My interpretation of " beware of dogs' and evil workers Is a metaphor. To me he is explaining the evil of man. Dogs I would imagine were wild in this time. Pack animals. Not domesticated like today. They would have hunted together to devour their prey. Like many evil humans.
I did not mean any disrespect about the orthodox teaching, and it winds up I did the opposite to what I intended. I read your posts and I knew My understanding on this subject is different from what I have read of your posts. I knew we would not agree, I did not want to do what it seems like I have done.
I'm sure you would not want anyone killed. I was referring to what was done in the past. I did not mean to imply you would say one is not saved but I have been told that before.
I believe in the KJV it is the only bible I read, and I believe it is the most accurate translation, but like anything it is not perfect and going back to the original text and language helps understanding, that's my opinion which is also not perfect. The Question on the word Godhead was an honest question, I'm sure there is a reason for this translation, but I do not know it. It just stans out.
Again, GiGi I have all the respect for you and the good you do on this site, and I did not mean to cause you any hard feelings.
Hellow Jesse. Sorry for my delayed answer but it seems there are a lot to talk about and since I was too busy during the week, here I am now.
a. Baptism in water. My belief is that although it is a symbolism it is still a requirement/condition for salvation. The verse in Mark 16:16 does not allow for any other interpretation that it what it reads. For one to be saved there is series of events that must take place. Some of them done by man, some of them done by God.
GOD REVEALS HIMSELF- man believes-GOD'S WORD CAUSES REPENTANCE-man repents and wants to change-GOD GIVES NEW BIRTH-man gets baptised in water-GOD GIVES SALVATION (SALVATION COMPLETED)
If verses like Mark 16:16 and Acts 2:38 didn't exist then it would be OK to consider bapt. in water as not essential. but they do exist, and personally I think.they are crystal clear.
Question. Even if one considers baptism not necessary, isn't it still a commandment of God. For how long can someone live his christian life ignoring that commandment, being in a continuous disobedience, being, that is, in a sin?
b. John's baptism. That baptism was not only baptism of repentance but it was for the remission of sins. It is clear in Luke 3:3. I don't say it, Luke does, inspired by God, isn't it so? So you ask, since Jesus had not been sacrifised yet how sins were erased by God? The same way that God overlooked sins done by God's people in the Old testament time. And since Jesus was to come later on, God's people that died went to Abraham's place in Hades, later after ressurection they were transfered in Heaven.
So there was a somehow preliminary remission of sins. And Jews in Jesus' time that later believed in Jesus had to go through new birth and the christian baptism later on.
But what is important is that for the Jews to be forgiven had to go through repentance AND baptism, not just repentance, thus revealing how important baptism was. Similarly in christian baptism one has to go through both new birth and baptism
As far as that spiritual cleansing I wrote in my post, please consider it unsuccessful, I meant forgiveness of sins.
c. Well about those verses that according to me are about water baptism. I want to start with, that In my belief new birth and baptism in Spirit are separate events. One may be born again by the Spirit but still hasn't got the Spirit dwell in him. But this could be another important topic of discussion later on, if you wish so.
I do understand what you are saying but still I understand those verses in a different way than you
Verses 1-3
1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Verses 12-14
12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof
13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God
14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
These verses make me believe that what Paul talks about is not about sanctification but a consideration of a new life.
What, in my opinion, Paul says is that since we died, got buried and were raised up in new life, like Jesus was crucified, was buried and was ressurected from dead, then lets not keep sinning (on purpose) thinking that we have now Christ's Blood, so no problem doing a sin, we will ask for forgiveness later on so God is compelled to forgive us. He uses water baptism as a paralellism to Jesus' life to make christians understand that we walk a new life now, the old sinful life is gone for good, we must think ourselves dead for sin, not even think about sinning, there is something new ahead of us leading to eternal life.
