Interesting thread, can we understand the wisdom of God? God is light and no darkness is in Him. "God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man". Can we understand what was done to Job? Can we understand why God allowed Satan limited control over the earth? Do we know why all the deaths, wars, and evil are allowed to be on earth? Do we overlook Jesus was sacrificed not only to reconcile things on the earth but also to reconcile things in heaven Colossians 1:20?
Did God allow Adam and Eve to sin? God has declared the end from the beginning and many things we have not been told, there come speculation that man is good at, self-included. There are two Adams in scripture and God's plan was before the world was. Can we ask the question, was the first Adam's purpose to start mankind; or was it for the same reason the last Adam was manifested that Satan had no clue? 1 John 3:8.
Isaiah 46:9-10 Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me, 10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:
We cannot come close to grasping the wisdom of God and His plan. We must humble ourselves; we have been given a choice to accept the grace God has given us in the sacrifice of His only begotten Son. If we accept this gift of salvation, we give this fleshly life to Him.
God is in control, not free will, whether we understand it or not and we must trust God with what happens to us in this life even if we are killed. A time is coming when many will be. Our hope is not in this life but in the life to come.
Giannis....Let me try to help you in Jesus Name..The name of the Kingdom is CHILD BIRTH....Uness ya receive the Kingdom of God as a lil Child you will in no wise enter there in....And that Child of PROMISE is the H.G....Thus there is only 1 baptism of PROMISE...Only 1 is needed ...Thats y he has to KNOW US thats when his good seed is sown in our hearts....Resulting in a spritual birth...Remember she brought forth a manchild that is gonna rule all nations....Which is that spirit of truth Jesus spoke of that cannot speak, simply b/c he is an spritual infant...A new Born .The spirit ( the H.G. ) has to be born in us via his Seed ...his Words etc....Thats y he said that which is born of the SPIRIT IS SPIRIT which is the H.G the Children of Promise....There has to be an Israel of God...Born in us and they are spirits...Thats y the sun nor any heat or the moon can lite on them simply b/c they are spirits...Read Isaiah 49 kjv.
.....But back in John 20:22 And John 16 :21..He had already breathe on them, as his breath was his WORDS which are his SEEDS and Faith set in which is a spritual pregnancy..They had the substance of things hoped for the evidence of things not seen..The Child the H.G. That Child of PROMISE....That resulted from his seeds his words....But the H.G. Child had not been born just yet till that mighty rushing Wind came..They had to go thru a gestation period b/4 the Child came and with Power....But Jesus said John baptised you with water but I will baptise you with the H.G. and fire...As our God is a consuming fire...When Jesus started his ministry he was preaching I come to bring FIRE on the earth...Thats his baptism of the H.G. That we so need..The 1 and only baptism of PROMISE..Which was the multiplication of God from Gods own Promise when he swore by himself.
.....Jesus in Acts 1:4 Wait for the Promise of my Father that you have HEARD OF ME ( SEED)...John baptised you with water but you will be baptised with the H.G. NOT MANY DAYS HENCE ...Baby
I have always thought that this might be metaphoric . Many people will say ' I can save you ' or ' I have the answers to your problem ' or ' follow me ' people such as politicians , or scientists , or we ourselves could look to other things to ' save ' us , things that we think will make us happy such as money or a romance or drugs or alcohol etc . Nothing in this world can save us from the wrath to come except Christ , we need to run to him and stick with him . There have been so called religious guru types , calling themselves Christians and of other religious beliefs over the years , I don't like to mention names in case I offend but I think most of us can remember at least one . It goes on all the time all over the world , thankfully people who have read and understood the Bible are not usually taken in by these people .
Hello Andrew. Further to T. Levis list of Scriptures given for your consideration, Genesis 5:28-32 specifically details Noah's father & Noah's sons. Noah wasn't of angelic origin but clearly had a human ancestry.
Also at the bottom of the page called become a Christian. Believers here are more than pleased to answer any questions you may have about what you're reading. God bless.
