Bible Questions Page 67

  • Mishael - in Reply on Revelation 7:9
    All I know is that Jesus is your Advocate;

    Your attorney who speaks for you when Satan accuses you before the throne.

    1 John 2:1

    If the defendant is innocent; then he should win his case before God.

    I'm not an attorney.

    I'm going to note that you have not said if this person is a born again Christian. Are you a Christian? Meet with legal aid and find out if evidence can be reviewed. Write everything down.
  • CARLOS RAMIREZ TREVINO - in Reply on Genesis 10
    Chris, You state your points clearly, convincingly and succinctly. I wish I had that talent. And I wonder if saying the same thing a different way will move the conversation so those that read it will benefit. And although you grasp much of what I say, I wonder if there's more I haven't said or haven't said well. So I will outline my understanding below.

    Before God created anything, He Planned His creation

    Christ, as Savior, was included in that Plan

    The Plan also included Redemption

    The eradication of Wickedness (corruption)

    Vanquishing Death

    Establishing Eternal Perfection

    Creation of Mankind

    A Material creation as a parenthesis in eternity, With a beginning and an end

    At some point in time or before time Lucifer and other Angels rebelled

    The devil was banished to the Garden of Eden

    Man was created and placed in the Garden

    God Planted 2 Trees in the Garden before the Fall

    The devil tempted Adam and Eve

    They sinned and all mankind was imputed with the penalty

    Does the Bible say God knew Adam would to disobey Him? No. It implies He was not aware Genesis 3:11

    If God did know, why didn't He stop them? God had a Plan called His "Eternal Purpose" Ephesians 1:4-11, 3:11, Isaiah 46:10-11

    Why did God create man, knowing man would disobey? For Christ Colossians 1:16, Romans 11:36

    Why did God get rid of everyone but Noah? His Promise and Covenant Genesis 3:15

    Why did God create man in His image? To prepare a body for Christ. Psalms 40:6, Hebrews 10:5

    Why did God Plant the Tree of Life in the Garden, before the Fall? We don't know Genesis 3:22, 24

    Who is the Tree of Life? Jesus? Revelation 22:2

    Who is the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil? The devil Ezekiel 31, Matthew 12:33-34

    Were Adam and Eve given a choice on whether to eat from the Tree of KGE or others? No. Genesis 3

    Why did God include Christ in His Pre-creation Plan? To rescue all things created from perdition Ephesians 1:10, Colossians 1:20

    What was God's pre-creation Purpose? To reconcile all things in heaven and earth to Himself Colossians 1:13-20, Ephesians 1:10
  • Mishael to Krysta - in Reply on Acts 9
    God gave all this information to Holy men of God to publish Bibles for this generation. He is NOT a man. He has given man and woman every opportunity to love Him and learn of Him. His son Jesus became all God and son of Man to come to earth to save all mankind. Not willing that ANY should perish but that ALL would come to be born again.

    He gave us 10 simple guidelines to live our lives. Jesus gave us 2 commandments, which take the place of the 10. If we love each other...we'll fulfill the 10. Simple.

    I don't know about you but plenty of people were unfair to me; let me down. I was bleeding out so-to-speak When I came to Jesus. I was crouched on a chair with a vision of hell in my floor and an invisible Hand extended to me, above my head. I grabbed the Hand!! For me that was when life began.

    He's not being mean to people. What is it when people ignore their Creator and choose to be spiritually blind and deaf?

    I'll show you some mercy...all the babies and little children will be taken to heaven at the rapture of the church, world wide. God will not let them suffer. Read all of the book of John. No skipping around. Is Jesus mean?

    Don't be clueless like I was. Just take the Hand of God and walk with Him.

    I asked my mother once why she didn't read the Bible. She countered with being baptized as a child and believing in heaven. I asked her why wouldn't you want to know every thing possible about Someone you want to spend eternity with? She began reading her Bible every day. She died 6 months later. I miss her. I'll see her again.

