Bible Discussion PAGE 45

  • Alex - in Reply on John 20:28
    Alex comments on the Trinity,God wd not tell Moses his name was Abraham Issac and Jacob,which was father son and Granson if his Kingdom were not a trinity a family just like the Abrahamic trinity was a family that resulted in the nation of ISRAEL. Without this heavenly trinity there can NOT be an Israel of GOD, ITS SIMPLY FATHER SON AND GRANSON THAT IS GONNA BECOME THE ISRAEL OF GOD,thats y God told Moses that his name was Abraham Issac n Jacob,that is my name forever and my memorial to ALL GENERATIONS. the Abrahamic trinity was an exact profile of the heavenly trinity as God offered up his only son just as Abraham offered up his only son Issac. a 5 yr old can understand this father son and granson scenario, without it there can not be an Israel of God, Its GOD Almighty that wants a posterity and Christ was just his 1st born of many brethren,Thats y God swore by his VERY SELF when he made that Promise of multiplication MEANING THERE HAS TO BE AN ISRAEL OF GOD, God is gona be multiplied, thats y Jesus will go forth and sow his precious seed in humanity.The very fact that we have a FATHER AND A SON BEGS THE QUESTION OF A GRANSON and an Israel of God . The heavenly trinity is an exact profile of Abraham Issac and Jacob thats what Abraham means exaulted Father. The child of promise was issac but the Promise Child in the heavenly is the H.G. as Jesus refers to the H.G as the Promise of the Father And thats y the sower will go forth to sow his Precious seed in humanity that God might be multiplied in us sinners resulting in an Israel of God. The Abrahamic trinity was just the basics .As Abraham was multiplied as the sands of the seas, which is just prophetic that Christ is gonna be mulltipled as the STARS OF HEAVEN in mankind thats y he calls himself the son of man i.e. God is gonna be multiplied in humanity via the seed of CHRIST.Thats y Jesus said to whom the WORD HIS SEED came it made them GODS, Jesus cd not sow the GOOD seed TH SEED OF GOD if he were not God th SON.
  • Mishael - in Reply on Zechariah 4:6
    Why do you think it's your job to pose questions that only cause striving?

    You're not as transparent as you imagine.

    I'm not accusing; just observing. :D
  • FATHER SON HOLY SPIRIT on John 10
    2 Timothy 2:22-26

    Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

    23

    But foolish and unlearned questions AVOID, knowing that they do gender (cause) STRIFES.

    24

    And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,

    25

    In meekness instructing those that OPPOSE themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;

    26

    And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the DEVIL, who are taken captive by him at his will.

    2 Timothy 3:5

    Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

    2 Timothy 4:3-4

    For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

    4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

    I STRONGLY SUGGEST WE DO NOT ARGUE ABOUT THE GODHEAD

    Genesis 1:1, 1:26, 3:22, 11:7

    Isaiah 6:8

    Romans 1:20

    Colossians 2:9

    Acts 17:27-30

    1
    John 5:7

    John 10:30

    There is only 10 scriptures Proving it.

    Mishael
  • Rob - in Reply on Revelation 12
    Think as rational as you can , The God head not God heads !

    How many heads do you have ?

    1 I hope or you would belong in a side show somewhere !

    How many heads to millions of creatures have ? Usually one ? Yes one .

    Now here is something that you really need to consider , God said let us make man in our image . Got it ? So how many heads does man have and that includes you ! Let's put this nonsense away it makes a mockery of God .
  • Rob - in Reply on Revelation 12
    The Godhead is God alone , The father .

    God was and is In Christ .

    Because Jesus is born of God and therefore the Son of God . As the Scriptures so many times and God himself call Jesus the Son of God .

    God is head over Christ , Christ is head over the church , the husband is head over the wife and children .

    God is head over All .

    But to imply that the Godhead is a trinity is no where found in the Bible . As God the unchangeable one said I Am God and there is none beside me .
  • Chris - in Reply on John 1
    Page 2.