Why did GOD destroy the earth except Noah & his family = reply : Genesis 6:5,6,7,8,
Please read again Genesis 6, look back to Genesis 4:26, Genesis 5, Job 1:5,6, Job 1:20-22 continues to Job 2:1, John 1:12, Romans 8:14, Philippians 2:15, Hebrews 1:4,5,6,7
Angels aren't Sons of GOD 1Corinthians 6:3,
In KJV 1611 Tobit 3, Tobit 7, Tobit 12, are the only thing even close & there was not what you stated in these scriptures. Mark 12:25, notice the scriptures here are relevant to Tobit; Mark 12:18-25,
What did Jesus mean " many will come in my name saying I am Christ "? There are not many saying they are Jesus so that can not be it . But there are making him "I AM " the Christ that's a given . What think you ? Matthew 24 , Luke 21 . So many .
Henry I am saying that apostles were already born again(new birth) before Pentecost and on Pentecost they received the HS. There wasn't any new birth on Pentecost, it was done before that's why the Apostles got water baptised before Jesus died on the cross(because they had been born again). New birth(or born again) is done by the HS but it is not the same as the baptism in the Spirit. It is a separate event. That is why I pointed out to you some incidents from the Book of Acts that show that. Anyway thanks for the conversation. .GBU
Thank you Henry for your question. As you gave it, I would say that God did allow Adam & Eve to sin (or, not to sin) because the power of choice was within the Divinity & was transmitted into man as were other aspects that made man in God's Image.
As far as man's downfall, Adam & Eve, with that power of choice, chose to obey Satan, without Satan having any authority to change any of their characteristics given them by God. In other words, Satan could only tempt man by offering a proposition - man had to choose who to obey.
In present terms, I would liken this to a man approaching me with an incredible investment portfolio promising very high returns, with all the supporting documentation to convince me; & presenting all this with the exuberance & conviction that is found in a salesman. Many people might be seduced by this 'once-in-a-lifetime' offer, but the astute one will know that in spite of his presentation, such an investment is guaranteed to be fraught with risks. Adam & Eve may have been naive before Satan, but they had God's Word clearly given to them coupled with an intimate daily walk with their Maker. That should have been sufficient to withstand Satan, but Satan's offer seemed too good to resist.
Now, how all this (your question & my response) ties in with God sending out an evil spirit to Saul, I'm unsure. Maybe yours is a new question so I'll sit back & allow you to develop this, if you care to.
I can understand how Zechariah was caught in unbelief. There had not been any prophecy in Israel for 400-500 years, Malachi being the last prophet, I believe. So, the Word of the Lord had not come to any person in all that time. The people had the written O.T. to hear read and learn from the rabbis. But, God was not speaking to people through a prophet for all that time. Also, Zechariah and Elizabeth were elderly, long past childbearing age and were unable to conceive a child. They probably had given up all hope of every having a child from their marriage union. They most likely had found a way to be resolved to this fact. Infertility is very hard to go through while a woman is still having her fertility cycle, but after these cease, most couples would accept that they would never have children of their own. And Zechariah would have had trouble believing that YHWH would choose him to bring a prophecy to, since he did not have any children, like a good priest would have had. he may have felt unqualified to receive such a prophecy for this very reason. But God was gracious to him and Elizabeth. Like Sarah who laughed when the Angel of the Lord told Abraham that she would soon become pregnant at 99 years of age, God did not reneg on his promise. He had a profound reason to give these prophecies and promises and that it was of utmost importance for them to be carried out according to His wisdom and pre-ordained plan. He would fulfill His Word faithfully and flawlessly regardless of how the one contacted responded. God's will prevails in His plan of redemption. Thankfully!
Moses orders the Levites, I believe, to consecrate themselves to the Lord for opposing their won brethren and sons that day. The Levites needed to be humble about this event. They needed to acknowledge that they were performing YHWH's judgment and should be sure to obey Him, knowing that they themselves could be judged in the same way should they turn from YHWH.