    Receive Jesus. Let Him have your past and you take His future.
  • Mishael on Revelation 7:9
    Someone needs to be brave and just get it down to bare bones about the Rapture; and the Second Coming. Two separate events.

    The bare bones is this: quit waiting for some big sign post in the sky that says it's going to be tonight or next week. Our time for sin is done. Quit wondering and open up the door of your heart that Jesus is knocking on.

    Give your life to Jesus Christ... and take His Life. Accept him as your Savior and Lord.

    Take yourself OFF of the throne of your heart....and PUT Jesus on that throne. Do it now!

    End your fleshly, worldly lifestyle and begin to live for Jesus only. If the Holy Spirit cringes in your home....get rid of the idols.

    You cannot learn the Bible with media all over your home. Stop now and read this passage: it's about the media!! Isaiah 8:18-22. Wizards that peep and mutter are computers that are hooked up to internet, Facebook, evil Twitter of voices of heartless hell bound people. Verse 20, because there is NO LIGHT in them! People feed themselves on garbage every day. No wonder there is no sense of stability in their christian walk.

    We're living in Bottom Line days here! The moment Jesus speaks COME UP, we are gone. The door is shut.

    Avoid all the confusion of varying opinions. BE BORN AGAIN NOW. Then you won't have to wonder when THE MOMENT will be. Your ticket is punched. You are ready to board!!

    We are surely going to see Matthew 24 bloom and spread out across the world. Time for lively debates has passed. If you care so much, go next door and see if your neighbor is ready....and to others on the street. Romans chapter one.

    If other people are not saved; do not want to be saved; ask you to leave (Romans 1)

    They are dead already. Noah's world drowned. This world is going by fire.

    It blows my mind that people are not one bit curious about New Jerusalem? Are not highly excited about meeting the Son of God. Beloveds, look forward. Be ready. Keep your eyes on Jesus.
  • KRYSTABELLE on Acts 9
    Why does he like to persacute people?
  • Mishael - in Reply on Revelation 14
    Doesn't the variety of religions remind us of the Tower of Babel, sorta, kind of?

    God confused the one language into Many. Everybody moved away so they could hear only their language?

    See that's humans for you. They all want some unique way to hold Church and attract new visitors. All people want to have it their way.

    Anyone can go online now and read the tenets of that Church's faith. What they believe. If it doesn't match up to the Bible, don't go there. If the church has skinny "sheep" then they aren't being fed on the Word of God. If they don't have wool, then they're being fleeced by false shepherds.

    We have a grave responsibility to search these things out!

    We attend church to obey God.... because we love Him and He wants us to learn about him. Somewhere it says that if the stall is "full", that's a happy barn; a balanced diet.

    Don't put the full responsibility on the Pastor to feed you!

    We are to be having family Bible night at home too. Kids will never walk away from God if his love and nurturing is at home. There are many "justice league" kind of heroes in scripture. Jesus slipped in and out of crowds when it was necessary; being chased by Pharisees & legalists. Paul is running from them, Romans and all manner of hazards. What does that teach? Saul chased King David for years and couldn't kill him. If you are hidden in Christ you can achieve amazing victories.

    Children know none of these amazing stories, these days. The Bible was removed from schools in 1962. Jesus was kicked out, along with the 10 commandments. LOOK AT WHAT OUR SOCIETY HAS BECOME.

    One old lady atheist did that.

    Does anyone have a testimony of what Jesus did for them this week???

    Maybe God would like to hear it too??

    The kids love tunes by Carman on youtube, like: Yahweh; Yo Kids album; he loves ministering in song to kids :D. I used to go to the same church he went to. Kids set on fire for Jesus. It can happen again folks.
  • Robert Marino on Genesis 10
    How can i be alive and remain at the second coming, if i have already been raptured and gone in some pre-tribulation rapture?
  • Jesse - in Reply on Matthew 24:38


    In Verse 30, the word "tribes" would show us that Jesus is talking about Jews. And then again in Verse 31, the gathering of the elect, that word "elect" is referring to Jews. It starts getting interesting beginning at Verse 33. Jesus says, So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors. In Verse 34, the word "generation" is referring to a race of people. He's talking about Jews.

