Proverbs 3:5-6 tells us to trust in the Lord and lean not on your own understanding, but acknowledge the Lord and He will direct your paths. Surely our Creator should know what is best for us; and we should have enough examples of past saints and sinners to guide us and keep us on the straight and narrow path ( 2 Timothy 3:16). Giving up all to follow Him is something that certainly takes trust; that is for God to provide basic needs and the fact that there is heavenly rewards for temporal suffering. Those living as the Disciples did would certainly need encouragement such as found in the Book of Hebrews where it says that we MUST believe He is a rewarder of those who do His will ( Hebrews 11:6). Understanding that comes from above is what allows us to believe that Christ is truly God in the flesh ( Matt. 16:17). God's wisdom through the Spirit unlocks scripture and reveals to us eternal truths about individuals as well as the fate of nations. Many hard to read scriptures have meanings cleared up with cross references; and meditating on the Word day and night helps us to bring these things to mind for our own edification and witnessing to others "in and out of season" ( 2 Tim 4:2).
A general rule of thumb is that there is no (or shouldn't be) any line of demarcation between our "spiritual" lives involving various religious duties and the rest of our work and recreational interests. There is no good substitute for daily scripture studies accompanied by prayer; but there has to be more than just head knowledge. Continuing on the subject of TRUST; other people as well need to be able to see evidence of Christ "on display" in our character and interactions before they go for deeper understanding on spiritual matters. Therefore; we must be living out what we believe and naturally be dividing the Word correctly ( 2 Tim. 2:15). In upcoming posts I will try to demonstrate how to effectively read scripture and put it to use.
Just me, seems there are fewer discussions lately on this site and Momsage's post suggested discussion. My understanding of discussions is brothers and sisters sharing their understanding of a subject not to belittle or to prove one as being wrong, but by sharing our understanding of a subject that will encourage each other to study in prayer for the truth.
What is faith? We see in Hebrews 11:1,6 We also have Romans 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
We are to have faith but our faith cannot be based on the word of man where we can be deceived and taken out of the way. Our faith must come from the word of God guided by His Spirit and His word is the Holy Scripture, He has given us.
This one subject is based on the word of man, nowhere in Scripture does it tell us we must believe or have faith in a triune God, but the opposite, Deuteronomy 6:4Mark 12:291 Timothy 2:5, and many more. "God made us a living soul" Soul is the Hebrew word nephesh, a living being, any living being, every air-breathing creature is a nephesh, a living being/soul.
Genesis 1:26 many apply the Trinity to this verse but then we must ignore verse 27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. This could also easily be first-person plural, like mom says, let us make tacos and then she is the one who makes the tacos. If we lived before 489 AD, before the Trinity doctrine was made the foundational belief of Christianity, and the punishment of heresy, how would we take this verse?
If we walk in the world we will perish, if we walk in the Spirit our faith is in Jesus and our hope is as Jesus was resurrected in His glorified body so we shall also be resurrected in our glorified body into eternal life with Him.
That is true Rainwalker, in reference to Genesis 26:5. But the question: what were the "commandments, statutes and laws" that were given to Abraham to obey? We aren't given the specifics apart from God's clear directions to him. And even if they were the same as those given to Moses (and that's an IF), how would those laws given to Abraham & later to Israel, come to bear upon those now in Christ Jesus & been given God's Spirit to reside in them?
As even the apostle stated in Romans 7:10, "And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death"; could there be any Law given, whether to Abraham, Moses, & Israel, as pure & righteous as those Laws were, have given to any of them, life (i.e. the promise of eternal life)? Each one had to stand by their faith before God, the Law giving them absolutely no justification before God ( Romans 3:20).
Likewise, the Law can have no bearing on those now In Christ, for we stand by faith alone in Christ's finished Work for us & for all who would come to Him & believe on Him. Do we then remain lawless? Rather, the Law of Faith ( Romans 3:27) now stands, as it did before to those under the Old Covenant, but now this Law (of Faith) is energized in us by the Holy Spirit giving us power to live triumphantly & acceptably before God - that which the Old Law could never do & was never designed to do. Abraham wasn't accepted simply on how well he kept whatever Laws were given him, but that it was his faith that took him beyond the letter, where he obeyed God, claimed God's Promises, & looked beyond what the physical eye & mind could apprehend ( Hebrews 11:8-10).
About perfectness. I think the Bible uses this word with various meanings
1. Lets see as Richard says Matthew 5:48, "Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.". Now the verb "be" in grk (esesthai) is in the future tense and denotes an expectation. So what Jesus is actually saying here (as I understand it) is that He expects us to become perfect like God is. Well this is impossible, isn't it? So what He means is that He expects us to strive to be like God (in character). And how is that to be done? By following His commandments, which commandments reveal the character of God to us. And since one aspect (and probably the most important) of God's character is love Jesus asks us to love each other like God does. This is something gradual, isn't it? It is something that we keep aquiring through our whole life.
If we compare it with Hebrews 5:8,9, "8Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; 9And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;" Here Jesus iwas made perfect by obeying God's commandments.
So perfectness again here means a whole route/course that we follow in our lives during which, by following God's commandements/directions we keep growing spiritually and getting to be like God in character more and more.
2. But in Hebrews 10:14, "For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified", the word perfect has a different meaning. It means the one who has no sins. So we were perfected by Jesus' Blood, that is we are righteous through His sacrifice.
3. In Hebrews 11:38-40 says, "39And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise:40God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect."
Here perfectness is something that we will aquire in Heaven when we will be dressed up with our new spiritual body, completely freed from sin, death etc
Hebrews 11:1 states: "Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." In my last post I discussed the concept of repentance and that it isn't something we merely learn by our own wisdom or intuition but that it is a gift from God as many scriptures state. 2 Timothy 2:25 as well as scriptures in Acts; 2 Peter and Romans show how repentance is granted or given by the Lord. As stated in my earlier comments no contrition on our part is able to save us. This is not to say; however that the admonition in Romans 6:1-2 isn't pertinent; we shouldn't seek to sin more for more grace. Our testimony should come from a genuine admission of realization of our state before salvation. We realize that we are no better than a murderer; adulterer or any other sinner that is repugnant to society at large. Of course our NATURE has to be understood; or else we are as Judas Iscariot did just sorry for our actions rather than realizing the cause is a rotten heart needing to die to itself and be rebirthed. Peter had a downfall and Thomas doubted but they recognized the Lord when He made Himself known to them.
My earlier statements should by no means detract from the importance of emulating external actions which are outflows of GOOD FRUIT in our lives. 1 Corinthians 11:1 (easy to memorize with this numbering) gives Paul's exhortation to imitate him as he imitates Christ. Demonstrations of such behaviors are much like a parent to a child in this case. How we need such examples in church leadership today! How many of these mega pastors live even close to Paul who would work for himself so as not to burden the churches and suffer as he did with deprivation and imprisonment for the cause of Christ?
We are not to idolize people but those of Godly character should motivate us; and also bring the fear of the Lord and His holiness to unbelievers as Paul did with the prison guard ( Acts 16:30-33). Our lifestyles must back up our words.
Fear not according to a site online (I won't name it in case that is an issue) is listed 365 times in the Bible. I am aware of the message of the angels about Christ the Savior being born to the shepherds as the verse which Charles Schultz included in the famous Peanuts Christmas story when Linus dropped the security blanket as a symbolic gesture.
Of course Franklin Roosevelt gave the quote "the only thing we have to fear is fear itself." That is true to some extent; because the enemy of our souls can only do what God allows; but of course the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom; which is found in numerous scriptural passages as well. It has been said that the opposite of fear is faith; and of course true love casts out fear ( 1 John 4:18). This is something only the Lord can give; for Jesus Himself had martyrdom to face daily; and Revelation 2:10 is one example given for the church; as well as the verse where Christ said to not fear what can be done to the body but the one who can cast body and soul into hell. ( Matthew 10:28). The enemy also likes to remind us as the accuser of the brethern of our sins and our condemnation which Christ took at the cross for true believers. (see Revelation 12:10). The Lord will convict us when we grieve the Spirit but that is out of love. The power of sin is death ( 1 Cor. 15:56). Jesus overcame death and the grave and took our sins on Himself at Calvary. We need to be daily reminded of these basic Gospel truths as we can become hardened to it for various reasons.
There is hope for us after death and hope is for things yet unseen ( Hebrews 11:1). Surely with the world in the state it is today we need that future expectation for any joy to be maintained; whether emotionally or as a fruit of the Spirit. Being part of the BODY of Christ is imperitive as to our identity so that we may together strive for unity in fulfilling the Great Commission and prayer and fellowship with one another for strength.
But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.
Romans 8:38-39 says:
For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
It would seem that we are coming to the fulfillment of both Psalm 83 and one of Isaiah 17:1 very soon as well. At some point a false peace will take over at the first seal of Revelation and it could appear to head that way immediately before then; followed by the Rapture. We probably have years ahead; if He tarries of unprecedented persecution and sad to say martyrdom. We are said to be hated of ALL nations; then the end will come ( Matthew 24:9). This could have a final fulfillment during the Tribulation but also could be speaking of today.