    The Holy Spirit resides in all who have come to faith in Jesus Christ (John 14:17) & also convicts men of sin, of righteousness & (coming) judgement. (John 16:7-11). So the Spirit is still working in the World until the appointed time when He is taken away (some argue as to when that time will be). The Son has now returned to the Father (back into the God folder), but He is distinct in that He is now God in the flesh, not as only the Word, but as the Son who has performed all that was required of Him on Earth & now at the Father's right Hand in Heaven (Hebrews 7:25). In the human mind this is a difficult concept to grasp & that is why you are having difficulties. If you want to understand God in a human perspective, it won't work because we don't have anything on this Earth that can adequately compare to Him & our minds don't work in any other way. But do we say then that because we don't believe that such a Trinity can exist, therefore it's impossible for God to be such? I think then, that it's us who have the problem in understanding the Character of God & not the Doctrine.

    Yes, illustrating the Trinity to man's trinitarian composition, is 'problematic': no illustration can adequately do the job, but I felt compelled to use it to try & help you understand, but that didn't work. And lastly, God is Spirit (John 4:24), the Word was part of that Spirit, & the Holy Spirit was sent out into the World. So we only knew & heard God as Spirit in the OT. After Jesus ascended into Heaven, we see the (visible) God in Jesus, but we also know that God is still there (Revelation 8:2 & about 3,000 other verses to prove it). God hasn't disappeared & Jesus has not taken His place. So please look into this & see where your theology has become skewed or maybe you are under some false teaching. May the Lord give you light on this very important matter.
  • Chris - in Reply on John 1
    Page 1.

    That's an interesting depiction of the Trinity you gave, Hugo. One problem though: you have shown to the non-Christian person three separate pictures which of course represent three different gods. That's not what it should be. If I had to use a similar illustration, I would say, show a folder (as one used for documents) & say that this represents God. Then take another folder & place it in the 'God folder' & call it "Jesus". Finally, take a third folder & place it in the 'God folder' & call it "Holy Spirit". So what do we have now? We still have three folders, but two of them are within God. But your non-Christian says, "I only see the God folder, where is Jesus & the Holy Spirit?" You can tell him where they are: they are within God or a part of God.

    If he objects to this & says that once they are separated, they becomes three gods, then the answer to that is, that they are all in the one Godhead, but when they separate, they, as part of that Godhead, go out to perform what God intends. So we have the God folder, the Word folder & the Holy Spirit folder all in one God. God sends out His Word (as I wrote earlier), but instead of just words for a prophet to proclaim, e.g. like John the Baptist did, God made His Word a Man to not only be The Prophet, but also to be the sacrificial Lamb & Saviour, the eternal Priest & coming King. And because of this human birth made from Divine Seed (the Word), it is said that "He shall be called the Son of God" (Luke 1:35).
  • Richard in Christ - in Reply on John 2
    Hello my brother Hugo,

    I do not call myself a "Trinitarian" as that seems to be a label. I do believe in God the Father, the Son(Jesus Christ), and the Holy Ghost. As these three are One. I also do not say "Jesus is God" which to me seems to be over simplified. I actually would agree with exactly how you said as "God dwelled in Him". Or God was "in" Him and He in the Father just as Jesus states. Jesus Christ being the Messiah sent by our Father in Heaven. He is the most unique, special, marvelous person to have ever walked this earth. Our Lord and Savior. None of us know everything about Him. One day we will be with Him, and our Father, in the Kingdom and we will be able to ask Him any question we ever will have. He will have the answer for us. God Bless you brother.
  • Nathan Unger - in Reply on Revelation 12
    Rob, what of Colossians 2:9 then?
  • Rob - in Reply on Revelation 12
    I'm sure the Pharisee s felt the same as Jesus spoke to them and even drove them out of the temple .

    I hate the false doctrines, not the people that are under the influence of them .

    You would not have liked King David he was a warrior! And How about John the Baptist !

    He lambasted the self righteous!

    So yes I'd like to be meek as possible, yet faithful!
  • Rob - in Reply on Zechariah 4:6
    This was the question Christians at the time of this new doctrine of the rapture of the church , back in the 1800s asked . I think it's a tough one since all saints are removed to heaven , yet the true solders must fight the Antichrist? Seems kind contradicting to me , how about you ?

    So if all the saints are removed , then some how people get saved and are able to do battle with the Antichrist? Seems kinda far fetched to me !
  • Rob on Zechariah 4:6
    If the church is raptured out before the tribulation, who are these saints that are no babes , that the Antichrist makes war with ?
  • SIGNS OF THE END on Genesis 2
    I've heard some really shocking rapture predictions tho past week, or so. Dreams, visions.

    Rapture mentions in scripture: OT and NT are all through the Bible. God inspired it.