    Now Verses 37-41 give us the preconditions to the coming of Christ. I find Verses 37-39 to be quite interesting, and I think this might tie in to what you are talking about. 37) But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 38) For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, 39) And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

    After God shut the door on the ark, how long was it until it started raining? One week! I see that as prophecy. After the door was shut on the ark, the unbelievers still didn't know the judgment was coming. But they were warned. Noah and His family were closed up and safe in the ark for a week before the judgment came upon the non-believing world. That is why it says they didn't know it until the flood came. The flood came and took them all away. It was life as usual until it came, and it was sudden, and it was quick, and it was unexpected.

    For me, I see the parallel between the ark and Daniel's 70th week. I see believers being caught up to be safe with the Lord for that final week (7 yr. period) while the unbelievers are carrying on as usual until the judgment hits them, just like in the days of Noah being safe in the ark for 7 days until the flood came.

    Well, I know I've rambled a lot here, but I just wanted to share my perspective and understanding of Matthew 24.
  • Jesse - in Reply on Romans 2:5

    In 2 Corinthians 5:10, it says For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

    For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; That is what is called the Bema seat. This is not the Great White Throne Judgment. We are told in 1 Corinthians Chapter 3, as well as Romans 14:10 "Why do you judge your brother, or why do you set at nought your brother? For we shall all stand before the judgment seat, the Bema seat of Christ."

    The Bema seat was the platform that some of the Roman officials would sit on as they were meting out judgment. But it's more known for the stand in which you come to at the Olympic games after you run your race to get your prize.

    We see in the Olympics, the first, second, and third-place athletes, they get up on this stand and they give them a medal. And they stand up there and play the anthem of the person that came in first place.

    That is the Bema seat. It's not the judgment of heaven and hell. We are already assured of heaven in Christ. But we will be judged and that judgment is described for us in 1 Corinthians Chapter 3.

    There will be a type of fire that we will pass through and that which is not of Christ will burn, and whatever is left is the reward. Only the things of Christ will last!

    So he says I do things here that will be well-pleasing to the Lord because someday I'm going to stand before Him just like we (All true believers) will. And as he says in 1 Corinthians Chapter 9, he runs the race to win the prize. He says run to receive the prize because one day you're going to stand before Christ.
  • Robert DePaula on John 16:28
    What did Jesus mean when he said that He was leaving the world again?
  • CARLOS RAMIREZ TREVINO - in Reply on Genesis 1
    Angeline, With respect to keeping the Sabbath, what were the requirements? What is your take on statements that seem to say it doesn't matter if you keep the Sabbath?

    Mark 2:27

    Then Jesus declared, "The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. Therefore, the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath."

    Mark 7:19

    because it does not enter his heart, but it goes into the stomach and then is eliminated." (Thus all foods are clean.)

    Romans 14:3

    For one person has faith to eat all things, while another, who is weak, eats only vegetables. The one who eats everything must not belittle the one who does not, and the one who does not eat everything must not judge the one who does, for God has accepted him.

    Romans 14:5

    One man regards a certain day above the others, while someone else considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. He who observes a special day does so to the Lord; he who eats does so to the Lord, for he gives thanks to God.

    Romans 14:17

    For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, but of righteousness, peace, and joy in the Holy Spirit.

    Galatians 4:10

    But now that you know God, or rather are known by God, how is it that you are turning back to those weak and worthless principles? Do you wish to be enslaved by them all over again? You are observing special days and months and seasons and years!

    Colossians 2:20

    If you have died with Christ to the spiritual forces of the world, why, as though you still belonged to the world, do you submit to its regulations: These will all perish with use, because they are based on human commands and teachings.

    1 Timothy 4:3

    They will prohibit marriage and require abstinence from certain foods that God has created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth.