Prayer of course is paramount. I know someone who has recently moved to Israel in the ministry (I will leave out his name and position for security sake). He and his wife see firsthand the displacement of hundreds of thousands from the border areas being attacked on multiple fronts. There are those behind the scenes funding and staging the mass demonstrations in several cities today who no doubt will not stop until they are forced to and have no less goal than overthrowing our government and making this into a Muslim country with Sharia law. No doubt we should continue to pray for individuals the Lord puts into our lives. Some things are better avoided; but we all need to search our hearts to trust God if we need to defend the life of another in these situations of mass looting and no doubt increasing violence. We all need to prepare for martial law at the very least. The end is near and now it is vital that we preach it and trust God iving obediently
Thank you Valmar. To respond & also I'm in agreement with you, No, the Triune God never changes - as well as His requirement of faith to please Him & be acceptable to Him. The OT folk were accepted by God because of their faith in Him for Who He was (as revealed to them) & they were confident that He would fulfill all that He had promised to them. Those who died in their sins were the disobedient & faithless & could never please Him & suffered under His Hand. So, the essential requirement was Faith & when the Law & Commandments came to them, they were to obey fully in their strength, looking unto their Maker only.
So, what changed with the coming of Jesus Christ? Faith was still the requirement ( Hebrews 11:6), but it was no longer a human faith, based on human works, to be acceptable to God. The OT faithful (looking forward) would have their sins paid for at Calvary, just as those who would believe from Israel & Gentiles post-Calvary. But now, we don't receive a set of rules to follow to please God - we don't muster up (our) faith to be acceptable - and we contribute nothing in works (sacrifices, feasts, sabbaths, washings, etc.) towards our salvation.
For this reason, I sought your thoughts on the work of the Holy Spirit, He Who was sent by Jesus ( John 15:26; John 16:7; Galatians 4:6), a Spirit that the OT faithful never received for the renewing & enlivening of their hearts - only at Pentecost such a mighty Work of God took place. God indeed has not changed, but the Cross has changed how man stands before God. To Page 2.
I know the two resurrection you speak of, most believe what you believe.
The word speaks of Christ resurrection, then the resurrection of those who never believe that were raised with Christ.
Colossians 3:1 ... if ye be RISEN with Christ ....
Ephesians 2:6 .... and hath RAISED US us up together ....
Isaiah 26:19 .... TOGETHER with my dead body shall they ARISE ....
Hosea 6:2 ..... in the third day he will raise US UP .......
The saints that arose with Christ, were the Old Testament saints that had died in faith, but had never receive their promise of eternal life.
Those: in Revelation under the alter clothed in white are the Old saints awaiting their promise, eternal life, by their resurrection of Christ.
These are the 144,000 raised with Christ, the firstfruits of the resurrection.
Hebrews 11:39 And these all, havlng obtained a good report through faith, received not the PROMISE (eternal life).
Hebrews 11:40 Christ having provided some BETTER THING FOR US (never having to die and wait in the grave), that they WITHOUT US should not be made PERFECT (by our resurrection as one).
Hebrews 5:9 ...and having been made perfect .... by our resurrection as one ....
Philippians 3:15 Let us therefore who be perfect (by our resurrection as one), be thus minded: and if in any thing you be otherwise mined, God shall reveal even this to you.
As I said "Christ is truth and by faith we believe him! Why? Because the Holyspirit testifies of him!
Is faith 'not" a gift of God? Yes it is.
Is it not caused by the Holyspirit?
Yes, it is persuasion.
It's NOT man's faith we're discussing here but Christ faith.
For example;
Take 1 Corinthians 2:9-14 and harmonize it with your meaning of faith and you will see "IF" it directly means belief then it doesn't change anything according to the context we're debating.
That what you believe in has to be given for us to have faith and trust in God!
Vs 9) But as it is written, EYE HATH NOT SEEN, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.
Vs 10) But GOD HATH REVEALED THEM UNTO US BY HIS SPIRIT: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.)
"That's Persuasion! (9 Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man.
10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: ) [ Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. Hebrews 11:1]
IF YOU TRANSLATED THAT TO BELIEF, IT STILL NOT OF YOURSELF!
Vs 11. For WHAT MAN KNOWETH THE THINGS OF A MAN, SAVE THE SPIRIT OF MAN WHICH IS IN HIM? EVEN SO THE THINGS OF GOD KNOWETH NO MAN, BUT THE SPIRIT OF GOD.
There's your source of belief/faith/Persuasion Giannis.
Vs 12. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; THAT WE MIGHT KNOW THE THINGS THAT ARE FREELY GIVEN TO US OF GOD.
Vs 13. Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: IT IS THE GIFT OF GOD:
The problem with the question of eternal security lies in having NO KNOWLEDGE of God's WORD.
If one deeply studies the PROPHECIES, one will see that at some point in the ages to come all the tribes of Israel are going to once again exit.
BUT, in this AGE he is ONLY calling out the PREISTHOOD, the house of David, the kind of firstfruits as is the tribe of Judah, lawgivers that will rule and reign and serve him when he resurrects all the DEAD back to there bodies of flesh and blood.
If one studies under the spirit of truth, you find these prophecies in the blessings of Israel to his twelve sons, from the beginning the tribe of Judah was CHOSEN to be God's lawgiver. The blessing on the remaining tribes will be fulfilled after all the lawgivers are put in place.
Isaiah, Ezekiel, Zachariah, and Revelation all prophesy ONLY a PART will be save in this age, one third (probably symbolic) since other prophecies seem to say ONE TENTH, the tithe to God, those without blemish being sacrificed with Christ on HIS CROSS.
You find this in the blessings of Jacob and Esau.
Hebrews 11:20 By faith Isaac blessed Jacob and Esau CONCERNING THINGS TO COME.
There are TWO DEATHS, TWO RESURRECTION and TWO JUDGEMENTS,
The first death and resurrection is those SAVED in this AGE, the ones Christ CAUSES TO BELIEVE in this AGE, they are being judged by the words of God.
1 Timothy 4:10 ... who is the SAVIOUR of ALL MEN (not necessarily in this AGE), especially THOSE (in this AGE) that BELIEVE.
Isaiah 6:13 But yet in it (the land) shall be a tenth, and it (the tenth) shall be eaten (same as Christ is eaten, eat the words and digest them) as a teil tree, and as an oak, whose substance (CHRIST) IS IN THEM, when they cast their leaves (administer judgement), so the HOLY SEED shall be the substance thereof.
Obadiah 1:21 And SAVIOURS (those conformed to the image of Christ) SHALL COME upon Mt, Zion to JUDGE the house of ESAU
a very important subject here in both topics, faith & suffering
1.Faith, we all know that Rom 10:17, Paul earlier says it is Rom 10:8 he's not talking about the letter here
But John 6:63 The Grace / Light that appears in the heart bringing salvation to all mankind Hebrews 9:28 that wait on Him.
Believing that it is He, speaking to us & His first works within us is teaching us to deny all ungodliness & the learning of righteousness
Paul says in Gal 3:2 so there's an increase of His Spirit as we received His judgement of sin & instruction in righteousness.
Here is Power offered to overcome all sin. For He who show us our sin, will not only take them away, but power is given to preserve from repeating the sin. There is one requirement, a truly contrite & broke heart birth through godly sorrow for the offense. This is saving faith produce by the Spirit, True faith purifies the heart, cleanses the vessel 2 Timothy 2:21
2.Suffering 2Timothy 3:12
As we look through both Testaments, we see a common thread, the suffering of the faithful
Paul by the Spirit call them 2Cor 4:17 which suffering brings a far more eternal weigh of glory
Hebrews 11:35,38 attain a better resurrection, whom the world was not worthy of.
We must have a renewing of our minds as Paul contiu.. 2Cor 4:18
What an encouragement on this side of the grave, & the reward is eternal,
Folks,
lets pick up our Cross & follow Jesus, He merciful & faithfully cleanses us from all unrighteousness, takes away our sins against Him, continually increases us with His Spirit alone the Way, until we are baptize unto His death, being dead unto sin, baptizes us in His Spirit, each one fitted in the body according to His gifts, we enter into the fellowship of His suffering (He's there with us ) therefore we experience the Power of His resurrection, & He never leaves us or forsakes us.
Then rewards us for what He alone done through us, what a deal, Come on!
Lev 26:15-21 God is speaking to His people, the history of the children of Israel full of this. 2 Chronicles 7:14Jeremiah 3:22Hosea 6:1,2
Christ brings this into the NT John 12:40Acts 28:27
Hebrews 12:5-11 speaking of His children
He does this in His merciful lovingkindness to us, we being so blinded by the deceitfulness of sin, it must be scourge out, define as "to flog" lit or fig, God as a father chastising and training men as children by affliction,
Chastisement; Education or training; by implication, disciplinary correction, chastening, instruction, nurture.
There's two kinds of fear, & many manifestations of each, all grounded in one of the two, godly fear which foundation is grounded in obedient reverential love for God.
The other, Satan counter part, grounded in disobedience which brings torment, where condemnation & guilt in one's own heart follows them wherever they go, for they have offended the Holy God; they having continue in disobedience to the Grace of God which appears in their hearts.
God's love in chastising correction, cast this fear & torment out
& why? John 14:21, which defines love, which makes way for John 14:23 one's habitation becomes a dwelling place for Perfect Love in the work of Sanctification of the Spirit unto obedience & sprinkling of the Blood/Life of Jesus.
thus "for our profit, that we might be partakers of His holiness.