    You have to read it and pray daily, pray long, listen with all your strength. Fast. Ask the Holy Spirit to reveal the mystery.

    We can't just say stuff like "hit me with some truth, Holy Spirit". Try to observe some reverence and worship.

    Lastly, use some common sense. A deep relationship with the Holy Spirit is vital. It is needful to hear for yourself instead of running to and fro asking for other people's (humankind) point of view. It must be backed by scrip

    We are waiting for the times of the Gentiles to be fulfilled. We are the Elect until that is completed. THEN the election will pass back to the Jews. I'm not going to debate this. Too many baseless debates go on in here.

    Jesus is not going to suffer (allow) His Bride to go through the Tribulation.

    People are preaching that she will go through the entire Tribulation; she will go through an asteroid strike that will make all water on earth poisonous. No. The Brides, Bridegroom is going to fetch her off the earth! She will meet her Bridegroom in the clouds.

    Notice in Revelation the His feet do not touch the ground. The next time His feet touch the ground, will be at the Mount of Olives.

    You ask the Holy Spirit about the election!

    Why has the Church been waiting to see the Return of the exiled Jews to begin to return to their homeland? Prophesy is falling into place. People who study prophesy, know these things. The recently signed Abrahamic Accord signed between Israel and some Arab nations; that lasts for 7 years___is HUGE!! ALL dreams and visions will agree with scripture. If God didn't say it in scripture: it may be a pizza dream.

    The Bride will not be here to be confronted by Antichrist. Hint: Go circle that Abraham Accord date on your calendar.

    Keep tuned into Jesus. He is the TRUTH.

    Mishael
  • Rob on John 20:28
    Thomas the one that was faithless when he sees Jesus says My Lord and My God !

    Ok so now Thomas the unbeliever is an expert all of a sudden and the Godhead has a verse proving it s self as Doctrine.

    Oh but wait a minute read the rest of the chapter.

    It's because Thomas has seen the Lord risen he now believes that Jesus is risen . Not that Jesus is God . But yes it's Gods power no doubt about it .

    Read verse 31 : death to the God head doctrine, again .

    It's always good to keep things in context .

    But these are written , that ye might believe that Jesus is the CHRIST, THE SON OF GOD; and that believing ye might have life through his name .

    Case closed again !

    No GOD the Son even though Thomas acknowledged that God is in Jesus , that's true , but not the same as GOD THE SON that's heresy .
  • Hugo Zyl on John 2
    Christian love to all the brothers and sisters in Christ

    This chapter raises another question which Trinitarians cannot answer.

    In God's temple you had the holy place which only the priests could enter, and the holiest of holies which only the high priest could enter once a year. But that temple was not considered to be God. Rather God had His presence IN the holiest of holies. Not the skins or the curtains or the stones or the ark but simply indwelling that space. But now Trinitarians say that Jesus the physical man IS God.

    Question: why was the temple not seen as God if we are to believe that Jesus the physical man is to be seen as God? Why is the foreshadowing wrong? Why is God misleading us as to how He has His presence?

    Correct answer: the physical Jesus was not God. God dwelled in him. Just as the physical temple was not God. God dwelled in it. Thus the foreshadowing is correct. Thus God has lead us correctly to understanding how He has His presence.

    And for that we thank our Father and bless His holy name. Hallelujah!

    Please consider these things carefully my Trinitarian siblings, is my humble request.

    Peace and love in Christ
  • Rob - in Reply on Revelation 16:16
    The book of Zechariah in the Old Testament is prophecy of the time when The lord restores Jerusalem and Judah and punnishes evil doers .

    Chapter 9 to the end of the book .
  • Hugo Zyl on Psalms 90
    God bless the dear brothers and sisters in Christ

    This psalm of Moses is so often used to say that a person cannot live more than 80 years. This is an error. Moses was simply singing about the people living in a DESERT, i.e. not in comfortable homes. Nor was he prophecying. God has told us clearly that our lifespans can reach 120 years (Genesis 6).

    To try to say that Christ must return before 2028 because that is 80 years after 1948, is an error. Let us not clutch at straws but lovingly call on Jesus Christ whether we are in this body or in another kind of body.

    Peace and love in Christ
  • 6 verses 16 , 17

    So being one is nothing unusual in the scriptures. Take a peek .
  • Hugo Zyl - in Reply on Revelation 12
    Dear brother Rob. God bless you

    I am also not a Trinitarian, but that is not a badge of honor. It is grace. The fruit of the Spirit includes meekness, longsuffering and peace.