    Hebrews 9:10

    They consist only in food and drink and special washings--external regulations imposed until the time of reform.
  • Tim Moriarty on Matthew 24:38
    I know that Mathew 24 is all about the 2nd coming and NOT the rapture. That said; I wonder how Mathew 24:38 can be; because at the time of the 2nd coming, the world will be in such chaos that things can not be "normal" as the verse implies? I wonder if it refers to the Jews that have been protected during the 2nd half of the tribulation? Or even if it were to refer to the "goats", even they will be in complete chaos?
  • Jesse - in Reply on 2 Timothy 2

    Paul begins the verse by saying wherein I suffer trouble. He's been put in prison for being part of an "Illegal religion." He says I suffer as an evil doer. He's in prison like a criminal, even unto bonds; That word bonds is the Greek word for chains.

    Here it is: but the word of God is not bound.

    There's an old saying that comes from this verse, you can bind the messenger, but you cannot bind the message.

    There were many testimonies of people who were imprisoned for Christ, and who suffered for Christ's sake like Paul, and the gospel just spread like wildfire.

    Can you imagine the first imprisonment, when they chained Paul to those soldiers, and people were coming and going all day long, and Paul was talking about Jesus Christ, and you have to wonder who's being held prisoner here?

    Remember Paul and Silas were in jail in Philippi and there was a big earthquake, and the Philippian jailor thought all the prisoners had escaped, and Paul said don't kill yourself, we're all still here.

    And he said sirs, what must I do to be saved? What must I do to know this kind of God that you know?

    God put them in prison so that the prisoners could hear the message, and so the jailor could hear the message, and the jailor's family could hear the gospel message.

    We feel bad, and even complain when our life is limited, and when we can't do what we want to do. And yet the history of the church, so many martyrs, and so many people who have suffered for Christ, lost their lives for the sake of the gospel.

    So always remember this. They can bind the messenger, but not the message!

    In fact, if they put you in jail for being a Christian, they're doing themselves a great disservice, because you can just spread the gospel to everyone that's in jail!
  • Mattie Diane Munson on Romans 2:5
    What is the name of the judgement of true born again believers ? Is it called the Bema?
  • CARLOS RAMIREZ TREVINO - in Reply on Revelation 19:20
    You make some compelling points that have to be examined carefully. But couldn't the same be said of other religions? The thinking has been that the Catholic Church could be at the heart of this, though it isn't something Catholics themselves welcome.

    My thinking is that sort of corruption happens at the higher levels. We are told that the antichrist is already at work. And that includes a slow departure from sound doctrine from within the universal church.

    End Time prophecies are very difficult to understand, because of their complex nature. Most usually have historical fulfillments that are sort of a precursor of the final outcome. One is the destruction of the Temple in Jerusalem in 70 AD. Will the Temple be rebuilt? If not, how would Daniel's prophecy that the Abomination will proclaim himself God in the Holy of Holies, take place?

    But as that time gets closer, we will understand more. Are there any other possibilities here?
  • CARLOS RAMIREZ TREVINO - in Reply on Revelation 14
    Your comments are enlightening. Why does God allow so much friction in the Church? Why so many denominations?
  • CARLOS RAMIREZ TREVINO - in Reply on Genesis 10
    Chris, on your point 6, Page 4, I believe the Trees in the Garden are representative of Satan and Christ. Association with one results in separation from God and the other, eternal life with God. In Rev the Tree of Life is identified as Jesus. In another place we are encouraged to taste to confirm that God is good. Yet in another, we are given an outline of the Fruit of the Spirit.

    The Genesis account of the Garden is clearly allegorical. And the Tree of the no exception. Knowledge is absorbed through time and experience. When Paul says that evil company corrupts good morals, do you think he means that as soon as you enter the presence of an evil person, you become instantly corrupt? Corruption, by definition, is a deterioration of something good. It involves a decomposition, breakdown, deterioration, a weakening disintegration of something whole. Fruit putrefy because they begin to decompose. Animals die because their systems begin to break down and weaken. Taking my lead from Songs 2-5, which mirror events in the Garden of Eden, I see a slow progression from innocence to craftiness. It wasn't just one bite of a non-existent fruit that corrupted them. It was the constant association with what God told them to stay away from.