"Blessed are the pure in heart; for they shall see God." ( Matthew 5:8). Christ certainly gave us the perfect example; of mercy and compassion as His concern for the multitudes superseded His own stresses over His impending death; the unbelief of the 12 disciples; the constant threats of the Pharisees; and His jealousy for God's name. He couldn't even get a break when going to a desert place after John was beheaded to grieve with the disciples. Christ surely did all that He was called to do; without ever holding back. Part of this ministry also was deliverance; in caring for those who were in some sense in prison ( Isaiah 42:7).
Souls were ultimately; of course saved so as to secure eternal forgiveness which none of us as sinners deserved.
I; for one am sorely lacking in this gift; and am pleased to have a few brothers and sisters put that gift in display in my lifetime.
One important aspect which separates such individuals from those with a naturally kind disposition (pretty rare today anyway) is PRAYER; particularly spontaneous when such individuals become aware of the needs of others in that capacity. These individuals; also I would highly recommend to have in your prayer circles for when they are walking properly with Jesus they are likely to have an unusually successful prayer life for the simple reason that they have no barricades like many others (as myself) that tend not to have their whole hearts in it. Of course the mind also should participate in prayer. It is often said these individuals as with any others gifted in a certain area have common weaknesses. That weakness would tend to be too easily emotionally manipulated when taking their spiritual eyes off what the Lord desires them to pay attention to and focus on merely human emotions which can be deceptive and fickle. Such individuals in particular need to be grounded in the Word; as they tend often not to be as discerning as they should be.
There would seem to be two parameters here. We need to acknowledge that forgiveness of sins is still necessary after one is "Born Again" as long as we remain in our old bodies; with the potential for corrupted behaviors if we are not subject to Him in putting these old works to death. Since there are verses about sitting down before your brother before taking your gift before the altar and forgiving "seventy times seven" we certainly can bear the scars as long as we are in these mortal bodies because of the result of our sins. It was grace that allowed David to be forgiven of adultery and deliberately putting Uriah the Hittite in a position to be killed hence setting him up. Both sins according to the law were worthy of death; the Prophet told David that he would not die (grace); however he was to lose his child by Bathsheeba. This grief would not last forever; as David foresaw that he would go to see his child; not vice versa implying after his death. Consequences in Corinthians also show how communion unworthily taken can result in early death.
This begs the question as to whether anything can be forgiven for the unregenerate. On a surface level actions can be forgiven; at least among men. The comment to the Pharisee about those who are forgiven much love much ( Luke 7:36 and continuing into next chapter) shows that the heart of stone ( Ezekiel 11:19) was not converted in his case to one of flesh. All we can do as sinners is try to avoid the consequences of largely external actions. The heart where all the thoughts of evil or bad fruit come from ( Matthew 15:19) must be transformed so that we can understand we have offended a Holy God whenever we transgress against those made in the image of God (in reality in the image of man since Adam). All mankind should be treated with dignity as an eternal soul; even in a fallen state.
In short; we cannot lose our salvation but until glorification sin remains. We should mend things fast ( Prov. 18:19!)
I was reading Jeremiah ch 1 , 2, 3, yes it's very applicable to today .
We all must see it Gods way to understand, thank God for the Bible , the OT was written that we might learn by others examples, to do right etc. and avoid the consequences. It also helps us understand our present spiritual environment. God is very merciful, yet he will not pardon sin and refusal to repent . It breaks Gods heart more than any one else to see a sinful people, and that refuse to change ( for their own good ) .
That's the deception they think God will not judge them for their sins .
Brenda, I think this Scripture indeed means that if one is able bodied and can work to earn what is needed to supply of one's own needs, then that person should be expected to work. And if a person will not work, then he/she should not be given sustenance because he/she is able to earn their own living but refuses to do so, thus resorting to handouts, which is stealing from the labors of others, in my opinion.
Perhaps this is an example of the word of knowledge.
