They are one. One in thought and one in action. Jesus did exactly as his father wanted him to do. That verse in itself is not enough to prove what you are saying. It proves unity between the father and the son. John 1:1 again proves that Jesus did everything his father wanted him to do. The verses in Genesis shows God and his angels at work in the creation and John 10:30 again shows the unity between The Lord Jesus Christ and God. I would go one but I'm running out of space. I'd like to show you a few passages to consider.
1 Tim 2:5, John 5:19,30 John 7:16, John 12:49
Thanks for your time
John 1:1 already said Jesus is God. That's all I need to know. When it says the Word was God, do you think it means the Word was 'not' God? If that is your interpretation, can you please explain how you honestly arrive at that?
I noticed you didn't comment on the more than 20 verses I posted previously. Did you hover over each of them? Each support that Jesus is God. For instance the plural 'we' in Genesis.
So, let's pretend for a moment that the 4 verses you last shared flat out said Jesus isn't God. If that were true we would then have 20 or more verses supporting that He is God, and then your 4 supporting that He isn't. Which do you then choose to believe: the one with more scriptural support, or the one with less?
But your four verses do not say Jesus isn't God, you are just interpreting that way. It also takes some mental gymnastics in my opinion to arrive at that. It must involve ignoring and absolutely disregarding much scripture, like the 20+ verses I shared. There are many more not yet shared which also support Jesus being God. There are so many pieces of evidence throughout the Bible, like the miracles, perfection, dying for you, resurrection, He was worshipped as being God ever since being a baby, people calling Him Lord and God, on and on.
1 Timothy 2:5 - the man Jesus Christ. He did become a man and He is a mediator to the Father. Both man and God. Titus 2:13
Let's say that you honestly read the entire Bible and weighed all the evidence and support, and prayed for wisdom about it. If you found that the Bible has more support for Jesus being God would you choose to believe it?
Do you believe God has limited power, or do you think God has the ability to be in a form we created beings don't have a framework to understand? For example of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit were one, 1 John 5:7.
Do you believe Jesus is Lord as Romans 10:9 says? Do you believe He died for you for the forgiveness of your sins?
God bless...
You said that John 1:1 says that Jesus is God. Jesus name is not mentioned in that verse at all. In fact nowhere in the bible does it say that Jesus is God. (Jesus will be exalted by God.) Many times does it say that he is the Son of God. The expression "God the Son" is not found in the scriptures. The "word was God" is correct but it does not say Jesus is God. The word was made flesh is talking about the Lord Jesus Christ manifesting his Father perfectly. He is a manifestation of his Father. If he were God why is he not called God the Son? The passages I showed you showed his reliance on his father.
You mentioned that I didn't comment on all your passages. I will try to do that. Gen 1:26 Nowhere is Jesus mentioned there. You are saying that's what it means. Gen 11:6-7 Again Jesus is not mentioned in this passage. John 10:30 Jesus and his Father are one. Not a problem. Jesus doesn't say that he is God, instead at John 10:34-36 when he is accused of making himself God verse 33 he tells them to read Psalm 82 where the rulers are called Gods by God. If he was actually God then why didn't he say so? John 8:19 God is his Father. I believe that. It does not say that Jesus is God. Phil 2:5-8
Again Jesus not called God. In fact he is called a man in verse 8. Verse 9 God highly exalts him. 2 Corinthians 5:19 God was in Christ. Of course he was. The Holy Spirit was given to Jesus without measure. Jesus not called God. Consider 1
Corinthians 15:27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
1Co 15:28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
We are told here that even our Lord Jesus Christ will be subject unto God.
Deut 6:4 and Isaiah 44:6 They prove my point. God is one there is no other God.
I'm out of space.
Thanks for your time.
Do you believe Jesus is Lord and died for you for the hope of salvation?
John 5:22-24 these verses might be interesting to read.
You said that John 1:1 doesn't say Jesus is God, but it does. I broke it down before, but it seems we are not on the same wavelength.
There are many verses saying Jesus is God in various ways, but no where in the Bible anywhere does it say Jesus is not God. Not only that but Jesus never once said He was not God. So, it seems unusual to arrive at such a conclusion with no evidence for it and with all the evidence for the opposite.
Have you carefully read the whole chapter of John 1?