    Was there a fruit for the Tree of Life? What did it mean to eat from the Tree of Life? What does it mean now? Will we become instantly perfect when we eat of the fruit of the Tree of Life? Revelation 22:2 tells us the Tree of Life yields 12 different kinds of fruit. Are these fruit physical and eatable? Clearly not. Is there a correlation between the two Trees in the Garden? Can one be metaphorical, but not the other? If one symbolizes Christ, is the other literal?

    Christ was tempted by the devil 40 days. He wasn't confronted just once with 3 temptations. These temptations were spread over the course of Christ's time in the desert. My point is that Adam and Eve were coaxed over time, because their character deteriorated.
  • Chris - in Reply on Psalms 8
    Adam, I appreciate the time you've taken. Sadly, we're in disagreement to a degree. One thing is for sure: I believe in the believer's eternal security & you don't, & I accept that, because I too once shared that position. So I won't bring that up here. But to your other points, briefly.

    1. my position on obedience to the Ten Commandments is also shared by many & this is nothing new. It is a matter of understanding Law & Grace & the perils of fusing them together.

    2. about Satan's deceptions, to this I would agree. But of course, from the 'camp' that I rest in, we would vigorously stand against Satan's deceptions in the other 'camp'. So, no conviction of error borne here.

    3. true, Romans 6:2 was quoted, but the second quote is mine as a response to the first. And this was said to affirm that, if we are dead to sin, it is impossible to live any longer therein. Paul isn't talking about isolated sins, for which we immediately repent & are forgiven, but to those who desire to continue in that lifestyle of sin. This is impossible & this would be the expected response to Paul's question.

    4. Judas, nor the disciples could be considered Christians; Christians are such because of the indwelling Holy Spirit post Crucifixion & Resurrection of our Lord. As well, I don't want to be repetitive with correctly dividing between the Old & New Testaments - true Jesus' Words/Parables were spoken to the Jews in relation to Kingdom Life & their behaviour, but all this was a precursor to the great power from His shed Blood & the power of the Holy Spirit which would change some of his hearers, including his carnal disciples.

    5. we accept others as fellow Christians as we should & because we aren't in a position to judge them. Only God knows. What if that 'believer' rejects Christ in toto? Why do we then decide to look at that sad situation from our perspective & not God's? Let us look at it as God does. Can you or I ever know the state of one responding to an altar call? I don't.
  • Etta - in Reply on Colossians 2:16
    I don't think so,

    The 2nd Chapter of Colossians is on atonement in general,but I believe Paul is dealing with the ultra religious, those who 'swallow a camel, but strain out a gnat. Matthew 23:24

    Ref: Further in Chapter 2:21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not; 2:22 Which all are to perish with the using;) after the commandments and doctrines of men? 2:23 Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body: not in any honor to the satisfying of the flesh.
  • Chris - in Reply on Genesis 10
    Carlos, thanks for attempting to respond to my queries: you're a brave man especially as our responses can go all over the place! To your answers:

    A. I don't have a problem of maintaining that Christ was already in God's Plan in Creation, as God, being God, already knows the future & His Plans for it. It's the other postulations that concern me.

    B. Hebrews 10:5, speaks of the temporary, deficient & incompleteness of the sacrificial system & that only God's offering would accomplish God's Purposes. It does not speak of man being created to open the way for Christ to come & be his Sacrifice. And with Galatians 3:16 & Romans 11:36, I can't see any connection.

    C. Hebrews 2 & Galatians 3:16: sorry, I can't see in these references anything about God having to create man so as to then send His Son for man's sake.

    D. Romans 9:22-24. This shows that God was 'long suffering' towards 'sinners' awaiting the time He would show His great Mercy towards them. I don't see in this that God supported evil (i.e. he partook of or gave His assent to evil, so as to accomplish His Purposes).

    E. Job 1:12. God allowed Satan to test Job's faithfulness & conviction, not in bringing Satan to test Job.

    Matthew 4:1; Luke 4:2. Ditto. Again, Satan approached Jesus, not brought to Him by God.