The next day, Moses addresses the people, telling them that they sinned greatly, and here Moses says that there is a need for an atonement for the sins of these people. Moses said he would go up to the LORD on their behalf. Moses was ready to be blotted out of the Book of Life for these people as an act of atonement if God would then forgive them. But he was not a perfect substitute as Jesus was, nor, being only man, and not God as Jesus is, Moses could not pay the infinite penalty for sin. But we can admire Moses' willingness to do this, just as Paul said that he wished that he would be accursed and cut off from Christ if it would mean that Israel could be saved. I do not think that Paul actually thought he, himself could improve on the sacrifice of Christ, but said this to express his deep desire for the redemption of his own people. Moses perhaps had a look to Calvary in this instance, too, seeing ahead the redemption of the Messiah.
YHWH tells Moses "Whoever has sinned against me, I will blot him out of my book." So, perhaps not everyone in the camp participated in this event. YHWH tells Moses to continue to lead the people to the place promised and that His Angel will go before him, and then reminding Moses of a future judgment when these people will be punished for their sin.
The chapter closes saying that the LORD plagued the people because of their sin with the calf. It does not specify what the plague or plagues were. But I imagine this punishment reminded them often of how they sinned and how seriously YHWH considered it to be and how deadly sin is.
Moses and Joshua saw the calf and the people dancing (perhaps around the calf, rather than with each other-as worship). Moses became so righteously angry that he threw the stone tablets down with such force that they broke. What a vivid display of breaking the law of God-which the people were doing with so much glee and revelry!
Moses wasted not time speaking to the people (he spoke quite loudly with the breaking of the tablets), but he at once burned the golden calf in the fire and ground it down into a powder. Wondering how he did that, didn't it melt? Was this a miracle? He then scattered the powder upon the water that the people used to drink. What was pure, clean water became tainted with the powder and Moses made them all drink this water. How vividly illustrative of how sin becomes part of us, like water and what we eat. We can't just wash it off. It permeates every part of us, just like the molecules of water and food become a part of every cell in our bodies.
Moses then addresses Aaron, asking what the people did to him to bring him to do this great sin. Aaron give a really lame story about throwing the the earrings into the fire and, "whallah" a calf came out! He even makes it seem like the people forced him to do this.
And so, Standing at the entrance to the camp, Moses makes a charge, "whoever is on YHWH's side come and stand with me"
Only the sons of Levi came and stood with Moses. Moses instructed the sons of Levi to use their swords and go through the camp and slay their brethren, companions, neighbors. These were people the Levites knew and loved, these were "family". That day, the Levites slew 3 thousand men. That is a very small number considering that the group numbered in the millions. But, in obedience to Moses, and, I believe, guided by YHWH, the Levites killed those YHWH had pre-ordained to be killed that day. I wonder if these men were the ones who led the way for the demands for a "god they could see" to worship
YHWH says He will consume them with His wrath. I wonder if God said this because His will was to do this and then Moses persuaded Him to relent, or if He told Moses this so that Moses would know that these people deserved nothing but wrath to emphasize the seriousness of sin. I tend to think it is the latter because I do not think God can be talked out of what He intends to do. The Word says He will accomplish whatever He wills to do and no one can stay Him.
But Moses intercedes for his people-just as Jesus intercedes to the Father for all of us, for we are no different than these Israelites, completely unable to keep His law perfectly, quickly falling into error in our beliefs, trying to substitute something more acceptable or less disturbing to our sensibilities for God's way.
YHWH would have been perfectly just to consume the Israelites with his fiery wrath, but at Moses' pleading, He shows mercy. He does the same for us, not bringing upon us the destruction and torment we deserve, but instead, He continues to be gracious and forgiving to us despite our sinfulness.
Moses then proceeds down the mountain, knowing that YHWH will not destroy the whole nation for this sin. He carried with Him the two tablets of the Decalogue made of stone that YHWH inscribed by Himself, not chiseled by Moses. These tablets of the Law were sacred and good, untainted by human hands and thoughts.