14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
Since you don't think the Word is Jesus, who else do you think the Word is?
Who else do you think fits that description of being sent to earth in the flesh, to live among us, and to die on the cross for our sins?
15 John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me.
John 3:28 John said "I am not the Christ, but that I am sent before him."
Matthew 3:16 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:
That clear sign along with the voice made it obvious that Jesus was He.
John 1:29 John acknowledges it is Jesus: Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
John 1:36 "And looking upon Jesus as he walked, he saith, Behold the Lamb of God!"
Do you believe Jesus is the Lamb of God as it says?
The next chapter Matt 4:7 Jesus is tempted and says to satan: Jesus said unto him, It is written again, "Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God." There again Jesus refers to Himself as Lord and God. Do you agree?
Do you believe these scriptures?
Shall we ask a 7 yr old what it says and go with it ?
God bless...
But if you can find Jesus in that verse , we need a 7 year old to read and explain it .
You're correct, Jesus' Name is not seen there in John 1:1-14, but who then is John the Apostle writing about? I can't think of anyone else that fits that description. John wrote about the Word of God: that which was with God & God Himself (v1). This Word was involved in creation (vv3,10) - notice John begins to use a pronoun (He, Him) describing this Word. In this Word was both Life & Light (v4). When John the Baptist arrived on the scene, he bore witness of that Light (v7). That Word Who was with God & was God, was made a man & lived the life of a man (v14). That Word came to His Own people but they rejected Him (v11), but those who received Him were made sons of God (v12). These are not separate accounts; this whole passage is consistent in its subject matter & implications.
This passage of Scripture is talking about God's Word. It's not about Apostle John or John the Baptist, or anyone else. The only Person Who could fit the bill is God's Word, Jesus Christ: He is the only One Who could be the giver of Life & Light & be the Creator of all things (also Colossians 1:15-17). He is the Only One Who could ask His Father ( John 17:5: "O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I HAD WITH thee before the world was."). He is the only One Who could state ( John 6:38: "For I CAME DOWN from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me."). And He is the only One Who could tell the Jews ( John 8:58: "Verily, verily, I say unto you, BEFORE ABRAHAM WAS, I AM.").
I always wonder how folk consider these verses that I've shared here. I'm sure Jesus is not lying to us by saying those things. Do people read those verses as I do or in some other way that I'm missing? Or, should we determine that since the incarnation is 'impossible', therefore all these Scriptures are meaningless? Even if Christ's Deity is hard to understand, we can't simply reject it.
Jesus the Word that SPOKE creation into existence.
The Holy Spirit who performed it. He is also the Spirit of Christ.
GODHEAD. The scriptures that prove it.
The Scriptures about the Godhead. Sometimes called "Let Us..." in some passages. These scriptures are evidence of all 3 persons of the Godhead speaking to each other.
Genesis 1:26, 3:22, 11:7
Isaiah 6:8
Romans 1:20
Colossians 2:9
Acts 17:27-30
1 John 5:7
John 10:30
"For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and GODHEAD so that they are without excuse:"
Genesis 1:1
The Father purposes
The Word (Jesus) speaks. ( John 1:1)
The Spirit (Holy Spirit) executes the spoken word. Action.
All working together. Jesus came to show us the Father, as Emmanuel.
Matthew 1:23
Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, GOD WITH US. [Jesus]
1 Corinthians 12:1-31 explains all the gifts, titled, administrations that God gives to the Church that Jesus has planted on earth Now.
Those that He calls, he anoints for the work. Luke 4:18. The Bible says the gifts and callings are without revocation. If we try to operate without the Holy Spirits anointing; we will not bear good fruit. Can even become apostate.
It's not something to treat carelessly. The Head of the Church is Jesus Christ. All parts of the Body are connected to the HEAD, Jesus.
Mishael
2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.
5 Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?
6 This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.
7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.
The words are there to "eat" my friend in peace. Be very blessed in the Lord and in His righteousness we have eternal life. Be blessed in the Holy Name of Jesus Christ, the Son of God, and now in the Kingdom of the Holy Ghost. Remember that the prayer of a righteous man has great power. Amen.
one comment. Point 7 taken from 1 John 5:7
1Jn 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
This verse is not in newer translations. You need to ask yourself why?
Thanks
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