    Ephesians 3:10, 11. The theme of this begins in verse 3. It was about the "mystery of Christ". And what was it? In verse 6, "That the Gentiles should be fellow heirs (with the Jews), and of the same body, and partakers of His promise in Christ by the Gospel." "And this mystery would be made known to all men (v 9) & to all the heavenly host (v 10), as well as from the Church's existence & testimony of this mystery, of God's manifold Wisdom". I've added words here, only for clarity, as in the original the intent is unclear. Of course, with any addition, comes another interpretation, so I leave this open.
  • Adam - in Reply on Psalms 8
    part 4:

    1 Corinthians 10:13 - talks about temptation. If a Christian can't sin and is saved regardless then what is the reason to avoid temptation? Why would it matter?

    If all the Christians were already saved then why would Paul wrote so many books to each of them to encourage them to stay the course, run the race, to avoid sin, and be obedient. Why? If they're already saved, what's the point?

    You know that most of the New Testament books are written to Christians, right? 1 Corinthians is literally to the church of Corinth as said in 1:2. If they're all saved regardless, then why write a book, why spread the gospel, why why why?

    Earlier it was mentioned that following God is like disrespecting the cross. No, it's the opposite. Not obeying Jesus is like slapping Him in the face and disregarding all he has done.

    How can you tell who is a Christian? The Bible says by their fruit which is very similar to works. "Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them." "Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire."

    Maybe my opinion will give you something to consider or maybe not. I did spend a long time sharing all this to you specifically in brotherly love. I think God really absolutely hates sin, and sin is NOT allowed in heaven and most people will go to hell, including disobedient Christians as it warns against in Matthew 7:21. Most of Jesus's parables are warnings which include to Christians, most of the teachings are to Christians, this is a big deal and not something to be taken lightly. Many will be deceived and will choose not believe the Bible. God bless...
  • Adam - in Reply on Psalms 8
    Hi Chris,

    part 3:

    > if the 'Christian' persists in wilful sin, then he hasn't been saved in the first place

    This seems like a tough position to take, because it appears to contradict itself at every angle. For example: what/who is a Christian, to you? Can you give a precise and reliable definition of a Christian?

    What if someone you believe is a Christian who meets the criteria you believed was set for one later turned out to turn away from Christ and continue in willful sin as it says in Hebrews 10:26 then you say they were never a Christian in the first place, but why weren't they? I know of Christians who are husbands, dads, pastors, youth ministers, worship leaders, who have each turned from Christianity. There's even a forum online for ex-Christians who have left the faith. So, you say they never were Christian in the first place even after all they did as Christians. So, does that mean someone who only responds to an altar call and prays and gives their heart to Jesus isn't Christian either? What exactly is a Christian?

    Even angels in heaven (they're already in heaven) have freewill to sin and turn from God. If even angels have freewill while in heaven, of course mankind does on Earth when God specifically gave mankind the freedom to choose good or evil, to choose love or hate. We're not robots. Just like if you're a dad it's more meaningful if your son/daughter voluntarily says 'I love you', God gave us freewill to choose if we want to be with him or not, to love Him or not, to obey Him or not. It's our choice and we'll also be judged. I suppose if you believe you "can't" sin that doesn't jibe with judgment day either. If we're already saved, what's the point of being judged for our actions?

    Secondly, it sounds like you don't believe Christians have freewill if you they can't sin. To say we don't have freewill is to contradict other verses.
  • Bob Hilt - in Reply on Revelation 7
    Repent: The meaning for those with eyes to see and ears to hear:

    Acts 3:19 REPENT Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your SINS sins may be blotted out, (change your mind on SIN)

    Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, REPENT Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of SINS sins,

    Acts 8:22 REPENT Repent therefore of this thy WICKEDNESS wickedness,

    2 Corinthians 12:21 And lest, when I come again, my God will humble me among you, and that I shall bewail many which have sinned already, and have not REPENT repented of the uncleanness and fornication and lasciviousness which they have committed. ( repent uncleanness and fornication and lasciviousness )

    Revelation 2:21 And I gave her space to REPENT repent of her FORNICATION fornication; and she repented not.


