Mishael, the trouble with pre tribbers is they do not understand the difference between the wrath of God and judgment.
10 of the 12 apostles died for their faith. Stephen died for his faith. Paul died for his faith.
Millions of Christians, in the last 100 years, died for their faith in communist Russia.
Yet pre tribbers do not feel they would ever have to suffer the same fate?
The wrath of the devil and the wrath of God is not the same, sadly this point is lost on most it seems.
Every time we show plain scriptures of those dying in tribulation in revelation for the faith, it is explained away as apply to the "Jews" during that time.
As if the Lord would never allow his church to suffer.
The Lord protected Noah IN the flood, the three Hebrew children IN the furnace of fire, Daniel IN the lions den. Yet Stephen died for his faith in Christ as did many millions of others, some in Communist Russia under Stalin in the last 100 years. Where was the rapture for them?
Acts 12:1 - Now about that time Herod the king stretched forth his hands to vex certain of the church. And he killed James the brother of John with the sword.
Act 12:3 - And because he saw it pleased the Jews, he proceeded further to take Peter also. (Then were the days of unleavened bread.)
It is the wicked who kill those who have the testimony of Jesus.
Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Maybe watch TBN and the 700 club less and read the history of Christians under communism in Russia.
I totally agree with you. I believe the Bible teaches those faithful saints that are still alive when the trump sounds, will leave this earth and meet him in the air. non saints will face eternal death which is eternal sepparation from god
It's a cheap shot to undermine the work of Christian Ministries. FYI I haven't had cable or streaming for the past 15 years! Satan owns cable.
You explain things from history. If you want to see some history in the making, go on Jerusalem post today: history of modern Jewish wars With the neighbors, Russia, China, Syria, Iran and 2 others.
People who argue the "Trib" theories are making bets in the dark.
The right one, is be ready TODAY. You are in danger. You've committed to a Trib theory; but you also convince others that it's the right one. If we chose wrong; we go through the Tribulation and those who believed you. God gives us the freewill to make Choices: just like Adam & Eve.
Everyone is held accountable for their choices!
People that visit this room: you make your own choice! Don't follow after others. Read the Bible and ASK the HOLY SPIRIT to teach you to understand it. Quit depending on others to choose for you. Choose Jesus. GO WITH HIM. He said be ready NOW.
Choose life with Jesus!
Bob: I asked God to make it rain if Pretrib was truth, and guess what? It's raining!
(Bob: I asked God to make it rain if Pretrib was truth, and guess what? It's raining!)
John 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, IT IS FINISHED: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost. ---- NOTHING CAN BE ADDED
Matthew 12:39 But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas:
Mishael on the Wonder of Gods Glory - In Reply on Acts 5 - 3 years ago
God and I enjoy all the weather together. He controls it every day. I was out there thinking out loud about arguments in here about Tribs, somewhat disgusted, and asked for rain. It was a mostly clear sky.
God knows I adore rain with lightning because to me, I am seeing and hearing His voice. I know every attribute of Him and his Glory. I've had an awareness of God since I was 4. He wasn't a playmate! But He would be interested in things I would build: habitats. We like the same things. And we love beauty in the clouds.
I wish everybody could enjoy the same awareness and closeness. I always thank Him for His time. I don't have to be in Church to sing to Him. He might put cotton in His ears, because I sound like a frog with a cold.
Are you referring to all pre-tribbers? If so, then you are completely off on your description of what I believe. There are many people who will die during the tribulation, who will be beheaded. These are not saved believers. These are those who refuse to worship the beast and take his mark.
There will be two witnesses, the 144,000 Jews who will be evangelizing, and also an angel flying in mid-heaven for the first 3-1/2 years warning people not to take the mark or worship the beast. The witnesses are not witnessing to believers. And the people who are being warned during the tribulation period are the ones who are going to have to make a decision. The church (All believers) already made their choice.
You say that "Every time we show plain scriptures of those dying in tribulation in revelation for the faith, it is explained away as apply to the "Jews" during that time."
Well, I would never try and explain it away as applying to just the Jews. It will apply to everyone on this planet, Jew and Gentile both, every single person, no matter who they are. These will all be non-believers who will have to go through this time of judgment. They are the ones who will have to make the choice to take the mark or not take it.
I do agree with you that many believers throughout the centuries have died for their faith, but we're talking about a whole different period of time, not the future 7-year period that is to come. I am one of those believers that knows full well that I can and should suffer for my faith. Jesus said we would suffer for our faith. But He never said I will suffer during the judgment that is to come on all those who reject Him. And like Paul, I would count it all joy to suffer for Christ's sake. However, my suffering is now, not alongside of a world that has rejected Christ and will suffer the consequence for it later.
Are you referring to all pre-tribbers? If so, then you are completely off on your description of what I believe. There are many people who will die during the tribulation, who will be beheaded. These are not saved believers. These are those who refuse to worship the beast and take his mark.----- Revelation 13:16 And he causeth ALL, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
Do really believe that Jesus is going to suffer His Bride; the Bride of Christ;
To go all the way through the Tribulation for the 7th Trumpet?
