Bible Discussion Thread

  • Joan on John 2
    How do we know once we are saved that we are forever saved? I ask this because, if in our past after receiving salvation we were a good Christian for a while, yet this changed to a sinful nature. Then finally after several years, it is changed back into doing Gods will, and choosing to live for Him completely because, we realized our mistakes. What if during those years when we were not living for Jesus we were to have died. Would we still have gone to Heaven? Where does the Bible say once saved always saved? Is it only in John 3:16? I was reading where a man got on a bad road after being saved he got into drugs, immoral acts, and such. He died and saw he was in hell. He cried out to Jesus and was brought back to life. He then turned his life into a life of ministry. So, my question is this! Was this something perhaps God did to wake this saved man up, and place him back into His will by letting him get a glimpse of hell? I am now unsure since I use to do bad things after I was saved, and almost died in a coma would I have gone to hell if I had not lived? I simply want to know how we know for certainty we definitely are saved. Thank you, and God Bless!
  • Jesse - in Reply on John 2

    My apologies to you. You were describing a person who is saved, gets into sin, and comes back, not necessarily referring to yourself. Please accept my apology for thinking you were referring to your own walk.
  • Jesse - in Reply on John 2

    A person who's been born of God's Spirit has become a new creation in Christ. That person now has a new nature because God's Spirit living inside is pure and holy. God's Spirit convicts a saved person when they sin, therefore a saved person cannot go back to the sinful lifestyle and sinful nature they once had without any conviction in their heart.

    You mention that you were saved, got caught up in sin, but then came back. If I may ask you, why did you come back? My guess would be that if you were truly saved, meaning you were born of the Spirit of Christ, that it was His Spirit that brought conviction to your heart and that's why you came back.

    That happens to every true believer that gets caught up with sin. God will deal with every believer that goes astray and gets involved with sin. The bible tells us in Hebrews Chapter 12 that Christ disciplines and chastens those who belong to Him. And He does so out of love. He will never allow one of His sheep to go astray. If a person's not under the discipline of the Lord, they don't belong to Him. They have an illegitimate claim to belong to Christ!

    So, "How do we know once we are saved that we are forever saved?" The answer would be who are you trusting when it comes to your salvation? Are you trusting in the one who says He will NEVER leave you nor forsake you, the one who says you are being kept by His power? Or are you trusting in yourself to keep yourself saved?

    God gives eternal life. If there is a way we can lose our salvation, then it is not eternal. Please know that the entire salvation process is all of God. Man cannot save himself, and man cannot keep himself saved. If it wasn't for God and His power to keep us saved, we would have no hope!

    There's nothing in scripture that says a person can lose their salvation. If you're saved now, you will remain saved by the mighty hand and power of God. Of all that belong to Him, He says He will not lose one. If that's not assurance, I'm not sure what is!
  • Adam - in Reply on John 2
    Dear Joan,

    I think only a minority of Christians believe once saved, always saved, because the Bible doesn't support that idea. Most people would agree that Hitler probably won't be in heaven, despite going to church when young and possibly identifying as a Christian at one point. Judas was a Christian (a literal Christ follower) and betrayed Him in a huge way, and it's my personal belief that he is not saved. There's countless examples of Christians who unfortunately have turned their back on Jesus and started following the ways of the world or the devil himself. Jesus warned His followers to obey and fear God and avoid sin and obey. People today are making claims that you don't have to do anything at all. I believe God is a fair judge.

    This doesn't mean we're saved by effort, it's grace. But Jesus clearly said if you love Him then obey. Christianity is an action requiring effort. Those who are genuine Christians following Christ will be saved, those who aren't are in danger of not being saved. I believe Bible backs this up very well. Plus, one can have assurance of salvation, but no one is actually saved until judgment day. So, people that claim they're saved, and can enjoy sin and doing evil 24/7 are mistaken. That idea only comes from satan. They will call out Lord, Lord and Jesus will not know him, just as the Bible says. Jesus said most people won't go to heaven- narrow is the way. Some accuse others of being legalistic, but they'd probably accuse Jesus of that too: John 14:15.

    Just a few relevant verses...

    Hebrews 10:26

    James 2:14-26 ", if it hath not works, is dead..."

    James 2:19 "Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble."

    1 Peter 1:13 "...hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ;"

    Romans 11

    John 14:15 "If ye love me, keep my commandments."

    Matthew 12:31-32.

    Romans 14:12

    1 Peter 1:5 - "...salvation ready to be revealed in the last time."
  • Joan - in Reply on John 2
    Amen Brother in Christ! I fully agree! God bless you for sharing your message with me.
  • Joan - in Reply on John 2
    I choose my life to live completely for Christ Jesus and thank you for helping me understand my question. I will be reading those Bible verses today. I pray God will bless you in all you do! Your Sister in Christ Jesus. Joan
  • Joan - in Reply on John 2
    I came back to living for the Lord because, I knew what I had done was wrong, and no way did I want to live any longer in my sinful ways. Praise God He gave me another chance by bringing me out of my coma a new woman. I completely agree we are saved by Gods Grace. So I know if we truly love God as I do, we choose to lead our lives in His will only. Resisting Satan, and by taking time for others, reading Gods word daily, and by praying about everything. My greatest joy is attending Church, and giving God Praise, and by glorifying Him. I know by my doing so will help me show Christs love to others. It also helps me be the witness God the Father would have me to be. After all Christ sacrificed His life for me as well as all of us who will receive Him as their Lord & Savior. Praise the Lord! Jesus lives forever! As Christians we know we can all can have eternal everlasting life by choosing a committed life living for Him. God Bless you for sharing with me! Joan
  • Chris - in Reply on John 2
    Hello Joan. I fully agree with what Jesse has shared with you. And thank you for your testimony of the Lord "giving you another chance", making you new again. Accordingly, your life has turned about completely & you want to glorify Him through it by living only for Him.

