Hey Chris;keep up the good work.I want ask you something about why Jews and Gentiles have to respond to the finished work of JESUS on the cross? Can you add to something that,s finished?Did JESUS offer us anything by way of an option?YOU do this and I,ll save you;If you don,t you will be lost.No He obeyed His Father and did His Father,s will.HE was sent to save the the ones that The Father gave to Him before the foundation of the world. Ephesians 1:4&5.According as He has chosen us in Him before the foundation of the world,that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love.(v5)Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by JESUS CHRIST to Himself according to the good pleasure of His will.You can,t do not one single thing to earn your salvation.Response or no response;It, all GOD.
Why evangelize if one has been predestined? It could be that as part of that, the Gospel has to be shared; & how will they hear without a preacher? Does the unbeliever even have to respond to the Gospel, since he is already predestined to obtain salvation? Indeed, can he even respond? Even to these questions, I say, Yes, because his response can only be as result of the Spirit's conviction (i.e. in his unsaved condition, he is unable to respond, nor would he want to, but under conviction, he will as he has been predestined by God). Therefore, his response is not of his effort or part in salvation's work, but a 'reaction' to the Spirit's convicting, drawing, & his repentance: and surely this is a place & time worthy of a response.
James, I've said much here, trying to deal with all that I could see in your comment, so I thought "better to say more than less" so you get a more complete picture of what I'm thinking. I hope it answers your questions.
The Bible teaches both GOD,S sovereignty in electing sinners to salvation ( John 6:44, Romans 8:29 and Ephesians 1:4.and we are commanded to evangelize and spread the gospel( Matthew 28:16-20)Why evangelize if we are predestined?Because we were commanded to do so.I believe the gospel is Preached mostly to the believer anyway .Because the unbeliever does not want hear what you are saying any way.It is totally the work of GOD. There is away I believe,to embrace predestination,and election without having our hands bound by it,when it comes to evangelism.For scripture teaches both sovereign election and necessity of evangelizing.Paul addressed this issue in ( Romans 10:13-15).R.C.Sproul commented on that passage;GOD not only foreordains the end of salvation for the elect,He also foreordains the means to that end.We are called to share the gospel and to respond in faith and obedience.So you see evangelism is still necessary in light of GOD,S sovereignty in salvation for two reasons:(1)GOD has commanded us to do it.(2)This is GOD,s chosen means of advancing His kingdom on earth.We have that privilege of being used by GOD to accomplish HIS will.What a blessing to by to bless others with the words of the BREAD OF LIFE. The apostle Paul was sent by the LORD to preach the gospel to JEW and Gentile.That by hearing they might believe,and so call on the name of the LORD and be saved.But there can be no true calling upon GOD without faith no faith without hearing no hearing without preaching and no preaching without a divine calling.Every man calls upon the god he believed in.And those that do not believe in GOD and Christ do not call on them.How shall they believe in him whom they have not heard;meaning that there is no faith in Christ without hearing of Him.There may be believing without seeing,but not believing without hearing.
James Brooks. You bring up a good point on Predestination, Election and spreading the Word. It brings to mind that the Law was given to stress that all men have sinned. The Word was given to convict us of that sin. The Law condemns us. The Word gives us life. John 3 and Romans 5.
The Law of Moses placed all mankind under sin, even those that followed that were not directly disobedient to God. The Law cannot reconcile us to God. Only Jesus can do that. Therefore, it is essential that people hear about Jesus. See also Romans 8:29-30: "For those God foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brothers. And those He predestined He also called; those He called He also justified; those He justified He also glorified."
Ephesians 1 and John 10 are clear. God has given Jesus a flock and He will not lose a single one. So, the Call goes out for the Sheep.
Thanks James, I agree with your comments. Evangelism must go on regardless as we are not privy to God's predestining & the Gospel must be heard by all, even those who won't respond so that might hear of God's Love.
Ephesians 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
2 Thessalonians 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
Does the man of sin have a chance of salvation? Perdition means to fall.
Romans Chapter 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
16 So then [it is] not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.
18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will [have mercy], and whom he will he hardeneth.