To be tempted to take Antichrist's Mark of the Beast?
To bow down and Worship the Antichrist?
To be hunted like an animal by Antichrist's evil agents and taken to either take The Mark or be beheaded for the Testimony of Jesus ?
To suffer screaming hunger and thirst because she has no way to get either?
All believers who have been born again throughout human history?
There is no scripture for what you preach.
Your love of your own point of view endangers others.
10 of the 12 apostles died for their faith. Stephen died for his faith. Paul died for his faith.
Millions of Christians, in the last 100 years, died for their faith in communist Russia.
Yet pre tribbers do not feel they would ever have to suffer the same fate?
The wrath of the devil and the wrath of God is not the same, sadly this point is lost on most it seems.
Every time we show plain scriptures of those dying in tribulation in revelation for the faith, it is explained away as apply to the "Jews" during that time.
As if the Lord would never allow his church to suffer.
The Lord protected Noah IN the flood, the three Hebrew children IN the furnace of fire, Daniel IN the lions den. Yet Stephen died for his faith in Christ as did many millions of others, some in Communist Russia under Stalin in the last 100 years. Where was the rapture for them?
Acts 12:1 - Now about that time Herod the king stretched forth his hands to vex certain of the church. And he killed James the brother of John with the sword.
Act 12:3 - And because he saw it pleased the Jews, he proceeded further to take Peter also. (Then were the days of unleavened bread.)
It is the wicked who kill those who have the testimony of Jesus.
Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Maybe watch TBN and the 700 club less and read the history of Christians under communism in Russia.
You explain things from history. If you want to see some history in the making, go on Jerusalem post today: history of modern Jewish wars With the neighbors, Russia, China, Syria, Iran and 2 others.
People who argue the "Trib" theories are making bets in the dark.
The right one, is be ready TODAY. You are in danger. You've committed to a Trib theory; but you also convince others that it's the right one. If we chose wrong; we go through the Tribulation and those who believed you. God gives us the freewill to make Choices: just like Adam & Eve.
Everyone is held accountable for their choices!
People that visit this room: you make your own choice! Don't follow after others. Read the Bible and ASK the HOLY SPIRIT to teach you to understand it. Quit depending on others to choose for you. Choose Jesus. GO WITH HIM. He said be ready NOW.
Choose life with Jesus!
Bob: I asked God to make it rain if Pretrib was truth, and guess what? It's raining!
John 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, IT IS FINISHED: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost. ---- NOTHING CAN BE ADDED
Matthew 12:39 But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas:
Go to God and complain. He'll have to deal with me. I spoke of having a deepening relationship with the Godhead.
Tomorrow, I'll do a study on debates, strivings, disputes. Lots of scripture on that!
God knows I adore rain with lightning because to me, I am seeing and hearing His voice. I know every attribute of Him and his Glory. I've had an awareness of God since I was 4. He wasn't a playmate! But He would be interested in things I would build: habitats. We like the same things. And we love beauty in the clouds.
I wish everybody could enjoy the same awareness and closeness. I always thank Him for His time. I don't have to be in Church to sing to Him. He might put cotton in His ears, because I sound like a frog with a cold.
Are you referring to all pre-tribbers? If so, then you are completely off on your description of what I believe. There are many people who will die during the tribulation, who will be beheaded. These are not saved believers. These are those who refuse to worship the beast and take his mark.
There will be two witnesses, the 144,000 Jews who will be evangelizing, and also an angel flying in mid-heaven for the first 3-1/2 years warning people not to take the mark or worship the beast. The witnesses are not witnessing to believers. And the people who are being warned during the tribulation period are the ones who are going to have to make a decision. The church (All believers) already made their choice.
You say that "Every time we show plain scriptures of those dying in tribulation in revelation for the faith, it is explained away as apply to the "Jews" during that time."
Well, I would never try and explain it away as applying to just the Jews. It will apply to everyone on this planet, Jew and Gentile both, every single person, no matter who they are. These will all be non-believers who will have to go through this time of judgment. They are the ones who will have to make the choice to take the mark or not take it.
I do agree with you that many believers throughout the centuries have died for their faith, but we're talking about a whole different period of time, not the future 7-year period that is to come. I am one of those believers that knows full well that I can and should suffer for my faith. Jesus said we would suffer for our faith. But He never said I will suffer during the judgment that is to come on all those who reject Him. And like Paul, I would count it all joy to suffer for Christ's sake. However, my suffering is now, not alongside of a world that has rejected Christ and will suffer the consequence for it later.
This comment thread is locked. Please enter a new comment below to start a new comment thread.
Note: Comment threads older than 2 months are automatically locked.
Do you have a Bible comment or question?
Please Sign In or Register to post comments...
Report Comment
Which best represents the problem with the comment?