At some point Moses meets up with Joshua on the Mount, most likely where Moses had left him to wait. Interesting to think that Moses was on the Mount 40 days and nights, and so was Joshua, waiting for Moses to come back down. Joshua did not give up hope of Moses coming down again. He had faith in YHWH and was obedient. Joshua tells Moses, "There is noise of war in the camp." The Israelites must have really been raising a clamor. But Moses correct Joshua, saying that the noise is not of victory, defeat, but singing.
Your being..
I already understand all of what you shared.
Visited buy also in eastern culture when they invite you to break bread
That's a huge move love and respect. Also notice he served His best!
Interesting thread, can we understand the wisdom of God? God is light and no darkness is in Him. "God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man". Can we understand what was done to Job? Can we understand why God allowed Satan limited control over the earth? Do we know why all the deaths, wars, and evil are allowed to be on earth? Do we overlook Jesus was sacrificed not only to reconcile things on the earth but also to reconcile things in heaven Colossians 1:20?
Did God allow Adam and Eve to sin? God has declared the end from the beginning and many things we have not been told, there come speculation that man is good at, self-included. There are two Adams in scripture and God's plan was before the world was. Can we ask the question, was the first Adam's purpose to start mankind; or was it for the same reason the last Adam was manifested that Satan had no clue? 1 John 3:8.
Isaiah 46:9-10 Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me, 10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:
We cannot come close to grasping the wisdom of God and His plan. We must humble ourselves; we have been given a choice to accept the grace God has given us in the sacrifice of His only begotten Son. If we accept this gift of salvation, we give this fleshly life to Him.
God is in control, not free will, whether we understand it or not and we must trust God with what happens to us in this life even if we are killed. A time is coming when many will be. Our hope is not in this life but in the life to come.
Job 38:1-4 Micah 4:12 1 Corinthians 2:14 Revelation 10:7
God bless,
RLW
Apostles because apostle is a term in the body of Christ after Pentecost?
Ephesians and God gave some Apostles prophets evangelist pastors and teachers.
Now to a degree throughout old testament certain men worked within one of these
Gifts and obviously our lord and Saviour operated All but the term apostle is not
Used until after Pentecost because. Before pentecost they were called followers
Or disciple for disciplined one. Also a qualification of an Apostle is one who had
Physically seen Jesus Christ of which. Saul who Became. Paul was one. Have
A great day,
.....But back in John 20:22 And John 16 :21..He had already breathe on them, as his breath was his WORDS which are his SEEDS and Faith set in which is a spritual pregnancy..They had the substance of things hoped for the evidence of things not seen..The Child the H.G. That Child of PROMISE....That resulted from his seeds his words....But the H.G. Child had not been born just yet till that mighty rushing Wind came..They had to go thru a gestation period b/4 the Child came and with Power....But Jesus said John baptised you with water but I will baptise you with the H.G. and fire...As our God is a consuming fire...When Jesus started his ministry he was preaching I come to bring FIRE on the earth...Thats his baptism of the H.G. That we so need..The 1 and only baptism of PROMISE..Which was the multiplication of God from Gods own Promise when he swore by himself.
.....Jesus in Acts 1:4 Wait for the Promise of my Father that you have HEARD OF ME ( SEED)...John baptised you with water but you will be baptised with the H.G. NOT MANY DAYS HENCE ...Baby
Link
Also at the bottom of the page called become a Christian. Believers here are more than pleased to answer any questions you may have about what you're reading. God bless.