So, to you other point, I think your main point: "why Jews and Gentiles have to respond to the finished work of JESUS on the cross?" Given your apt quote from Eph 1:4,5, I agree with you without doubt, that God, not only knew us before we were born, but predestined us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ. A great portion to remind us of God's Foreknowledge of each of our lives. But how does that Knowledge affect us mere mortals? Do we know who has been predestined & who hasn't? Why are some chosen to Life & others to Death? Do we even need to evangelize?
I think, we carelessly & inadvisedly try to get into God's Mind over this, when in fact, His Omniscience & our finiteness can never allow us to comprehend this 'mystery'. The best I can do is to just know that God knows who will come to Him & that response will be because of various occurrences in that person's life; e.g. parentage, the Gospel preacher, finding a tract to read, in depression stumbling past a Church, seeing a Christian workmate's life & joy, brought into a crisis so that the Light of God can shine, etc. are some things that God uses to accomplish the salvation of that soul. We don't know who has been predestined or not, but we're responsible to share the Gospel regardless.
CHRIS IT NOT FOR ME TO KNOW WHETHER YOU WERE PREDESTINED OR NOT.THAT,S BETWEEN GOD AND YOU.And I believe GOD was aware of everything you do before you do it. Ecclesiastes 11:5 says as you do not know what is the way of the wind,Or how the bones grow in the womb of her who is with child,So you do not know the works of GOD who makes everything.You see I believe it,s GOD and Me, GOD and you, GOD and every individual right on up the line.Every relationship with GOD is personal.I,m reminded of what Peter asked JESUS and the answer JESUS gave him in John21:21&22.Don,t worry about the other man ,you follow Him.talking about tracts,stumbling past buildings going through crisis may all be true if GOD chooses to use it.JESUS told Nicodemus,you must be born again.WE must be born again to be able to enter into His Kingdom John 3:8 read.I believe at the appointed time-----those that GOD has chosen will acknowledge Him (JESUS)as LORD and SAVIOR to the GLORY of GOD the FATHER.(PHIL.2:11)What did Paul do, did he have any tracts to read?What did the thief on the cross do,past by a church and felt guilty for not going to church/No it was the appointed time.GOD used JESUS to accomplish salvation for the lost sheep.A free gift from GOD.What do you have to do if something is free/I say treasure it . Ephesians 2:8&9 GOD Bless.
Hi James, when we speak of Jesus' finished Work, we refer to His proclamation in His last Breath, "It is finished" ( Jn 19:30). What did He mean by this? Of course, in a few words, it means that His Work that the Father had sent Him to do, was now fully complete.
Then your question: "Can you add to something that's finished? Did JESUS offer us anything by way of an option?" Simply said, No. No one can add anything to what Jesus accomplished through His Sacrifice. Sadly, many believers have tried to add more to this Work, whether to add more burden to Christians, or in their failure to understand the full significance of the Gift of Grace to us. So they put many conditions to make their salvation 'more secure': keeping part or all of the Law, necessity for observance of the Ordinances, failure to regularly evangelize, denying ourselves comfort, speaking in other tongues, tithing, are some of things that quickly come to mind.
When we speak of Salvation by Grace through Faith ( Eph 2:8-10), the Bible says that it can only be by simple faith in Christ's Sacrifice & absolutely nothing else. If anything, but anything would be added to faith, then it is no longer of faith but faith + works = no salvation. Anyone practising this has in reality annulled salvation, saying, "I don't trust that this Salvation only can save me, I have to add to it, just for good measure". That belief is out of the pit of Hell. Therefore, Jesus rightly has not required anything extra from us to make our salvation 'more secure'; He has done it all.
Did I miss something?Why everything in reply on Matthew 24:38?But Carlos,thank GOD for the Word that was given for and to us to pay a sin debt that we we could never pay.Jesus redeemed us because we were incapable us redeem ourselves.Thank GOD that He does all the work.Just think for a moment-----GOD.GOD,redeeming us back to GOD(JESUS)He came to bring us eternal life,those who believe in HIM.The law convicts,the Word frees.The law was given as a substitute teacher until the Home room teacher took over.I say this with all joy.Yes Carlos,JESUS said ;My SHEEP hear my voice,and I know them and they follow me.JESUS knows His Sheep by name and when He calls them by name they come forth.James,Carlos,Chris and on and on until there is a number that no man can count.GOD Bless.