Hebrews 12:11 exercising the Grace of God, the Word of Righteousness in discerning between Good & evil,, there's suffering in the Cross to learn righteousness. 1Pet 4:1
Then we have Job, who God said is perfect, Job 2:3; which trials, suffering & afflictions is of a much higher concept than punishment for disobedience, James 5:11
Hebrews 11:33 for this purpose "obtain a better resurrection"
one eighty, you would do well to live out your call name.
your in darkness, deceived; dwelling, speaking & judging falsely against God
OSAS: Another character in the "hall of fame" of saints from Hebrews 11.
Sampson. Hebrews 11:32 mentions Sampson in passing but doesn't elaborate on the subject.
Judges 13 gets into the beginning of the story of Manoah and his wife who had an angelic visitation from God announcing the birth of Sampson and the prophesied deliverance from the Philistines that his life would enable. Interestingly the angel appeared both times to the woman and it seemed this unnamed wife had more sense than her husband who was convinced they would die after such a visitation. Perhaps Sampson's upbringing in such a household led to some of his irrational behaviors as he grew up.
Judges 16 shows where Sampson ended up with Delilah; who ultimately sapped his strength to the point where he was blinded and no longer able to resist his enemies who were using her against him. He had lost his wife according to Judges 14:3 after they killed her following his vengeance in killing 30 Philistines. This tragedy could have been avoided if he had married within his people. He would continue to follow his affections; yet somehow God saw that he had genuine faith. This is perhaps best illustrated when he deliberately gave up his life in knocking down the pillars of Dagon's temple in Judges 16:29; and kills more Philistines than he did his entire life previously.
How we end life clearly is important; if the rest of our life is screwed up but we end it well then we can enter into heaven; the other extreme exists for those who turn away at the last minute; sadly a friend of mine said that was the case with his mother after being in a home where believers surrounded her the last few months of her life she turned away from the faith.
The examples in the last few posts show how God knows the heart; we can never be sure someone can't turn at the last minute but certainly shouldn't count on it. Matthew 7:20 shows us how in time we can see those who are truly saved by GOOD FRUIT.
In assessing Lot's narrow escape from Sodom; the patience of God is unmistakeable. The angels put up with the hemming and hawing in Lot's pathetic request to go to a closer town rather than far away in the mountains to escape (see Genesis 19:20). In the end he ends up fleeing further once he sees the destruction.
REMEMBER LOT'S WIFE. I highly recommend the tract by Chapel Library on this topic with this title. ( Genesis 19:26). I cannot ultimately prove that Lot's wife was lost in her curiousity to look back but it certainly cost her her life. We are reminded; of course of the verse in Luke 9:62 of he who looks back once he has put his hand to the plough not being suitable for the Kingdom of God.
It would seem that Lot's wife couldn't have been alongside him and turned to a pillar of salt the same distance away from the destruction. It would seem she lagged some distance behind OR stood still quite a while when Lot continued on before this happened. Anyway; the tract I mentioned shows her priviledge in being in a home where someone read God's word and believed. I would say that it was probably much compromised what Lot was actually teaching as head of the household not to mention what his daughters knew scripturally. She was nonetheless without excuse; if we look at Rahab "the harlot" and her commendation saving the spies and preservation of life and listed in Hebrews 11 as an example of faith ( Hebrews 11:31) she was commended and actually part of the lineage of Christ eventually. Being OBEDIENT at such a time requires true faith; and Lot's wife clearly was more enamored with the world in this case than a pagan prostitute because of the ACTIONS demonstrating faith or lack thereof. This is why works ARE important. In all this we can't ignore Abraham's pleading to God in Gen. 18:32; clearly he had Lot in mind and his family to be the rightous who would escape. His sons in law ended up being wicked.
Lord Jesus, I plea that You tell/show one way or another to K., that her behavior greatly displeases You. Open up her spiritual eyes that she sees that there is no playing around with You, God. I also plea that You, Jesus comfort K. Whatever situation your child is going through be there and embrace Your child with Your love. Father God, You sent Jesus to heal M. What we need is Hebrews 11:1 "evidence" Since we all believe in Your word. I plea that You also speak to O., Your child, guide and lead her/him on the right path. In the Mighty Name of Jesus Christ.
By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison.
I also believe this quote by Peter in 1 Peter 3:19-20 doesn't say Christ went into Hell and preached to the Spirits in prison.
I believe verse 20 tells us WHEN he preached to those in prison.
(Verse 20)
Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, WHILE THE ARK WAS A PREPARING, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
I believe the building of the ark, the material used and the ark itself presents a type in the work of Christ and Christ himself.
Hebrews 11:7 By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.
I also believe Ephesians 4:8-9 has to be interpreted separate from 1 Peter.
"Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.
Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?
I believe this passage of scripture is saying Jesus rose victorious from the grave. He paid the price for the sin of the world through His sacrificial death and Resurrection, and broke the power of sin, Satan, death, and hell.
I believe at this point those saved in the Old Testament leaves Abraham's bosom and goes to be with the Lord.
And so do we when we die.
Also, I believe Satan will be bound by a great Angel, not the Lord. That is yet future. Revelation 20:1-2.
The conditions in Revelation 20:3-5 hasn't happened yet.
Genesis 13:14-17 And the LORD said unto Abram, after that Lot was separated from him, Lift up now thine eyes, and look from the place where thou art northward, and southward, and eastward, and westward: For all the LAND which thou seest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed FOR EVER. And I will make thy seed as the dust of the earth: so that if a man can number the dust of the earth, then shall thy seed also be numbered. Arise, walk through the land in the length of it and in the breadth of it; for I will give it unto thee.
Hebrews 11:8-10 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an INHERITANCE, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went. By faith he sojourned in the LAND OF PROMISE, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the HEIRS with him of the SAME PROMISE: For he looked for a CITY WHICH HATH FOUNDATIONS, whose BUILDER AND MAKER IS GOD.
Hebrews 11:13-18 These all died in faith, not having received the PROMISES, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were STRANGERS and PILGRIMS on the earth. For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country. And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned. But now they desire a BETTER COUNTRY , that is, an HEAVENLY: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God:
Hebrews 11:39,40 And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise: God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect.
The Promise of the Land, the Inheritance, the City, is the Kingdom of God, New Heavens and New Earth which are, ETERNAL, FOR EVER. It is not a piece of property on this sin-cursed earth which will be destroyed.
Then what about Abraham? Abraham was dead & buried, how could he being dead rejoice to see Jesus' Day, this is the Day of Jesus' Coming? This wasn't a situation of (the Genesis) Abraham knowing about Jesus & waiting patiently with joy, for Jesus' Sacrifice & Redemption. This dialogue with the Jews was to show that Abraham was alive in Hades all this time, but NOW rejoicing to see the Messiah finally come (in Jesus' Day) Who would give full atonement to him & all others waiting in hope.
Yes, Abraham, as those many others, 'who looked for a heavenly city', expected it (in faith) & died (in faith), "not having received the promises, but seeing them afar off" ( Hebrews 11:13,16). Their faith/faithfulness to God was vibrant even to this point in their death & confinement in Hades, but until the Atonement was completed at Calvary, they remained in limbo, waiting, in expectation of the promised eternal rest that awaited them, to have Christ's Blood applied to them as well.
Now the Gospel was complete for them (what they once knew imperfectly); the eternal Rest they longed for was now realized in Christ Jesus, in Whose Blood there is Peace with God ( Colossians 1:20) & eternal Rest in Christ ( Hebrews 4:9). GBU.
I agree 100% what you have said that OT Israel knew nothing of a coming Messiah's Sacrifice of His Life for them & substitutionary payment. Hence, the word 'Gospel' mentioned in Hebrews 4 is not the same Gospel they received as is the complete Gospel that the Apostles preached post-Cross. (Perhaps not in the way it is preached in 1 Corinthians 15:3-4)
I believe the OT saints did what was required of them at that time to make them just with God. Their temporal rituals and sacrifices exemplified the Gospel and perhaps the resurrection was preached by "type" when Issac was offered as a sacrifice by Abraham. Hebrews 11:17-19.
However, could they have perceived it, being that Jeremiah 31:31-34 have not taken place yet?
When we study Hebrews in its entirety, we know that this new covenant was not to come under the Levitical covenant. This is clearly seen in Hebrews Ch 7 and 8.
So, when we look back at this, Israel mind was blinded and there was a veil upon their hearts, as mentioned in 2 Corinthians 3:14-16. "But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the Old Testament, which vail is done away in Christ.
But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.
Nevertheless when "it" shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away. (The "it" mentioned here is their hearts.)
When Israel turns their hearts to God the veil and the blindness shall be taken away.
This is what Paul is saying in Romans 11.
Israel was incapable of receiving the revelation of the Gospel under the Levitical High Priest and if you study the Gospels carefully, neither could the Apostles until the death of the one that filled the role of the Levitical Priesthood at the Cross.
(I believe this is what John's baptism was all about)
The resurrection began the new covenant under the new Priest hood. ( Hebrews 7:15-16.)
The Chruch is the true Israel of God and heirs to God's promises to Abraham
Galatians 3:29 'And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.'
Galatians 6"15-16 'For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature. And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and the mercy, and upon the Israel of God.'
All who are in Christ through faith, as Abraham was, are the seed that receive the promise of God to Abraham, the inheritance Abraham looked forward to, the heavenly Jerusalem. Hebrews 11:10.