The last few years I have called my mother on Sunday and Wednesday evenings to check in with her. My other siblings called on other evenings and also every morning. On Wehnesday April 28 I called her and had a nice conversation with her. When i hung up, I heard a "voice" speak to my mind and said, "This was the last phone conversation you will have with your Mom." Two days later she was hospitalized with sepsis and died two weeks later. Although I had conversation with her when I stayed with her during visiting hours at the hospital on the days I could be there, I did not have any more phone conversation with her. So, I take that as a word of knowledge, preparing me ahead of time for the events at the end of my Mom's life. The word of knowledge gave me comfort because with it I knew that it was God's time for my Mom to be taken to be with Him.
I enjoy reading your posts, you wear your heart on your sleeve, a good thing. I know you are passionate about the triune God we disagree but please take my reply as done in love. I don't know if you have gone back and dug deep into the history of this creed, you may.
How many people (1000s) who most likely believed in Christ were killed on behalf of this creed. I strain to understand how God would be behind something so harsh and cruel and the vicious way people were killed for one word, heresy. Even today people are not killed but are told they are not saved and cannot be saved.
I agree that the beginning is the beginning of creation before anything was. I do not know how to reply to you because you have said before and, in this post, that not believing in a triune God is heretical which comes from strong orthodox teaching, and I do not believe anything can go above the salvation in the doctrine of Christ.
So out of love, I will not ask but one question that you or someone else may shine a light on.
The word Godhead is in the bible only three times, Acts 17:29 the Greek word Theios, definition divine, divine being Romans 1:20 the Greek word theiots meaning divine nature and Colossians 2:9 the Greek word theots meaning deity.
How can three Greek words with meanings; divine, divine being, divine nature, and deity that in context work with their original meaning be translated as Godhead? What I have studied the first known use of godhead was in the 13th century. Maybe you are someone else who can help?
Hi Ronald , I hope you don't mind me interjecting . I have always believed that in John Ch 8 V 58 , that Jesus was saying to those who boasted that Abraham was their father , that God , Jesus's Father , was before Abraham . I think that the 'I am ' in this instance is referring to Y H W H . Put simply , I believe that Jesus is saying to the Jews , my Father is older than yours . I could of course be wrong .
I do hope your rehab goes successfully in learning to walk again. I will pray for you over this time you are there, so please check back in with us with updates to remind me to pray for you.
I can say and I believe you as well, we believe God has no beginning or no end. In John 1:1 it starts with in the beginning, why? Does it mean Jesus the Son of God has been God from eternity or is that an assumption? Scripture tells us Jesus the Amen is the beginning of creation, Rev. 3:14.
Scripture tells us Jesus in whom we have redemption through His blood and forgiveness of our sins and is the image of the invisible God (the manifestation of God). Jesus is the firstborn of every creature and through Him, everything that is was created through and for Him Col. 1:12-17.
It also says the Father made us meet/qualify of the inheritance and says He, Jesus was before "all in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things". Does that say He was eternal with the Father or does scripture tell us He was the firstborn of every creature/all creation in the beginning?
By this Jesus can say "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, the first and the last, He, Jesus was first of all and He will be the last and the ending of this creation when the mystery of God should be finished and the new heaven and the new earth (the new creation perfect without spot).
Jesus the Son of God was the beginning, He is the only begotten Son of God. Does scripture honestly tell how He was begotten? Can we only say God ordained it before the world? Jesus said in John 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was. With our human minds can we have any clue to what that glory is?
The word Elohim is plural, but the verb created is singular and if to support the triune God it should read Gods and there are not three Gods. That would be for another topic.
John 8:58 I am, I exist or existed before Abraham. Exodus 3:14 I AM THAT I AM if I remember, I will be what I will be, it is also close to God's name YHWH. I don't see tying these two together.
From our conversation which I have enjoyed, I do not see an agreement. The one thing about this doctrine, statement of faith whatever you call it I feel is wrong it has been placed above salvation that is in Jesus Christ only. If one does not believe it, it is heresy, you may feel it is. I have been told in more than one church. I hear the word used on this site. And there is not one scripture that says it, nor was it taught by any of the apostles.