Why evangelize if one has been predestined? It could be that as part of that, the Gospel has to be shared; & how will they hear without a preacher? Does the unbeliever even have to respond to the Gospel, since he is already predestined to obtain salvation? Indeed, can he even respond? Even to these questions, I say, Yes, because his response can only be as result of the Spirit's conviction (i.e. in his unsaved condition, he is unable to respond, nor would he want to, but under conviction, he will as he has been predestined by God). Therefore, his response is not of his effort or part in salvation's work, but a 'reaction' to the Spirit's convicting, drawing, & his repentance: and surely this is a place & time worthy of a response.
James, I've said much here, trying to deal with all that I could see in your comment, so I thought "better to say more than less" so you get a more complete picture of what I'm thinking. I hope it answers your questions.
The Law of Moses placed all mankind under sin, even those that followed that were not directly disobedient to God. The Law cannot reconcile us to God. Only Jesus can do that. Therefore, it is essential that people hear about Jesus. See also Romans 8:29-30: "For those God foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brothers. And those He predestined He also called; those He called He also justified; those He justified He also glorified."
Ephesians 1 and John 10 are clear. God has given Jesus a flock and He will not lose a single one. So, the Call goes out for the Sheep.
2 Thessalonians 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
Does the man of sin have a chance of salvation? Perdition means to fall.
Romans Chapter 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
16 So then [it is] not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.
18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will [have mercy], and whom he will he hardeneth.
So, to you other point, I think your main point: "why Jews and Gentiles have to respond to the finished work of JESUS on the cross?" Given your apt quote from Eph 1:4,5, I agree with you without doubt, that God, not only knew us before we were born, but predestined us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ. A great portion to remind us of God's Foreknowledge of each of our lives. But how does that Knowledge affect us mere mortals? Do we know who has been predestined & who hasn't? Why are some chosen to Life & others to Death? Do we even need to evangelize?
I think, we carelessly & inadvisedly try to get into God's Mind over this, when in fact, His Omniscience & our finiteness can never allow us to comprehend this 'mystery'. The best I can do is to just know that God knows who will come to Him & that response will be because of various occurrences in that person's life; e.g. parentage, the Gospel preacher, finding a tract to read, in depression stumbling past a Church, seeing a Christian workmate's life & joy, brought into a crisis so that the Light of God can shine, etc. are some things that God uses to accomplish the salvation of that soul. We don't know who has been predestined or not, but we're responsible to share the Gospel regardless.
Hi James, when we speak of Jesus' finished Work, we refer to His proclamation in His last Breath, "It is finished" ( Jn 19:30). What did He mean by this? Of course, in a few words, it means that His Work that the Father had sent Him to do, was now fully complete.
Then your question: "Can you add to something that's finished? Did JESUS offer us anything by way of an option?" Simply said, No. No one can add anything to what Jesus accomplished through His Sacrifice. Sadly, many believers have tried to add more to this Work, whether to add more burden to Christians, or in their failure to understand the full significance of the Gift of Grace to us. So they put many conditions to make their salvation 'more secure': keeping part or all of the Law, necessity for observance of the Ordinances, failure to regularly evangelize, denying ourselves comfort, speaking in other tongues, tithing, are some of things that quickly come to mind.
When we speak of Salvation by Grace through Faith ( Eph 2:8-10), the Bible says that it can only be by simple faith in Christ's Sacrifice & absolutely nothing else. If anything, but anything would be added to faith, then it is no longer of faith but faith + works = no salvation. Anyone practising this has in reality annulled salvation, saying, "I don't trust that this Salvation only can save me, I have to add to it, just for good measure". That belief is out of the pit of Hell. Therefore, Jesus rightly has not required anything extra from us to make our salvation 'more secure'; He has done it all.
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