The promise of the physical land to Abraham and the Israelites was a shadow pointing to the heavenly land of promise, the New heavens and new earth of eternal life with Jesus. The land of Israel was described as flowing with milk and honey, the New Jerusalem is described as flowing with living waters and fruit from the tree of life continually. Both figurative language for the abundant blessings of life in abundance from God for those who are of the faith of Abraham.
For it has been granted to you not only to believe in Christ but also to suffer for him (Phillipians 1:29). Acts 5:41 is in a similar vein; namely being thankful for being worthy to be persecuted in His name; which is promised for all true believers. ( 2 Tim. 3:12; etal). The promise of being chastised if we are a true child of God and other sufferings aren't exactly the first thing we focus on
when it comes to God's promises. But of course if we consider these hard sayings first; we can learn to appreciate the more pleasurable promises in a greater way.
The opposite is true of course; in light of Hebrews 11:25. Sin runs its course of earthly pleasures; which lead up to eternal condemnation. For God's children; however there are pleasures evermore in His right hand ( Psalm 16:11). The fullness of life is also mentioned in that verse which corresponds with John 10:10 in living life to the full. Food and clothing are promised in the Gospels ( Matt. 6:25); (compare with 1 Kings 17:6 where the ravens brought Elijah food). Notice that shelter or a place to rest His head is mentioned as lacking in Matthew 8:20; which made some turn away from following Him. Surely Christ Himself did stay in peoples' homes for short interludes; but He also spent many nights on mountains in prayer; or sleeping on a boat.
Much prayer; of course seems to be edifying when focused on fulfilling the Great Commission. God states in Isaiah 55:11; that His word will not go out void; but accomplish His purposes. If we are doing His work; then we can be sure to reap what we sow; in terms of reward (see Psalm 126:5). Heavenly treasures are a promise for those who are serving out of a pure heart (see 2 Timothy 4:7-8). Therefore; the end ouf our sufferings in Christ will bring eternal glory that outweighs anything on earth. (see Romans 8:18). 2 Corinthians 4:17-18 also discusses "momentary afflictions" that don't compare to heavenly bliss.
I think our point of difference here is on Faith: did the OT faithful (the elect) have a God-given faith so as to be accepted, or did they come in their own faith, which God accepted looking ahead to the Cross? Yet knowing, that faith could never save them - only Christ's Blood. Hebrews 11:39,40, "And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise: God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect." We have been made perfect (cleansed, holy) in Christ & so also those others to join us as new creatures in Christ Jesus, that which they could only hope for & never attained.
f. Born again. The entrance of the Holy Spirit into a sinner's life: the sinner who has heard & understood the Gospel in view to the wretchedness of his sins & holiness of God, repented, called upon God for salvation, & God's Gift of Salvation & of His Spirit, Who seals, secures, & ministers to every area of the person's life. The once lost, despairing & fearful under the judgement of God, now enjoys peace with God, freedom from sin's grip, victory over temptations, power & desire to live unto God & not to self, & the assurance of God's tender care to eternity, would show the redeemed one this dramatic change in life that can only be done by the Power of God. I see this, in brief, the re-birth work of the Holy Spirit & resulting effect on this 'new' person's life ( 2 Corinthians 5:17).
I trust brother that my comments have gone some way to help you understand what I believe.
The Faith of Abraham and Sarah resulted in a Child called Isaac.....Which was a Child of Promise....Their Faith was a type of a pregnancy....Abraham wd be the Father of a multitude.....Sarah was too old to have Children.....But she got pregnant b/c of their faith which answers to the 1st Promise that Abraham wd be multiplied as the sands of the seas.....But God didn't Sware by himself in the 1st Promise.....Of the multiplication of Abraham's seed......God only swore by himself in the 2 nd Promise...That Christ wd be mutiplied as the stars of Heaven which was a New Covenant Gen.22 :17.....When Jesus died at Calvary....when a seed dies it multiplies...So Faith under this New covenant has a greater Promise.....Thus the Child of Promise under the new covenant is the H.G....The Child of Promise By Faith.....Real Faith under this N.C. is a spiritual pregnancy......Its Christ that is gona be multiplied as the stars of heaven..... Hebrews 11:1 Faith is the substance of things hoped for the evidence of things not seen.....When a woman is pregnant she has the substance of things hoped for the evidence of things not seen.....She brought forth a manchild....Which is the Child of PROMISE....Remember that 2 nd Promise when God swore by himself......Thats y Jesus is saying to whom the word came it made them Gods.....b/c i have spoken these words ( his seeds ) Sorrows have filled your hearts a spiritual pregnancy.....As Faith comes by hearing his word which are his seeds.....Everything under this N.C. is heavenly in the spiritual realm.....As we have borne the image of the earthy we must also bear the image of the heavenly.....Now its the H.G. that is the Child of Promise....Our new Heart and new Spirit.....Thats y Jesus is saying that which is born of the spirit is spirit...Which is that Child of Promise the H.G.....Thats y he always refers to himself as the Son of man.....Mankind is gonna have a baby Christ.....But there was no such seed under the O.T...H.G.IS GONA BE BORN IN US.
Thanks David0921; I think that this matter of 'believing on God' or even 'believing that God is able', is to be seen as different as to what we call 'saving faith', or a faith (act of trusting) in God to effect His Work of Salvation. It might sound like a 'grasping at straws' to convince another, but for me to adequately understand & apply this matter of 'ordinary faith & saving faith', is important. In the case of the OT folk, as we read here in Romans 4 about Abraham & David, the mention of Abraham's faith being "counted for righteousness", I understand that from what he knew & experienced of God, he exhibited human (ordinary) faith towards Him. And this was a faith based on his knowledge & his works to please God (as with Enoch, Hebrews 11:5). I don't perceive this was a special gift of faith for these men to exhibit, but an ordinary faith resulting from God revealing Himself to them & their desire to serve only Him.
But then we come to the NT & Ephesians 2:8,9. Even though unregenerate man, as those of the OT, can still express faith, whether towards God or man, in Ephesians we see that for the saving Work of Christ to be effective, we have the indivisible combination of both God's Grace & His Faith given for that to happen. In other words, God could have just given the sinner His Grace by way of sending His Son for them, but can that sinner, from an unregenerate heart, create a faith that can truly understand, embrace, & consistently live out the great salvation of God? And that is why Ephesians 2:8 shows, "and that not of yourselves": the Gift of God is both His Grace & His Faith that would instigate & complete salvation in that lost soul. Onto Page 2.
Thank you David0921; you have written extensively on this subject & asked many questions. I don't plan to give as much detail as it deserves, but will address some of it.
The Bible from Genesis to Malachi is about God's dealings with His people, Israel - giving them the Law & associated punishments for their disobedience. From Jesus' teachings (Gospels) onwards (the fuller meaning of aspects of that Law to Revelation), the saved Jew & Gentile can learn & apply the full requirements of all of God's Laws by the Work & Power of the Holy Spirit within them. So then, can the Gentile, whether unbelieving or believing, learn anything from the Old Law? Most certainly, but realizing that that Law was served to Israel only to show them God's requirements for them, their sinful state ( Romans 7:7), their inability to fully obey them, & their need for God's Help to deal with sin. To the God-fearing Jew under the Law, their hope & faith remained in the God they served, looking for His Redemption ( Hebrews 11:1,2,39,40); & this applied to those pre-Law & certainly pre-Christ, in Whom their redemption would one day be realized.
Romans 3:31. Romans 3:28, "we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law". This is the essence of this chapter, of justification of both Jew & Gentile through faith & not dependence on the Law. Is the Law then nullified because of faith? Paul writes, "we establish the Law"; i.e. the Law's role was to make men conscious of sin (v20) & this aspect of the Law (revealing sin) is confirmed by all those who turn from sin to Christ in faith. The Law couldn't effect salvation in Jesus - only Faith in Him could. The Law served/serves its purpose, but could never bring release. Why should we then put ourselves under it by reverting to it & placing its Holy Commands with punishment on those who need the liberty found by faith in Jesus? Onto Page 2.
Moses and Aaron went before the Lord at the entrance to the tabernacle and the glory of the Lord appeared to them, instructing Moses to take the rod (of Aaron) and SPEAK to THE rock before them. Was this a natural rock that was already in this wilderness or was this a rock that they carried with them throughout the wilderness journey? ( 1Cor. 10:4 says that the spiritual rock followed them; which was Christ)
Moses and Aaron then went out to the people. Moses derides the people angrily and strikes the rock twice. Water flows from it miraculously. God disciplines Moses for sinning in the way he carried out God's instructions. God did not tell Moses to strike the rock, just speak to it. Perhaps Moses had thought that since he had struck the rock the first time ( Exodus 17) that that is the way he was to always do this. God did not tell Moses to scold the people in anger. Unfortunately, Moses sinned by not following the exact instructions of God, but added to what God had told him to do. Moses credited himself to be the one to bring water out of the rock rather than give God the credit and glory for it alone. He did not sanctify God in this instance before the people fo Israel.
The result of this sin was that Moses would not enter the promised land. Moses did not argue with God. He did not bargain with Him. Nor did he intercede for himself. He accepted the will of God. He knew that there was an eternal promised land (like Abraham) he would enter that was better than the physical land. ( Hebrews 11:39-40) Moses knew of the Messiah, the gospel that that would come from Him, and the salvation that he would receive from Him ( Gal. 3:8).