    Revelation 2:22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit ADULTERY adultery with her into great tribulation, except they REPENT repent of their DEEDS deeds.

    Revelation 9:21 Neither REPENTED repented they of their MURDERS murders, nor of their SORCERIES sorceries, nor of their FORNICATION fornication, nor of their THEFTS thefts.
  • Adam - in Reply on Psalms 8
    Part 2:

    The second observation is your quote:

    How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?"

    Impossible, the Spirit could never allow for such an attitude or interpretation;

    The first part is a scripture Romans 6:2, but your 2nd sentence is not in the Bible. It does not say that after Romans 6:2 and I don't believe a Christian sinning is impossible. Even Paul admits to sin and all Christians sin, so to claim Christians can't sin seems inconsistent with the Bible. Here are a few examples:

    -Much of Jesus's teachings were to his existing followers, including many warnings to not go astray and to 'do things'. If all his Christian followers were already saved then why would Jesus ask them to keep doing things? Why change at all? Why even preach the gospel? Why have a Bible? Why try? I have never heard anyone who believes OSAS have a clear answer for this. If Christians don't need to avoid sin because they're saved regardless why would anything in the Bible even matter? It does matter, because the Bible clearly says obeying God is important. If you don't obey then you don't love Jesus and aren't following Jesus much.

    -Most of Jesus's parables were about how most people will go to hell and how to avoid it. Jesus called people to put forth effort, to change, to take action. If taking action wasn't important or even related to salvation then why would Jesus keep saying it was like in Matthew 7:21? This verse would have to be reinterpreted, discredited, or thrown out to believe that obeying God is bad. Is God likely to say that obeying him is bad or is satan more likely to say that?

    -Judas was a Christian and he betrayed Jesus and died a horrible death and likely went to hell.

    -People are given freewill. We're not robots. The Bible already says all sin. Anyone claiming Christians can't sin is claiming we don't have freewill. Hebrews 10:26.
  • Adam - in Reply on Psalms 8
    Hi Chris,

    Thanks for sharing your explanation. I know you won't change your position and I certainly won't change mine. Each time I read through the Bible my position is only reinforced and each time I pray and ask God to reveal the truth and wisdom in understanding it seems confirmed. So, discussing further isn't likely to bear any fruit. I'm just curious why some passionately spread such an opinion, however, because the risk/reward doesn't seem to balance out. I believe Satan likes deceiving people as he is the great deceiver and liar. He even works to attack Christians' beliefs but they aren't aware of it. So, if there's 2 very different beliefs about salvation, one of them is true and one is false. If satan were to deceive one person into believing a lie, which is more likely: 1) that satan would go around trying to deceive Christians into being more obedient to God than they actually need to? or 2) that satan would go around trying to deceive Christians into disobeying God, despite scripture like John 14:15?
  • Israel Kuda on 1 Timothy 2:12
    I agree with Paul 100% and I believe the Bible does not contradict itself.

    It is true a woman should not teach out of her womanhood or femininity. When she teaches, she is preaching/teaching not as a woman but as a member of the body of Christ, one together with other men and women. The womanhood in her should keep silent in church and be subject to her husband but the new creature in her cannot certainly be forbidden to speak the Word. In any case it was women who brought the first news of the resurrection and it was a woman (Anna) who blessed the then baby Jesus, speaking in the temple (the church). Was it not a woman who preached to the whole city and brought the whole of Samaria to Christ in John chapter 4? They later graduated in their belief (v42), after they had come to hear of the Lord first hand but their first instance of belief (v39) was at the testimony of the woman! Yes women were considered property in the Jewish traditions but now Christ has come to redeem them that are under the legalistic tendencies and nitty-gritties of the law that we might receive the adoption of sons and now we are all sons of God by faith!