In my opinion, it has been made law and it is like Acts 15 You must be circumcised to be saved. Jesus is the only begotten son of God, and God the Father has placed Him above all, and Jesus will reign until all enemies are put under His feet.
God the Father has turned all control to His Son that is what we see in Rev. 1:8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty. Which is all-powerful, supreme, absolute, unlimited, invincible, until He turns it back over to the Father, Cor.15:25-28 Rev. 20:14
I honor the Son for what He gave up, lived in this flesh, what He suffered, and the blood He shed, was nailed to that cross. He was put in a tomb and three days later God the Father raised Him from the dead giving us the only chance of salvation and eternal life and nothing can be placed above that.
1 Timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
I think I know what this means but if you do not forgive somebody does that mean that you don't get to go to heaven because if you can't forgive somebody then your heavenly father can't forgive you I hope I said that right thank you
There is only one God and his name is JESUS. God is a Spirit #1 manif#2 estation - manifested (revealed what was secret, invisible, unseen) in the flesh as a man #2 manifestation, name Jesus, and after resurrection, ascended sent Holy Spirit #3 manifestation, NOT PERSONS, at three separate events, time frame. My answer to your question on trinity - no I don't believe in this doctrine - it is false that contradicts the truth in the Bible.
I am not offended at all by what you wrote to me in your post. I am not that over sensitive. So, not need to apologize. Your good!
Have a good evening.
That's my take on it.
I did not mean any disrespect about the orthodox teaching, and it winds up I did the opposite to what I intended. I read your posts and I knew My understanding on this subject is different from what I have read of your posts. I knew we would not agree, I did not want to do what it seems like I have done.
I'm sure you would not want anyone killed. I was referring to what was done in the past. I did not mean to imply you would say one is not saved but I have been told that before.
I believe in the KJV it is the only bible I read, and I believe it is the most accurate translation, but like anything it is not perfect and going back to the original text and language helps understanding, that's my opinion which is also not perfect. The Question on the word Godhead was an honest question, I'm sure there is a reason for this translation, but I do not know it. It just stans out.
Again, GiGi I have all the respect for you and the good you do on this site, and I did not mean to cause you any hard feelings.
God bless,
RLW
Hellow Jesse. Sorry for my delayed answer but it seems there are a lot to talk about and since I was too busy during the week, here I am now.
a. Baptism in water. My belief is that although it is a symbolism it is still a requirement/condition for salvation. The verse in Mark 16:16 does not allow for any other interpretation that it what it reads. For one to be saved there is series of events that must take place. Some of them done by man, some of them done by God.
GOD REVEALS HIMSELF- man believes-GOD'S WORD CAUSES REPENTANCE-man repents and wants to change-GOD GIVES NEW BIRTH-man gets baptised in water-GOD GIVES SALVATION (SALVATION COMPLETED)
If verses like Mark 16:16 and Acts 2:38 didn't exist then it would be OK to consider bapt. in water as not essential. but they do exist, and personally I think.they are crystal clear.
Question. Even if one considers baptism not necessary, isn't it still a commandment of God. For how long can someone live his christian life ignoring that commandment, being in a continuous disobedience, being, that is, in a sin?
b. John's baptism. That baptism was not only baptism of repentance but it was for the remission of sins. It is clear in Luke 3:3. I don't say it, Luke does, inspired by God, isn't it so? So you ask, since Jesus had not been sacrifised yet how sins were erased by God? The same way that God overlooked sins done by God's people in the Old testament time. And since Jesus was to come later on, God's people that died went to Abraham's place in Hades, later after ressurection they were transfered in Heaven.
So there was a somehow preliminary remission of sins. And Jews in Jesus' time that later believed in Jesus had to go through new birth and the christian baptism later on.