So here, as in Exodus, the waters of Meribah were bitter-sweet. Bitter because the people received discipline from God, but sweet, because God was merciful towards them and provided the water they sorely needed.
Moses must have known that his life was coming to an end soon.
All the saints (elders) in the old testament died a physical death; because Christ, the promised SEED had not yet COME to give ALL immortal life by his resurrection.
Ezekiel 18:4 .... the SOUL that sinneth it shall DIE .....the soul goes to the grave .....
The promise in both the Old and New Testament has always been the promise of eternal live, destroying the enemy of man, DEATH.
Hebrews 11:39 And these all (the saints in the Old testament), having obtained a good report through faith (believing in the coming messiah to deliver them from death), RECEIVED NOT THE PROMISE.
Hebrews 11:40 For God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect (resurrected with Christ, Christ ONLY is perfect and hath immortality dwelling in the light .... 1 Timothy 6:16)
Matthew 27:52-53
All creation was given immortality at the same time: when Christ was resurrected; Christ only was resurrected, creating a NEW CREATION.
Revelation 21:5 ... Behold, I MAKE ALL THINGS NEW ....
2 Corinthians 5:17 Therefore if any man be in CHRIST (Christ ONLY was resurrected), he is a NEW creature: old things have passed away, Behold, all things have become NEW.
Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow (God foreknew all creation), he did also PREDESTINATE (by Christ resurrection) to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the FIRSTBORN (Christ ONLY arose) of many brethren (CHRISTians).
Proverbs 3:5-6 tells us to trust in the Lord and lean not on your own understanding, but acknowledge the Lord and He will direct your paths. Surely our Creator should know what is best for us; and we should have enough examples of past saints and sinners to guide us and keep us on the straight and narrow path ( 2 Timothy 3:16). Giving up all to follow Him is something that certainly takes trust; that is for God to provide basic needs and the fact that there is heavenly rewards for temporal suffering. Those living as the Disciples did would certainly need encouragement such as found in the Book of Hebrews where it says that we MUST believe He is a rewarder of those who do His will ( Hebrews 11:6). Understanding that comes from above is what allows us to believe that Christ is truly God in the flesh ( Matt. 16:17). God's wisdom through the Spirit unlocks scripture and reveals to us eternal truths about individuals as well as the fate of nations. Many hard to read scriptures have meanings cleared up with cross references; and meditating on the Word day and night helps us to bring these things to mind for our own edification and witnessing to others "in and out of season" ( 2 Tim 4:2).
A general rule of thumb is that there is no (or shouldn't be) any line of demarcation between our "spiritual" lives involving various religious duties and the rest of our work and recreational interests. There is no good substitute for daily scripture studies accompanied by prayer; but there has to be more than just head knowledge. Continuing on the subject of TRUST; other people as well need to be able to see evidence of Christ "on display" in our character and interactions before they go for deeper understanding on spiritual matters. Therefore; we must be living out what we believe and naturally be dividing the Word correctly ( 2 Tim. 2:15). In upcoming posts I will try to demonstrate how to effectively read scripture and put it to use.
Just me, seems there are fewer discussions lately on this site and Momsage's post suggested discussion. My understanding of discussions is brothers and sisters sharing their understanding of a subject not to belittle or to prove one as being wrong, but by sharing our understanding of a subject that will encourage each other to study in prayer for the truth.
What is faith? We see in Hebrews 11:1,6 We also have Romans 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
We are to have faith but our faith cannot be based on the word of man where we can be deceived and taken out of the way. Our faith must come from the word of God guided by His Spirit and His word is the Holy Scripture, He has given us.
This one subject is based on the word of man, nowhere in Scripture does it tell us we must believe or have faith in a triune God, but the opposite, Deuteronomy 6:4 Mark 12:29 1 Timothy 2:5, and many more. "God made us a living soul" Soul is the Hebrew word nephesh, a living being, any living being, every air-breathing creature is a nephesh, a living being/soul.
Genesis 1:26 many apply the Trinity to this verse but then we must ignore verse 27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. This could also easily be first-person plural, like mom says, let us make tacos and then she is the one who makes the tacos. If we lived before 489 AD, before the Trinity doctrine was made the foundational belief of Christianity, and the punishment of heresy, how would we take this verse?
If we walk in the world we will perish, if we walk in the Spirit our faith is in Jesus and our hope is as Jesus was resurrected in His glorified body so we shall also be resurrected in our glorified body into eternal life with Him.
God bless,
RLW
As even the apostle stated in Romans 7:10, "And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death"; could there be any Law given, whether to Abraham, Moses, & Israel, as pure & righteous as those Laws were, have given to any of them, life (i.e. the promise of eternal life)? Each one had to stand by their faith before God, the Law giving them absolutely no justification before God ( Romans 3:20).
Likewise, the Law can have no bearing on those now In Christ, for we stand by faith alone in Christ's finished Work for us & for all who would come to Him & believe on Him. Do we then remain lawless? Rather, the Law of Faith ( Romans 3:27) now stands, as it did before to those under the Old Covenant, but now this Law (of Faith) is energized in us by the Holy Spirit giving us power to live triumphantly & acceptably before God - that which the Old Law could never do & was never designed to do. Abraham wasn't accepted simply on how well he kept whatever Laws were given him, but that it was his faith that took him beyond the letter, where he obeyed God, claimed God's Promises, & looked beyond what the physical eye & mind could apprehend ( Hebrews 11:8-10).
About perfectness. I think the Bible uses this word with various meanings
1. Lets see as Richard says Matthew 5:48, "Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.". Now the verb "be" in grk (esesthai) is in the future tense and denotes an expectation. So what Jesus is actually saying here (as I understand it) is that He expects us to become perfect like God is. Well this is impossible, isn't it? So what He means is that He expects us to strive to be like God (in character). And how is that to be done? By following His commandments, which commandments reveal the character of God to us. And since one aspect (and probably the most important) of God's character is love Jesus asks us to love each other like God does. This is something gradual, isn't it? It is something that we keep aquiring through our whole life.
If we compare it with Hebrews 5:8,9, "8Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; 9And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;" Here Jesus iwas made perfect by obeying God's commandments.
So perfectness again here means a whole route/course that we follow in our lives during which, by following God's commandements/directions we keep growing spiritually and getting to be like God in character more and more.
2. But in Hebrews 10:14, "For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified", the word perfect has a different meaning. It means the one who has no sins. So we were perfected by Jesus' Blood, that is we are righteous through His sacrifice.
3. In Hebrews 11:38-40 says, "39And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise:40God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect."
Here perfectness is something that we will aquire in Heaven when we will be dressed up with our new spiritual body, completely freed from sin, death etc
My earlier statements should by no means detract from the importance of emulating external actions which are outflows of GOOD FRUIT in our lives. 1 Corinthians 11:1 (easy to memorize with this numbering) gives Paul's exhortation to imitate him as he imitates Christ. Demonstrations of such behaviors are much like a parent to a child in this case. How we need such examples in church leadership today! How many of these mega pastors live even close to Paul who would work for himself so as not to burden the churches and suffer as he did with deprivation and imprisonment for the cause of Christ?
We are not to idolize people but those of Godly character should motivate us; and also bring the fear of the Lord and His holiness to unbelievers as Paul did with the prison guard ( Acts 16:30-33). Our lifestyles must back up our words.
We need YOUR wisdom LORD as our country is in tail spin downward in all areas. FATHER, bless the peace in Jerusalem as the conflict is spreading.
May our prayers reflect the faith, and trust we have in YOU LORD.
Thank YOU LORD JESUS for blessing us and reminding us of the work before us in reaching the lost and hardened hearts.
Thank YOU FATHER for shining YOUR face upon us and blessing us gloriously.
January 12, 2024
Of course Franklin Roosevelt gave the quote "the only thing we have to fear is fear itself." That is true to some extent; because the enemy of our souls can only do what God allows; but of course the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom; which is found in numerous scriptural passages as well. It has been said that the opposite of fear is faith; and of course true love casts out fear ( 1 John 4:18). This is something only the Lord can give; for Jesus Himself had martyrdom to face daily; and Revelation 2:10 is one example given for the church; as well as the verse where Christ said to not fear what can be done to the body but the one who can cast body and soul into hell. ( Matthew 10:28). The enemy also likes to remind us as the accuser of the brethern of our sins and our condemnation which Christ took at the cross for true believers. (see Revelation 12:10). The Lord will convict us when we grieve the Spirit but that is out of love. The power of sin is death ( 1 Cor. 15:56). Jesus overcame death and the grave and took our sins on Himself at Calvary. We need to be daily reminded of these basic Gospel truths as we can become hardened to it for various reasons.
There is hope for us after death and hope is for things yet unseen ( Hebrews 11:1). Surely with the world in the state it is today we need that future expectation for any joy to be maintained; whether emotionally or as a fruit of the Spirit. Being part of the BODY of Christ is imperitive as to our identity so that we may together strive for unity in fulfilling the Great Commission and prayer and fellowship with one another for strength.
But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.
Romans 8:38-39 says:
For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
It would seem that we are coming to the fulfillment of both Psalm 83 and one of Isaiah 17:1 very soon as well. At some point a false peace will take over at the first seal of Revelation and it could appear to head that way immediately before then; followed by the Rapture. We probably have years ahead; if He tarries of unprecedented persecution and sad to say martyrdom. We are said to be hated of ALL nations; then the end will come ( Matthew 24:9). This could have a final fulfillment during the Tribulation but also could be speaking of today.