    But you are in conflict & despair as to what would have happened if you died whilst in a comatose state & were living in sin. This is a question no one here can answer, as salvation is "of the Lord" & is personal between Him (His Spirit) & you. Each person's state is only known by God, & what He does to bring a sinning Christian back to Himself, cannot be known by us. What concerned me was what you said, "if in our past after receiving salvation we were a good Christian for a while, yet this changed to a sinful nature." Again, only the Lord & you would know what took place at the time of salvation. When you heard the Gospel, when you responded to it, how you were taught in the Word, how you responded to the Holy Spirit's Work in you, are some questions only you can answer. If your salvation wasn't real at that time (i.e. without conviction of sin & your estrangement from God) or maybe you heard the Gospel in an incorrect/incomplete way, then when looking back at the attractions of the world & to fulfil your desires would be easy to do, without any sense of guilt or wrongdoing.

    But if you were saved at that time, the Holy Spirit wouldn't let you go - every thought, every act or desire of yours would bring about conviction because sin cannot be entertained in a holy vessel. Again, only you can discern what went on in you during that time of rejection of the Christ-centred life. And if you had struggles, indeed it was the Lord alerting you, calling & drawing you back to Himself. Maybe it was the coma itself that the Lord used to finally 'shake' you out of sin & complacency & you're now on the road to faithful godly living & real joy & peace in the spirit as you serve Him. Luke 15:10 & Hebrews 12:2.
  • Richard in Christ - in Reply on John 2
    Amen my brother Chris!
  • Earl Bowman - in Reply on John 2
    Brother Richard, May CHRIST IN US grace us with HIS wisdom and HIS understanding.

    Do you believe the saints are going to judge the world?

    1 Corinthians 6:2

    Do you believe that judgement is upon the house of God now; and we are that house?

    1 Peter 4:17

    If you believe the saints are going to judge the world; what is the judgement of:

    Psalms 149:9
  • Richard in Christ - in Reply on John 2
    Hi brother Earl,

    To your three questions.

    1) Yes. We who are in Christ have been Blessed with the Holy Spirit. After we have been purged from the things of this world through repentance and being taught by the Holy Spirit and the Word of God. We are counted worthy to judge as we are Spiritual and not carnal anymore. Though no man can judge us. 1 Corinthians 2:14-16.

    I will add this. In the next verse 1 Corinthians 6:3 where it states "we shall judge angels". It does not say this in the Greek. Going over the Textus Receptus that verse actually comes out to "Know not that angels judge truly things that pertain to this life".

    2) Yes. Though we who are in Christ are worthy to judge the things in this world when we become Holy. I do not believe this is the same as the Judgement each of us receive after our physical life ends and we are to stand before God or Christ. Only God can Judge each and every single person because He knows everything about everyone. Knowing what is truly in every single persons heart. As I stated in a previous post I can never say anyone is going to be saved or not. As brother Chris stated "salvation is of the Lord". Then as the verse right after the one you posted states how the righteous shall scarcely be saved. 1 Peter 4:18. Not that all shall be saved.

    3) So as I believe God is the only true Judge. As Christ is also on His throne. God's Judgement is of righteousness. Having many synonyms. As our Saviour is Jesus Christ being the only way to the Father. In that we have all fallen short of the Glory of God in our lives. Why God had to send us His Son to be the Perfect sacrifice to pay for our sins once and for all. Not meaning it's ok to sin now. We have a perfect example to follow and that is our Lord. Who lived a perfect life and we should try our best to follow in His footsteps.

    As we can plainly see in the world today not all are with God. Also the world is a lot worse than people can see in plain sight.
  • Joan - in Reply on John 2
    I did have great convictions during those times of sinning. I was doing drugs, and smoking cigarettes. I was even attending church during those days. I was being and feeling hypocritical and I asked Jesus to forgive me and to come back into my heart. Was also baptized again. Yet not at that exact time did I stop the sinning. Although I felt great conviction from it all. God loves me sooo much he helped me as well as my husband by us going to jail. Getting probation and seeing we no longer wanted to live that sinful way. We stopped all drugs, stopped smoking cigarettes, and although I struggle with panic attacks when I drive I choose to start driving again without fear. My husband and I for the first time in months got to attend our Sons Church in Tulsa last Sunday. Our 8 yr old granddaughter was baptized. Praise the Lord! My husband has been having hesitation about going to the church we have here where we live. Satan has been attacking him. Please pray God will touch his heart, and open his eyes to what he is missing. He is saved. Pray for me as well as I choose to do all that the Lord has planned for me to do. I choose to live a life free of sin. I want to always honor God, and bring greater opportunities to help not only myself but, all others who don't know the Lord as their Savior. May God bless you for doing His will because you shared your message with me. I am truly blessed by it! Joan
  • Dee - in Reply on John 2
    Amen God is good so the time.
  • Joan - in Reply on John 2
  • Joan - in Reply on John 2
    Amen He sure is good all the time!
  • Dee - in Reply on John 2
    I can't imagine those that don't seek the lord what they truly are missing, the peace of the lord is joyous. I am glad you are saved as the Lord says

    Seek and yeah shah find. Your life will continue to be more peaceful in harmony and love as you search his word set yourself approved you can know that the Lord will be your guide .

    Thru all tribulations you truly will have peace.

    He's out strength. Amen
  • Joan - in Reply on John 2
    Amen I completely agree! God Bless you for sharing this with me!

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