But what is important is that for the Jews to be forgiven had to go through repentance AND baptism, not just repentance, thus revealing how important baptism was. Similarly in christian baptism one has to go through both new birth and baptism
Jesse
As far as that spiritual cleansing I wrote in my post, please consider it unsuccessful, I meant forgiveness of sins.
c. Well about those verses that according to me are about water baptism. I want to start with, that In my belief new birth and baptism in Spirit are separate events. One may be born again by the Spirit but still hasn't got the Spirit dwell in him. But this could be another important topic of discussion later on, if you wish so.
I do understand what you are saying but still I understand those verses in a different way than you
Verses 1-3
1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Verses 12-14
12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof
13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God
14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
These verses make me believe that what Paul talks about is not about sanctification but a consideration of a new life.
What, in my opinion, Paul says is that since we died, got buried and were raised up in new life, like Jesus was crucified, was buried and was ressurected from dead, then lets not keep sinning (on purpose) thinking that we have now Christ's Blood, so no problem doing a sin, we will ask for forgiveness later on so God is compelled to forgive us. He uses water baptism as a paralellism to Jesus' life to make christians understand that we walk a new life now, the old sinful life is gone for good, we must think ourselves dead for sin, not even think about sinning, there is something new ahead of us leading to eternal life.
Have a blessed w/e.
"Blessed are the pure in heart; for they shall see God." ( Matthew 5:8). Christ certainly gave us the perfect example; of mercy and compassion as His concern for the multitudes superseded His own stresses over His impending death; the unbelief of the 12 disciples; the constant threats of the Pharisees; and His jealousy for God's name. He couldn't even get a break when going to a desert place after John was beheaded to grieve with the disciples. Christ surely did all that He was called to do; without ever holding back. Part of this ministry also was deliverance; in caring for those who were in some sense in prison ( Isaiah 42:7).
Souls were ultimately; of course saved so as to secure eternal forgiveness which none of us as sinners deserved.
I; for one am sorely lacking in this gift; and am pleased to have a few brothers and sisters put that gift in display in my lifetime.
One important aspect which separates such individuals from those with a naturally kind disposition (pretty rare today anyway) is PRAYER; particularly spontaneous when such individuals become aware of the needs of others in that capacity. These individuals; also I would highly recommend to have in your prayer circles for when they are walking properly with Jesus they are likely to have an unusually successful prayer life for the simple reason that they have no barricades like many others (as myself) that tend not to have their whole hearts in it. Of course the mind also should participate in prayer. It is often said these individuals as with any others gifted in a certain area have common weaknesses. That weakness would tend to be too easily emotionally manipulated when taking their spiritual eyes off what the Lord desires them to pay attention to and focus on merely human emotions which can be deceptive and fickle. Such individuals in particular need to be grounded in the Word; as they tend often not to be as discerning as they should be.
This begs the question as to whether anything can be forgiven for the unregenerate. On a surface level actions can be forgiven; at least among men. The comment to the Pharisee about those who are forgiven much love much ( Luke 7:36 and continuing into next chapter) shows that the heart of stone ( Ezekiel 11:19) was not converted in his case to one of flesh. All we can do as sinners is try to avoid the consequences of largely external actions. The heart where all the thoughts of evil or bad fruit come from ( Matthew 15:19) must be transformed so that we can understand we have offended a Holy God whenever we transgress against those made in the image of God (in reality in the image of man since Adam). All mankind should be treated with dignity as an eternal soul; even in a fallen state.
In short; we cannot lose our salvation but until glorification sin remains. We should mend things fast ( Prov. 18:19!)
We all must see it Gods way to understand, thank God for the Bible , the OT was written that we might learn by others examples, to do right etc. and avoid the consequences. It also helps us understand our present spiritual environment. God is very merciful, yet he will not pardon sin and refusal to repent . It breaks Gods heart more than any one else to see a sinful people, and that refuse to change ( for their own good ) .