Prayer of course is paramount. I know someone who has recently moved to Israel in the ministry (I will leave out his name and position for security sake). He and his wife see firsthand the displacement of hundreds of thousands from the border areas being attacked on multiple fronts. There are those behind the scenes funding and staging the mass demonstrations in several cities today who no doubt will not stop until they are forced to and have no less goal than overthrowing our government and making this into a Muslim country with Sharia law. No doubt we should continue to pray for individuals the Lord puts into our lives. Some things are better avoided; but we all need to search our hearts to trust God if we need to defend the life of another in these situations of mass looting and no doubt increasing violence. We all need to prepare for martial law at the very least. The end is near and now it is vital that we preach it and trust God iving obediently
Thank you Valmar. To respond & also I'm in agreement with you, No, the Triune God never changes - as well as His requirement of faith to please Him & be acceptable to Him. The OT folk were accepted by God because of their faith in Him for Who He was (as revealed to them) & they were confident that He would fulfill all that He had promised to them. Those who died in their sins were the disobedient & faithless & could never please Him & suffered under His Hand. So, the essential requirement was Faith & when the Law & Commandments came to them, they were to obey fully in their strength, looking unto their Maker only.
So, what changed with the coming of Jesus Christ? Faith was still the requirement ( Hebrews 11:6), but it was no longer a human faith, based on human works, to be acceptable to God. The OT faithful (looking forward) would have their sins paid for at Calvary, just as those who would believe from Israel & Gentiles post-Calvary. But now, we don't receive a set of rules to follow to please God - we don't muster up (our) faith to be acceptable - and we contribute nothing in works (sacrifices, feasts, sabbaths, washings, etc.) towards our salvation.
For this reason, I sought your thoughts on the work of the Holy Spirit, He Who was sent by Jesus ( John 15:26; John 16:7; Galatians 4:6), a Spirit that the OT faithful never received for the renewing & enlivening of their hearts - only at Pentecost such a mighty Work of God took place. God indeed has not changed, but the Cross has changed how man stands before God. To Page 2.
Sorry for your upset, I have been upset too from world systems.
Hebrews 11:1
King James Version
11Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
Philippians 4:13
King James Version
13I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.
By Faith you should still have the victory over world systems to surrender
I know the two resurrection you speak of, most believe what you believe.
The word speaks of Christ resurrection, then the resurrection of those who never believe that were raised with Christ.
Colossians 3:1 ... if ye be RISEN with Christ ....
Ephesians 2:6 .... and hath RAISED US us up together ....
Isaiah 26:19 .... TOGETHER with my dead body shall they ARISE ....
Hosea 6:2 ..... in the third day he will raise US UP .......
The saints that arose with Christ, were the Old Testament saints that had died in faith, but had never receive their promise of eternal life.
Those: in Revelation under the alter clothed in white are the Old saints awaiting their promise, eternal life, by their resurrection of Christ.
These are the 144,000 raised with Christ, the firstfruits of the resurrection.
Hebrews 11:39 And these all, havlng obtained a good report through faith, received not the PROMISE (eternal life).
Hebrews 11:40 Christ having provided some BETTER THING FOR US (never having to die and wait in the grave), that they WITHOUT US should not be made PERFECT (by our resurrection as one).
Hebrews 5:9 ...and having been made perfect .... by our resurrection as one ....
Philippians 3:15 Let us therefore who be perfect (by our resurrection as one), be thus minded: and if in any thing you be otherwise mined, God shall reveal even this to you.
God Bless YOU!
Part 2.
As I said "Christ is truth and by faith we believe him! Why? Because the Holyspirit testifies of him!
Is faith 'not" a gift of God? Yes it is.
Is it not caused by the Holyspirit?
Yes, it is persuasion.
It's NOT man's faith we're discussing here but Christ faith.
For example;
Take 1 Corinthians 2:9-14 and harmonize it with your meaning of faith and you will see "IF" it directly means belief then it doesn't change anything according to the context we're debating.
That what you believe in has to be given for us to have faith and trust in God!
Vs 9) But as it is written, EYE HATH NOT SEEN, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.
Vs 10) But GOD HATH REVEALED THEM UNTO US BY HIS SPIRIT: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.)
"That's Persuasion! (9 Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man.
10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: ) [ Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. Hebrews 11:1]
IF YOU TRANSLATED THAT TO BELIEF, IT STILL NOT OF YOURSELF!
Vs 11. For WHAT MAN KNOWETH THE THINGS OF A MAN, SAVE THE SPIRIT OF MAN WHICH IS IN HIM? EVEN SO THE THINGS OF GOD KNOWETH NO MAN, BUT THE SPIRIT OF GOD.
There's your source of belief/faith/Persuasion Giannis.
Vs 12. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; THAT WE MIGHT KNOW THE THINGS THAT ARE FREELY GIVEN TO US OF GOD.
Vs 13. Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: IT IS THE GIFT OF GOD:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Where is the energy behind your faith? or belief?
God bless.
The problem with the question of eternal security lies in having NO KNOWLEDGE of God's WORD.
If one deeply studies the PROPHECIES, one will see that at some point in the ages to come all the tribes of Israel are going to once again exit.
BUT, in this AGE he is ONLY calling out the PREISTHOOD, the house of David, the kind of firstfruits as is the tribe of Judah, lawgivers that will rule and reign and serve him when he resurrects all the DEAD back to there bodies of flesh and blood.
If one studies under the spirit of truth, you find these prophecies in the blessings of Israel to his twelve sons, from the beginning the tribe of Judah was CHOSEN to be God's lawgiver. The blessing on the remaining tribes will be fulfilled after all the lawgivers are put in place.
Isaiah, Ezekiel, Zachariah, and Revelation all prophesy ONLY a PART will be save in this age, one third (probably symbolic) since other prophecies seem to say ONE TENTH, the tithe to God, those without blemish being sacrificed with Christ on HIS CROSS.
You find this in the blessings of Jacob and Esau.
Hebrews 11:20 By faith Isaac blessed Jacob and Esau CONCERNING THINGS TO COME.
There are TWO DEATHS, TWO RESURRECTION and TWO JUDGEMENTS,
The first death and resurrection is those SAVED in this AGE, the ones Christ CAUSES TO BELIEVE in this AGE, they are being judged by the words of God.
1 Timothy 4:10 ... who is the SAVIOUR of ALL MEN (not necessarily in this AGE), especially THOSE (in this AGE) that BELIEVE.
Isaiah 6:13 But yet in it (the land) shall be a tenth, and it (the tenth) shall be eaten (same as Christ is eaten, eat the words and digest them) as a teil tree, and as an oak, whose substance (CHRIST) IS IN THEM, when they cast their leaves (administer judgement), so the HOLY SEED shall be the substance thereof.
Obadiah 1:21 And SAVIOURS (those conformed to the image of Christ) SHALL COME upon Mt, Zion to JUDGE the house of ESAU
and the Kingdom shall be the LORDS.
a very important subject here in both topics, faith & suffering
1.Faith, we all know that Rom 10:17, Paul earlier says it is Rom 10:8 he's not talking about the letter here
But John 6:63 The Grace / Light that appears in the heart bringing salvation to all mankind Hebrews 9:28 that wait on Him.
Believing that it is He, speaking to us & His first works within us is teaching us to deny all ungodliness & the learning of righteousness
Paul says in Gal 3:2 so there's an increase of His Spirit as we received His judgement of sin & instruction in righteousness.
Here is Power offered to overcome all sin. For He who show us our sin, will not only take them away, but power is given to preserve from repeating the sin. There is one requirement, a truly contrite & broke heart birth through godly sorrow for the offense. This is saving faith produce by the Spirit, True faith purifies the heart, cleanses the vessel 2 Timothy 2:21
2.Suffering 2Timothy 3:12
As we look through both Testaments, we see a common thread, the suffering of the faithful
Paul by the Spirit call them 2Cor 4:17 which suffering brings a far more eternal weigh of glory
Hebrews 11:35,38 attain a better resurrection, whom the world was not worthy of.
We must have a renewing of our minds as Paul contiu.. 2Cor 4:18
What an encouragement on this side of the grave, & the reward is eternal,
Folks,
lets pick up our Cross & follow Jesus, He merciful & faithfully cleanses us from all unrighteousness, takes away our sins against Him, continually increases us with His Spirit alone the Way, until we are baptize unto His death, being dead unto sin, baptizes us in His Spirit, each one fitted in the body according to His gifts, we enter into the fellowship of His suffering (He's there with us ) therefore we experience the Power of His resurrection, & He never leaves us or forsakes us.
Then rewards us for what He alone done through us, what a deal, Come on!
Jesse you inspire me, thank you
Lev 26:15-21 God is speaking to His people, the history of the children of Israel full of this. 2 Chronicles 7:14 Jeremiah 3:22 Hosea 6:1,2
Christ brings this into the NT John 12:40 Acts 28:27
Hebrews 12:5-11 speaking of His children
He does this in His merciful lovingkindness to us, we being so blinded by the deceitfulness of sin, it must be scourge out, define as "to flog" lit or fig, God as a father chastising and training men as children by affliction,
Chastisement; Education or training; by implication, disciplinary correction, chastening, instruction, nurture.