    It would be foolish to be legalistic and petty by clinging to do's and don'ts in taking this verse at its literal value; any saved Spirit filled, baptized believer can speak in church for there is neither male nor female but we are all one in Christ Jesus!
  • Mishael On Galatians 323-25 on 1 Timothy 5:8
    3:23. But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.

    3:24. Wherefore the law was our SCHOOLMASTER to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

    3:25. But after faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster

    For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

    Acts 15:10
  • CARLOS RAMIREZ TREVINO - in Reply on Genesis 10
    Chris. Still on Page 3. You say that after the Fall "the Purpose of God in Creation was thwarted". I am certain you don't believe that. You just haven't examined the thought. What does the Bible say about God and His Purpose? It specifically says it cannot be thwarted. The Purpose of God will stand.

    Isaiah 14:24, 26-27 - The LORD of Hosts has sworn: "Surely, as I have planned, so will it be; as I have purposed, so will it stand. This the plan devised for the whole earth, and this is the hand stretched out over all the nations. The LORD of Hosts has purposed, and who can thwart Him? His hand is outstretched, so who can turn it back?

    Ephesians 1:4-5 - According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love.

    Isaiah 46:9-11 - Remember what happened long ago, for I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like Me. I distinguish the end from the beginning, and ancient times from what is still to come, saying: 'My purpose will be established, and I will accomplish all My good pleasure.' I summon a bird of prey from the east, a man for My purpose from a far-off land. Truly I have spoken, truly I will bring it to pass. I have planned it, I will surely do it.

    Isaiah 48:3 - I foretold the former things long ago; they came out of My mouth and I proclaimed them.

    Suddenly I acted, and they came to pass.

    Acts 4:28 - They carried out what Your hand and purpose had decided beforehand would happen.

    Daniel 4:35 - All the peoples of the earth are counted as nothing, and He does as He pleases with the army of heaven and the peoples of the earth. There is no one who can restrain His hand or say to Him, 'What have You done?'"

    The confidence we have is that God is trustworthy. He is not fickle. If God says we will be eternally perfect, we will be. If God had created Adam and Eve perfect, they would have been. And neither they, nor the devil would have rebelled against God.
  • Chris - in Reply on Psalms 8
    Page 3.

    So, in essence, it encompasses all the Law & much, much more, as the Spirit calls for that 'higher level of spiritual living & obedience' that the Law could never give & the Jew could never perform. Does all this then give the possibility of believers becoming 'slack' in their faith, believing that, e.g. "I can steal (or, whatever sin), because the Spirit hasn't convicted me or shown me otherwise"? "Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?" Impossible, the Spirit could never allow for such an attitude or interpretation; if the 'Christian' persists in wilful sin, then he hasn't been saved in the first place (this is of course, references our other discussion on a believer's Eternal Security). I'll leave it here: my 'short' explanation has turned out otherwise.

    The Lord be with your spirit Adam.
  • Chris - in Reply on Psalms 8
    Page 2.

    And in the case of observance of the Sabbath (which is the commandment that is somewhat extraordinary in the list of commands given, as it is specifically incumbent upon Israel), the keeping of it is mandatory, if the believer is to be totally obedient to all of God's Laws. Hence, 'Sabbath keepers', & all who adhere to obedience to the Ten Commandments are constrained to keep the Sabbath as Holy, without exception. Conversely, those in my understanding, who refuse to keep that Sabbath Law because of reasons cited, would also be hypocritical if they kept the other 'Nine" & left out the 'One'.

    So where does this leave us. As far as your understanding & performance of your faith is concerned, I cannot be in a position to answer. But in my understanding & vehement belief, that since God's Salvation through His Son, is only by His Grace & through our Faith in response (& even this Faith is His Gift to us), then obedience to His 'written' Laws not only leads one to knowledge of his own failure to keep them & resultant 'death', but also remains totally incompatible to the Law of Grace as the two are attempted to fusion. What then is the Law of Grace = Law of (Christ's) Spirit? It is the Whole Law of God, not bound by the Ten Commandments & rigid obedience to it which only led to death, but that which is written in our hearts & interpreted for us by His Spirit. "For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death". (onto Page 3).

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