That's the deception they think God will not judge them for their sins .
I would like you to re-explain your inquiry so I can better understand what you are asking about the Baptist church.
Perhaps this is an example of the word of knowledge.
The last few years I have called my mother on Sunday and Wednesday evenings to check in with her. My other siblings called on other evenings and also every morning. On Wehnesday April 28 I called her and had a nice conversation with her. When i hung up, I heard a "voice" speak to my mind and said, "This was the last phone conversation you will have with your Mom." Two days later she was hospitalized with sepsis and died two weeks later. Although I had conversation with her when I stayed with her during visiting hours at the hospital on the days I could be there, I did not have any more phone conversation with her. So, I take that as a word of knowledge, preparing me ahead of time for the events at the end of my Mom's life. The word of knowledge gave me comfort because with it I knew that it was God's time for my Mom to be taken to be with Him.
I enjoy reading your posts, you wear your heart on your sleeve, a good thing. I know you are passionate about the triune God we disagree but please take my reply as done in love. I don't know if you have gone back and dug deep into the history of this creed, you may.
How many people (1000s) who most likely believed in Christ were killed on behalf of this creed. I strain to understand how God would be behind something so harsh and cruel and the vicious way people were killed for one word, heresy. Even today people are not killed but are told they are not saved and cannot be saved.
I agree that the beginning is the beginning of creation before anything was. I do not know how to reply to you because you have said before and, in this post, that not believing in a triune God is heretical which comes from strong orthodox teaching, and I do not believe anything can go above the salvation in the doctrine of Christ.
So out of love, I will not ask but one question that you or someone else may shine a light on.
The word Godhead is in the bible only three times, Acts 17:29 the Greek word Theios, definition divine, divine being Romans 1:20 the Greek word theiots meaning divine nature and Colossians 2:9 the Greek word theots meaning deity.
How can three Greek words with meanings; divine, divine being, divine nature, and deity that in context work with their original meaning be translated as Godhead? What I have studied the first known use of godhead was in the 13th century. Maybe you are someone else who can help?
God bless,
RLW
I do hope your rehab goes successfully in learning to walk again. I will pray for you over this time you are there, so please check back in with us with updates to remind me to pray for you.
Thank you. I'll get back to you soon. I have some big projects to finish up this weekend, so hopefully, early in the week.
key word born can't be reversed, also collossians 2:13-23 then all same epistle chapter 3 deals with where
we keep our mind. Look brother we have been redeemed i.e. bought back and justified i.e. and we have the
righteousness of God inChrist which means we stand infront of God with no sense of sin guilt or condemnation
walking by the spirit so do not beat yourself up GOD ISNT. If God is no longer against us when we do our best
then why do we when our sin is bought and payed for not saying if we blow we don't ask forgivemess, we
acknowledge our broken fellowship which is what sin and do it honestly then keep moving on. That's what our
great example King davuid did when he blew it with bathsheba and had her husband murdered, he acknowledge
his sin ask forgiveness was in sackclothe and ashes three days prayer that the child would live then when he got
word that he died immediately got himself together and back to doing what God told him to be doing. Remember
this is a man that God says scripturally uis a man after His own heart. So love yourself and think of yourself as
God thinks of you, and remember the sabbath was made for man not man for the sabbath IT IS WRITTEN.
That's a Great topic.
Let me finish up for today my Honey over due list/chores. It's bad enough I may get stoned for my view, I don't need trouble here at home also.
If a man don't work he don't eat!
God bless.
Part 1
I can say and I believe you as well, we believe God has no beginning or no end. In John 1:1 it starts with in the beginning, why? Does it mean Jesus the Son of God has been God from eternity or is that an assumption? Scripture tells us Jesus the Amen is the beginning of creation, Rev. 3:14.
Scripture tells us Jesus in whom we have redemption through His blood and forgiveness of our sins and is the image of the invisible God (the manifestation of God). Jesus is the firstborn of every creature and through Him, everything that is was created through and for Him Col. 1:12-17.