There's two kinds of fear, & many manifestations of each, all grounded in one of the two, godly fear which foundation is grounded in obedient reverential love for God.
The other, Satan counter part, grounded in disobedience which brings torment, where condemnation & guilt in one's own heart follows them wherever they go, for they have offended the Holy God; they having continue in disobedience to the Grace of God which appears in their hearts.
God's love in chastising correction, cast this fear & torment out
& why? John 14:21, which defines love, which makes way for John 14:23 one's habitation becomes a dwelling place for Perfect Love in the work of Sanctification of the Spirit unto obedience & sprinkling of the Blood/Life of Jesus.
thus "for our profit, that we might be partakers of His holiness.
Hebrews 12:11 exercising the Grace of God, the Word of Righteousness in discerning between Good & evil,, there's suffering in the Cross to learn righteousness. 1Pet 4:1
Then we have Job, who God said is perfect, Job 2:3; which trials, suffering & afflictions is of a much higher concept than punishment for disobedience, James 5:11
Hebrews 11:33 for this purpose "obtain a better resurrection"
one eighty, you would do well to live out your call name.
your in darkness, deceived; dwelling, speaking & judging falsely against God
Ephesians 5:13, therefore, Ephesians 5:14
In Love & Truth
Sampson. Hebrews 11:32 mentions Sampson in passing but doesn't elaborate on the subject.
Judges 13 gets into the beginning of the story of Manoah and his wife who had an angelic visitation from God announcing the birth of Sampson and the prophesied deliverance from the Philistines that his life would enable. Interestingly the angel appeared both times to the woman and it seemed this unnamed wife had more sense than her husband who was convinced they would die after such a visitation. Perhaps Sampson's upbringing in such a household led to some of his irrational behaviors as he grew up.
Judges 16 shows where Sampson ended up with Delilah; who ultimately sapped his strength to the point where he was blinded and no longer able to resist his enemies who were using her against him. He had lost his wife according to Judges 14:3 after they killed her following his vengeance in killing 30 Philistines. This tragedy could have been avoided if he had married within his people. He would continue to follow his affections; yet somehow God saw that he had genuine faith. This is perhaps best illustrated when he deliberately gave up his life in knocking down the pillars of Dagon's temple in Judges 16:29; and kills more Philistines than he did his entire life previously.
How we end life clearly is important; if the rest of our life is screwed up but we end it well then we can enter into heaven; the other extreme exists for those who turn away at the last minute; sadly a friend of mine said that was the case with his mother after being in a home where believers surrounded her the last few months of her life she turned away from the faith.
The examples in the last few posts show how God knows the heart; we can never be sure someone can't turn at the last minute but certainly shouldn't count on it. Matthew 7:20 shows us how in time we can see those who are truly saved by GOOD FRUIT.
In assessing Lot's narrow escape from Sodom; the patience of God is unmistakeable. The angels put up with the hemming and hawing in Lot's pathetic request to go to a closer town rather than far away in the mountains to escape (see Genesis 19:20). In the end he ends up fleeing further once he sees the destruction.
REMEMBER LOT'S WIFE. I highly recommend the tract by Chapel Library on this topic with this title. ( Genesis 19:26). I cannot ultimately prove that Lot's wife was lost in her curiousity to look back but it certainly cost her her life. We are reminded; of course of the verse in Luke 9:62 of he who looks back once he has put his hand to the plough not being suitable for the Kingdom of God.
It would seem that Lot's wife couldn't have been alongside him and turned to a pillar of salt the same distance away from the destruction. It would seem she lagged some distance behind OR stood still quite a while when Lot continued on before this happened. Anyway; the tract I mentioned shows her priviledge in being in a home where someone read God's word and believed. I would say that it was probably much compromised what Lot was actually teaching as head of the household not to mention what his daughters knew scripturally. She was nonetheless without excuse; if we look at Rahab "the harlot" and her commendation saving the spies and preservation of life and listed in Hebrews 11 as an example of faith ( Hebrews 11:31) she was commended and actually part of the lineage of Christ eventually. Being OBEDIENT at such a time requires true faith; and Lot's wife clearly was more enamored with the world in this case than a pagan prostitute because of the ACTIONS demonstrating faith or lack thereof. This is why works ARE important. In all this we can't ignore Abraham's pleading to God in Gen. 18:32; clearly he had Lot in mind and his family to be the rightous who would escape. His sons in law ended up being wicked.
By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison.
I also believe this quote by Peter in 1 Peter 3:19-20 doesn't say Christ went into Hell and preached to the Spirits in prison.
I believe verse 20 tells us WHEN he preached to those in prison.
(Verse 20)
Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, WHILE THE ARK WAS A PREPARING, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
I believe the building of the ark, the material used and the ark itself presents a type in the work of Christ and Christ himself.
Hebrews 11:7 By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.
I also believe Ephesians 4:8-9 has to be interpreted separate from 1 Peter.
"Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.
Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?
I believe this passage of scripture is saying Jesus rose victorious from the grave. He paid the price for the sin of the world through His sacrificial death and Resurrection, and broke the power of sin, Satan, death, and hell.
I believe at this point those saved in the Old Testament leaves Abraham's bosom and goes to be with the Lord.
And so do we when we die.
Also, I believe Satan will be bound by a great Angel, not the Lord. That is yet future. Revelation 20:1-2.
The conditions in Revelation 20:3-5 hasn't happened yet.
Blessings.
Genesis 13:14-17 And the LORD said unto Abram, after that Lot was separated from him, Lift up now thine eyes, and look from the place where thou art northward, and southward, and eastward, and westward: For all the LAND which thou seest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed FOR EVER. And I will make thy seed as the dust of the earth: so that if a man can number the dust of the earth, then shall thy seed also be numbered. Arise, walk through the land in the length of it and in the breadth of it; for I will give it unto thee.
Hebrews 11:8-10 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an INHERITANCE, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went. By faith he sojourned in the LAND OF PROMISE, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the HEIRS with him of the SAME PROMISE: For he looked for a CITY WHICH HATH FOUNDATIONS, whose BUILDER AND MAKER IS GOD.
Hebrews 11:13-18 These all died in faith, not having received the PROMISES, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were STRANGERS and PILGRIMS on the earth. For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country. And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned. But now they desire a BETTER COUNTRY , that is, an HEAVENLY: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God:
Hebrews 11:39,40 And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise: God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect.
The Promise of the Land, the Inheritance, the City, is the Kingdom of God, New Heavens and New Earth which are, ETERNAL, FOR EVER. It is not a piece of property on this sin-cursed earth which will be destroyed.
Christ "spoke in parables" Mark 4:33,34.
Then what about Abraham? Abraham was dead & buried, how could he being dead rejoice to see Jesus' Day, this is the Day of Jesus' Coming? This wasn't a situation of (the Genesis) Abraham knowing about Jesus & waiting patiently with joy, for Jesus' Sacrifice & Redemption. This dialogue with the Jews was to show that Abraham was alive in Hades all this time, but NOW rejoicing to see the Messiah finally come (in Jesus' Day) Who would give full atonement to him & all others waiting in hope.
Yes, Abraham, as those many others, 'who looked for a heavenly city', expected it (in faith) & died (in faith), "not having received the promises, but seeing them afar off" ( Hebrews 11:13,16). Their faith/faithfulness to God was vibrant even to this point in their death & confinement in Hades, but until the Atonement was completed at Calvary, they remained in limbo, waiting, in expectation of the promised eternal rest that awaited them, to have Christ's Blood applied to them as well.
Now the Gospel was complete for them (what they once knew imperfectly); the eternal Rest they longed for was now realized in Christ Jesus, in Whose Blood there is Peace with God ( Colossians 1:20) & eternal Rest in Christ ( Hebrews 4:9). GBU.
I agree 100% what you have said that OT Israel knew nothing of a coming Messiah's Sacrifice of His Life for them & substitutionary payment. Hence, the word 'Gospel' mentioned in Hebrews 4 is not the same Gospel they received as is the complete Gospel that the Apostles preached post-Cross. (Perhaps not in the way it is preached in 1 Corinthians 15:3-4)
I believe the OT saints did what was required of them at that time to make them just with God. Their temporal rituals and sacrifices exemplified the Gospel and perhaps the resurrection was preached by "type" when Issac was offered as a sacrifice by Abraham. Hebrews 11:17-19.
However, could they have perceived it, being that Jeremiah 31:31-34 have not taken place yet?
When we study Hebrews in its entirety, we know that this new covenant was not to come under the Levitical covenant. This is clearly seen in Hebrews Ch 7 and 8.
So, when we look back at this, Israel mind was blinded and there was a veil upon their hearts, as mentioned in 2 Corinthians 3:14-16. "But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the Old Testament, which vail is done away in Christ.
But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.
Nevertheless when "it" shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away. (The "it" mentioned here is their hearts.)
When Israel turns their hearts to God the veil and the blindness shall be taken away.
This is what Paul is saying in Romans 11.
Israel was incapable of receiving the revelation of the Gospel under the Levitical High Priest and if you study the Gospels carefully, neither could the Apostles until the death of the one that filled the role of the Levitical Priesthood at the Cross.
(I believe this is what John's baptism was all about)
The resurrection began the new covenant under the new Priest hood. ( Hebrews 7:15-16.)
Now Christ faith in them will give them rest.
Thats future for them as a Nation
The Chruch is the true Israel of God and heirs to God's promises to Abraham
Galatians 3:29 'And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.'