Please read again Genesis 6, look back to Genesis 4:26, Genesis 5, Job 1:5,6, Job 1:20-22 continues to Job 2:1, John 1:12, Romans 8:14, Philippians 2:15, Hebrews 1:4,5,6,7
Angels aren't Sons of GOD 1Corinthians 6:3,
In KJV 1611 Tobit 3, Tobit 7, Tobit 12, are the only thing even close & there was not what you stated in these scriptures. Mark 12:25, notice the scriptures here are relevant to Tobit; Mark 12:18-25,
Hopefully these are helpful
Could it be Revelation 2:19, Thy works "charity "? listed 1st,
Also 1st Works old testament? Deuteronomy 26,
Hopefully these are helpful
Matthew 25:31-46, Isaiah 58, John 13:34, Romans 12:10, Romans 13:8, 1Peter 3:8, Hebrews 10:24,
Romans 4, notice in those 'works' it's speaking of circumcision Romans 4:1, Romans 4:9-13, not acts of compassion
They don't contradict each other they're completely separate issues, Deuteronomy 10:16-20,
Malachi 3:5,10 = Deuteronomy 26:10-13 , Exodus 22:22, Deuteronomy 14:22-29, Deuteronomy 24:14-15, Deuteronomy 24:19-21,
Matthew 5:16-20, Matthew 7:12-27 = Mark 12:38-40, Mark 23, Luke 20:46,47, Isaiah 9:17,
Hopefully helpful
Exodus 34:14, Matthew 4:10, John 4:23,24,
Daniel 8:17,18, Daniel 10:9, Daniel 10:15-19,
Wrongly : 1Kings 12:30, Acts 18:13, Revelation 19:10, Revelation 22:8,9,
Hopefully these are helpful
As far as man's downfall, Adam & Eve, with that power of choice, chose to obey Satan, without Satan having any authority to change any of their characteristics given them by God. In other words, Satan could only tempt man by offering a proposition - man had to choose who to obey.
In present terms, I would liken this to a man approaching me with an incredible investment portfolio promising very high returns, with all the supporting documentation to convince me; & presenting all this with the exuberance & conviction that is found in a salesman. Many people might be seduced by this 'once-in-a-lifetime' offer, but the astute one will know that in spite of his presentation, such an investment is guaranteed to be fraught with risks. Adam & Eve may have been naive before Satan, but they had God's Word clearly given to them coupled with an intimate daily walk with their Maker. That should have been sufficient to withstand Satan, but Satan's offer seemed too good to resist.
Now, how all this (your question & my response) ties in with God sending out an evil spirit to Saul, I'm unsure. Maybe yours is a new question so I'll sit back & allow you to develop this, if you care to.
I can understand how Zechariah was caught in unbelief. There had not been any prophecy in Israel for 400-500 years, Malachi being the last prophet, I believe. So, the Word of the Lord had not come to any person in all that time. The people had the written O.T. to hear read and learn from the rabbis. But, God was not speaking to people through a prophet for all that time. Also, Zechariah and Elizabeth were elderly, long past childbearing age and were unable to conceive a child. They probably had given up all hope of every having a child from their marriage union. They most likely had found a way to be resolved to this fact. Infertility is very hard to go through while a woman is still having her fertility cycle, but after these cease, most couples would accept that they would never have children of their own. And Zechariah would have had trouble believing that YHWH would choose him to bring a prophecy to, since he did not have any children, like a good priest would have had. he may have felt unqualified to receive such a prophecy for this very reason. But God was gracious to him and Elizabeth. Like Sarah who laughed when the Angel of the Lord told Abraham that she would soon become pregnant at 99 years of age, God did not reneg on his promise. He had a profound reason to give these prophecies and promises and that it was of utmost importance for them to be carried out according to His wisdom and pre-ordained plan. He would fulfill His Word faithfully and flawlessly regardless of how the one contacted responded. God's will prevails in His plan of redemption. Thankfully!
Lordship Salvation is......
Free Grace Salvations is......
Doing so will help us know better how to respond to your question.
Moses orders the Levites, I believe, to consecrate themselves to the Lord for opposing their won brethren and sons that day. The Levites needed to be humble about this event. They needed to acknowledge that they were performing YHWH's judgment and should be sure to obey Him, knowing that they themselves could be judged in the same way should they turn from YHWH.
The next day, Moses addresses the people, telling them that they sinned greatly, and here Moses says that there is a need for an atonement for the sins of these people. Moses said he would go up to the LORD on their behalf. Moses was ready to be blotted out of the Book of Life for these people as an act of atonement if God would then forgive them. But he was not a perfect substitute as Jesus was, nor, being only man, and not God as Jesus is, Moses could not pay the infinite penalty for sin. But we can admire Moses' willingness to do this, just as Paul said that he wished that he would be accursed and cut off from Christ if it would mean that Israel could be saved. I do not think that Paul actually thought he, himself could improve on the sacrifice of Christ, but said this to express his deep desire for the redemption of his own people. Moses perhaps had a look to Calvary in this instance, too, seeing ahead the redemption of the Messiah.