It also says the Father made us meet/qualify of the inheritance and says He, Jesus was before "all in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things". Does that say He was eternal with the Father or does scripture tell us He was the firstborn of every creature/all creation in the beginning?
By this Jesus can say "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, the first and the last, He, Jesus was first of all and He will be the last and the ending of this creation when the mystery of God should be finished and the new heaven and the new earth (the new creation perfect without spot).
Jesus the Son of God was the beginning, He is the only begotten Son of God. Does scripture honestly tell how He was begotten? Can we only say God ordained it before the world? Jesus said in John 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was. With our human minds can we have any clue to what that glory is?
See part 2,
part 2
The word Elohim is plural, but the verb created is singular and if to support the triune God it should read Gods and there are not three Gods. That would be for another topic.
John 8:58 I am, I exist or existed before Abraham. Exodus 3:14 I AM THAT I AM if I remember, I will be what I will be, it is also close to God's name YHWH. I don't see tying these two together.
From our conversation which I have enjoyed, I do not see an agreement. The one thing about this doctrine, statement of faith whatever you call it I feel is wrong it has been placed above salvation that is in Jesus Christ only. If one does not believe it, it is heresy, you may feel it is. I have been told in more than one church. I hear the word used on this site. And there is not one scripture that says it, nor was it taught by any of the apostles.
In my opinion, it has been made law and it is like Acts 15 You must be circumcised to be saved. Jesus is the only begotten son of God, and God the Father has placed Him above all, and Jesus will reign until all enemies are put under His feet.
God the Father has turned all control to His Son that is what we see in Rev. 1:8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty. Which is all-powerful, supreme, absolute, unlimited, invincible, until He turns it back over to the Father, Cor.15:25-28 Rev. 20:14
I honor the Son for what He gave up, lived in this flesh, what He suffered, and the blood He shed, was nailed to that cross. He was put in a tomb and three days later God the Father raised Him from the dead giving us the only chance of salvation and eternal life and nothing can be placed above that.
1 Timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
God bless,
RLW
now in human genetics the bloodline is on the male side, when it comes to our saviour HIS BLOOD was pure which is why
Judas said I have betrayed innocent blood. In Hebrews 2:14 it says Jesus Christ took part of the same he had sinless blood
the flesh was corrupt. He never thought to do evil but understood how to with His Fathers help shut the enemy down until
it was time to fulfill and he couldn't be touched until then. He knew how His father functioned via the scriptures because
the only way to know God is by IT IS WRITTEN. What a day when we practice open mind to Gods word and all we do to
His glory not ours which requires caring and walking by the spirit. He was a complete and perfect man of body soul and
spirit or as the scripture say the second adam from heaven. I with you do not believe he litterally was God.
understanding where as there is no doubt] then you can go down to verse 21. Then there is the word for know
oida which is like knowing baseball but never played, which is head knowledge God wants us to have a indept heart
of who He is and How his word works in the church.
i'll know that if the outcome glorifies God and lines up with HiS word. I went to a worship center with a friend that said
the guy teaches hot bible so my wife and I went with him, the first half hour were people dancing to music and dropping
in the aisles supposedly slain in the spirit and my friend said aren't you exited and told him haven't heard any body teach
yet. After the music this leader came up to the podium and picked up the phone receiver and loud enough to be heard said
God what do you want me to share then proceeded to minister to people the spirit of education and plumbing and carpentry
and other stuff. When it was all over my friend who looked like he did drugs ask me so what do I think and I said my problem
was he never taught out of the bible so whats really going on. You can't make this stuff up and that's why I still believe that
other believers when they see those kind of examples don't want anything to do with it and I don't blame them. I have gone
to fellowships where all things are done decent and in order and its peaceful and delivering when operated according to
scripture. It's not Gods fault that the enemy has basically blended truth with error or confusion because after all that's
what he does.