Galatians 6"15-16 'For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature. And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and the mercy, and upon the Israel of God.'
All who are in Christ through faith, as Abraham was, are the seed that receive the promise of God to Abraham, the inheritance Abraham looked forward to, the heavenly Jerusalem. Hebrews 11:10.
The promise of the physical land to Abraham and the Israelites was a shadow pointing to the heavenly land of promise, the New heavens and new earth of eternal life with Jesus. The land of Israel was described as flowing with milk and honey, the New Jerusalem is described as flowing with living waters and fruit from the tree of life continually. Both figurative language for the abundant blessings of life in abundance from God for those who are of the faith of Abraham.
For it has been granted to you not only to believe in Christ but also to suffer for him (Phillipians 1:29). Acts 5:41 is in a similar vein; namely being thankful for being worthy to be persecuted in His name; which is promised for all true believers. ( 2 Tim. 3:12; etal). The promise of being chastised if we are a true child of God and other sufferings aren't exactly the first thing we focus on
when it comes to God's promises. But of course if we consider these hard sayings first; we can learn to appreciate the more pleasurable promises in a greater way.
The opposite is true of course; in light of Hebrews 11:25. Sin runs its course of earthly pleasures; which lead up to eternal condemnation. For God's children; however there are pleasures evermore in His right hand ( Psalm 16:11). The fullness of life is also mentioned in that verse which corresponds with John 10:10 in living life to the full. Food and clothing are promised in the Gospels ( Matt. 6:25); (compare with 1 Kings 17:6 where the ravens brought Elijah food). Notice that shelter or a place to rest His head is mentioned as lacking in Matthew 8:20; which made some turn away from following Him. Surely Christ Himself did stay in peoples' homes for short interludes; but He also spent many nights on mountains in prayer; or sleeping on a boat.
Much prayer; of course seems to be edifying when focused on fulfilling the Great Commission. God states in Isaiah 55:11; that His word will not go out void; but accomplish His purposes. If we are doing His work; then we can be sure to reap what we sow; in terms of reward (see Psalm 126:5). Heavenly treasures are a promise for those who are serving out of a pure heart (see 2 Timothy 4:7-8). Therefore; the end ouf our sufferings in Christ will bring eternal glory that outweighs anything on earth. (see Romans 8:18). 2 Corinthians 4:17-18 also discusses "momentary afflictions" that don't compare to heavenly bliss.
I think our point of difference here is on Faith: did the OT faithful (the elect) have a God-given faith so as to be accepted, or did they come in their own faith, which God accepted looking ahead to the Cross? Yet knowing, that faith could never save them - only Christ's Blood. Hebrews 11:39,40, "And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise: God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect." We have been made perfect (cleansed, holy) in Christ & so also those others to join us as new creatures in Christ Jesus, that which they could only hope for & never attained.
f. Born again. The entrance of the Holy Spirit into a sinner's life: the sinner who has heard & understood the Gospel in view to the wretchedness of his sins & holiness of God, repented, called upon God for salvation, & God's Gift of Salvation & of His Spirit, Who seals, secures, & ministers to every area of the person's life. The once lost, despairing & fearful under the judgement of God, now enjoys peace with God, freedom from sin's grip, victory over temptations, power & desire to live unto God & not to self, & the assurance of God's tender care to eternity, would show the redeemed one this dramatic change in life that can only be done by the Power of God. I see this, in brief, the re-birth work of the Holy Spirit & resulting effect on this 'new' person's life ( 2 Corinthians 5:17).
I trust brother that my comments have gone some way to help you understand what I believe.
Thanks David0921; I think that this matter of 'believing on God' or even 'believing that God is able', is to be seen as different as to what we call 'saving faith', or a faith (act of trusting) in God to effect His Work of Salvation. It might sound like a 'grasping at straws' to convince another, but for me to adequately understand & apply this matter of 'ordinary faith & saving faith', is important. In the case of the OT folk, as we read here in Romans 4 about Abraham & David, the mention of Abraham's faith being "counted for righteousness", I understand that from what he knew & experienced of God, he exhibited human (ordinary) faith towards Him. And this was a faith based on his knowledge & his works to please God (as with Enoch, Hebrews 11:5). I don't perceive this was a special gift of faith for these men to exhibit, but an ordinary faith resulting from God revealing Himself to them & their desire to serve only Him.
But then we come to the NT & Ephesians 2:8,9. Even though unregenerate man, as those of the OT, can still express faith, whether towards God or man, in Ephesians we see that for the saving Work of Christ to be effective, we have the indivisible combination of both God's Grace & His Faith given for that to happen. In other words, God could have just given the sinner His Grace by way of sending His Son for them, but can that sinner, from an unregenerate heart, create a faith that can truly understand, embrace, & consistently live out the great salvation of God? And that is why Ephesians 2:8 shows, "and that not of yourselves": the Gift of God is both His Grace & His Faith that would instigate & complete salvation in that lost soul. Onto Page 2.
Thank you David0921; you have written extensively on this subject & asked many questions. I don't plan to give as much detail as it deserves, but will address some of it.
The Bible from Genesis to Malachi is about God's dealings with His people, Israel - giving them the Law & associated punishments for their disobedience. From Jesus' teachings (Gospels) onwards (the fuller meaning of aspects of that Law to Revelation), the saved Jew & Gentile can learn & apply the full requirements of all of God's Laws by the Work & Power of the Holy Spirit within them. So then, can the Gentile, whether unbelieving or believing, learn anything from the Old Law? Most certainly, but realizing that that Law was served to Israel only to show them God's requirements for them, their sinful state ( Romans 7:7), their inability to fully obey them, & their need for God's Help to deal with sin. To the God-fearing Jew under the Law, their hope & faith remained in the God they served, looking for His Redemption ( Hebrews 11:1,2,39,40); & this applied to those pre-Law & certainly pre-Christ, in Whom their redemption would one day be realized.
Romans 3:31. Romans 3:28, "we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law". This is the essence of this chapter, of justification of both Jew & Gentile through faith & not dependence on the Law. Is the Law then nullified because of faith? Paul writes, "we establish the Law"; i.e. the Law's role was to make men conscious of sin (v20) & this aspect of the Law (revealing sin) is confirmed by all those who turn from sin to Christ in faith. The Law couldn't effect salvation in Jesus - only Faith in Him could. The Law served/serves its purpose, but could never bring release. Why should we then put ourselves under it by reverting to it & placing its Holy Commands with punishment on those who need the liberty found by faith in Jesus? Onto Page 2.
Continued....
Moses and Aaron went before the Lord at the entrance to the tabernacle and the glory of the Lord appeared to them, instructing Moses to take the rod (of Aaron) and SPEAK to THE rock before them. Was this a natural rock that was already in this wilderness or was this a rock that they carried with them throughout the wilderness journey? ( 1Cor. 10:4 says that the spiritual rock followed them; which was Christ)
Moses and Aaron then went out to the people. Moses derides the people angrily and strikes the rock twice. Water flows from it miraculously. God disciplines Moses for sinning in the way he carried out God's instructions. God did not tell Moses to strike the rock, just speak to it. Perhaps Moses had thought that since he had struck the rock the first time ( Exodus 17) that that is the way he was to always do this. God did not tell Moses to scold the people in anger. Unfortunately, Moses sinned by not following the exact instructions of God, but added to what God had told him to do. Moses credited himself to be the one to bring water out of the rock rather than give God the credit and glory for it alone. He did not sanctify God in this instance before the people fo Israel.
The result of this sin was that Moses would not enter the promised land. Moses did not argue with God. He did not bargain with Him. Nor did he intercede for himself. He accepted the will of God. He knew that there was an eternal promised land (like Abraham) he would enter that was better than the physical land. ( Hebrews 11:39-40) Moses knew of the Messiah, the gospel that that would come from Him, and the salvation that he would receive from Him ( Gal. 3:8).
So here, as in Exodus, the waters of Meribah were bitter-sweet. Bitter because the people received discipline from God, but sweet, because God was merciful towards them and provided the water they sorely needed.
Moses must have known that his life was coming to an end soon.
All the saints (elders) in the old testament died a physical death; because Christ, the promised SEED had not yet COME to give ALL immortal life by his resurrection.
Ezekiel 18:4 .... the SOUL that sinneth it shall DIE .....the soul goes to the grave .....
The promise in both the Old and New Testament has always been the promise of eternal live, destroying the enemy of man, DEATH.
Hebrews 11:39 And these all (the saints in the Old testament), having obtained a good report through faith (believing in the coming messiah to deliver them from death), RECEIVED NOT THE PROMISE.
Hebrews 11:40 For God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect (resurrected with Christ, Christ ONLY is perfect and hath immortality dwelling in the light .... 1 Timothy 6:16)
Matthew 27:52-53
All creation was given immortality at the same time: when Christ was resurrected; Christ only was resurrected, creating a NEW CREATION.
Revelation 21:5 ... Behold, I MAKE ALL THINGS NEW ....
2 Corinthians 5:17 Therefore if any man be in CHRIST (Christ ONLY was resurrected), he is a NEW creature: old things have passed away, Behold, all things have become NEW.
Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow (God foreknew all creation), he did also PREDESTINATE (by Christ resurrection) to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the FIRSTBORN (Christ ONLY arose) of many brethren (CHRISTians).
God bless YOU!