YHWH tells Moses "Whoever has sinned against me, I will blot him out of my book." So, perhaps not everyone in the camp participated in this event. YHWH tells Moses to continue to lead the people to the place promised and that His Angel will go before him, and then reminding Moses of a future judgment when these people will be punished for their sin.
The chapter closes saying that the LORD plagued the people because of their sin with the calf. It does not specify what the plague or plagues were. But I imagine this punishment reminded them often of how they sinned and how seriously YHWH considered it to be and how deadly sin is.
Moses and Joshua saw the calf and the people dancing (perhaps around the calf, rather than with each other-as worship). Moses became so righteously angry that he threw the stone tablets down with such force that they broke. What a vivid display of breaking the law of God-which the people were doing with so much glee and revelry!
Moses wasted not time speaking to the people (he spoke quite loudly with the breaking of the tablets), but he at once burned the golden calf in the fire and ground it down into a powder. Wondering how he did that, didn't it melt? Was this a miracle? He then scattered the powder upon the water that the people used to drink. What was pure, clean water became tainted with the powder and Moses made them all drink this water. How vividly illustrative of how sin becomes part of us, like water and what we eat. We can't just wash it off. It permeates every part of us, just like the molecules of water and food become a part of every cell in our bodies.
Moses then addresses Aaron, asking what the people did to him to bring him to do this great sin. Aaron give a really lame story about throwing the the earrings into the fire and, "whallah" a calf came out! He even makes it seem like the people forced him to do this.
And so, Standing at the entrance to the camp, Moses makes a charge, "whoever is on YHWH's side come and stand with me"
Only the sons of Levi came and stood with Moses. Moses instructed the sons of Levi to use their swords and go through the camp and slay their brethren, companions, neighbors. These were people the Levites knew and loved, these were "family". That day, the Levites slew 3 thousand men. That is a very small number considering that the group numbered in the millions. But, in obedience to Moses, and, I believe, guided by YHWH, the Levites killed those YHWH had pre-ordained to be killed that day. I wonder if these men were the ones who led the way for the demands for a "god they could see" to worship
YHWH says He will consume them with His wrath. I wonder if God said this because His will was to do this and then Moses persuaded Him to relent, or if He told Moses this so that Moses would know that these people deserved nothing but wrath to emphasize the seriousness of sin. I tend to think it is the latter because I do not think God can be talked out of what He intends to do. The Word says He will accomplish whatever He wills to do and no one can stay Him.
But Moses intercedes for his people-just as Jesus intercedes to the Father for all of us, for we are no different than these Israelites, completely unable to keep His law perfectly, quickly falling into error in our beliefs, trying to substitute something more acceptable or less disturbing to our sensibilities for God's way.
YHWH would have been perfectly just to consume the Israelites with his fiery wrath, but at Moses' pleading, He shows mercy. He does the same for us, not bringing upon us the destruction and torment we deserve, but instead, He continues to be gracious and forgiving to us despite our sinfulness.
Moses then proceeds down the mountain, knowing that YHWH will not destroy the whole nation for this sin. He carried with Him the two tablets of the Decalogue made of stone that YHWH inscribed by Himself, not chiseled by Moses. These tablets of the Law were sacred and good, untainted by human hands and thoughts.
At some point Moses meets up with Joshua on the Mount, most likely where Moses had left him to wait. Interesting to think that Moses was on the Mount 40 days and nights, and so was Joshua, waiting for Moses to come back down. Joshua did not give up hope of Moses coming down again. He had faith in YHWH and was obedient. Joshua tells Moses, "There is noise of war in the camp." The Israelites must have really been raising a clamor. But Moses correct Joshua, saying that the noise is not of victory, defeat, but singing.
And so Moses and Joshua came near the camp...