    To go around brow-beating people because you think you know more or have received more grace is not conforming to the image of Jesus Christ.

    Peace and love in Christ
  • Rob - in Reply on Revelation 16:16
    Yes at the second coming , but many will not survive , only a remnant will be restored at that time . Until then Israel is in disobedience. Although individual Jews can be saved .
  • Hugo Zyl - in Reply on John 10:36
    God bless you brother Mike

    This site's Bibles are exactly what they say they are as far as I understand.

    But of course there is no perfect translation if that is what you are after. The truth-teacher is the Holy Spirit. Get the Holy Spirit, everything else is secondary.

    Love in Christ
  • Do you know the saints shall judge the world says Apostle Paul !

    Read Psalms 149

    Even Jesus said he would cause the false brethren to bow at our feet .

    Onward Christian soldiers !
  • Hugo Zyl - in Reply on John 1
    Grace & Peace in Christ dear brother Chris

    I feel this topic is now leaving the realm of the Bible, and entering into unusual uses of words.

    Just go to a person who knows nothing about Christianity and show him 3 pictures - one, a painting of Jesus; two, a blank picture which represents the Father; three, a picture of a dove which is a symbol of the Holy Spirit. Tell the man that you believe each picture shows God. Ask the man how many gods there then are. He will say three. Tell the man that although it looks like three, you belief that it is actually just one. The man will say you belief a strange thing. Then tell the man that this one God in three pieces can have conversations between these pieces and get new views and ideas from each piece, while still remaining just one God. - The poor man will probably think this is the weirdest thing he has ever heard in his life.

    Look three divine worshipped persons make three gods, or language has lost its meaning entirely.

    With all due respect, your example of comparing the Godhead to man's body, mind and soul is also problematic. There are enormous differences between the parts, and they do not sit around a table to have a chat.

    What you wrote about God's plan of salvation, I agree with completely, but to then draw a conclusion of: so now the Three are all there like ducks in a row; this is wrong. The only Person (visible) is Jesus Christ. There is never in the Bible any other visible human form of God than Him. The Spirit coming upon a person is symbolized as a tongue of flame or a dove...

    Dear brother. Consider if we may not perhaps be doing as the Samaritan woman was doing when Jesus Christ told her "You worship you know not what... God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth."

    Peace & love in Jesus Christ
  • Rob on Revelation 12
    When people talk about a trinity or Godhead , that's all I need to know they know not the Bible as they should .

    Trying to convince them is like telling a blind man that never saw before what a rainbow looks like .

    But their is hope if The lord opens their eyes, he did mine .
  • Rob - in Reply on 1 John 4
    I don't have I'll will toward any person , you seem to have Good heart , All the best to those that seek God in sincerity and truth .

    I must say the Bible has been maligned terribly since even the apostles time .

    But the word of God is still true and Jesus is at the fathers right hand interceding !

    If God be for us who can be against us ! I'm very happy in the Lord !
  • T - in Reply on John 10:36
    The KJV or King James Bible is The most accurately translated Bible. The NIV and others have changed many words to be "easier understood." They use more common and modern language. One must also understand that, in translation, different languages may not share the same words. Therefore, the most accurate and appropriate words were used during translation.

    I urge you to do some research on Google about how the KJV and 1611 came to translation so you will have a better understanding! I did the same and without any doubt prefer the King James over any other.

    Hope that helps to answer your question.
  • Linda leffel on Isaiah 1
    Where does it say in the Bible about where satay comes back imitating Jesus and sits on my Zion. Claiming to be him?
  • Richard in Christ - in Reply on 1 John 4
    God Bless you Rob. I am also what God made me. As we all are. I also know that the Lord is the one and only true Judge. Of everything. As the Father committed all judgement unto the Son. Whether you believe that or not is up to you. Why are you judging, condemning, me saying "I can tell you have very little knowledge of the Bible in truth"? Again you are exalting yourself. That you know the "truth" and I don't? Do you think our Father loves you more than me? It saddens me to see this. Do you know of the several teachings of Christ to not exalt yourself? To humble yourself?

    I am also going to state this. As others may look down upon me also. But it is the truth. I do not fear my Father in Heaven. I love Him with everything that I am. All I want to do is what He wants me to do. His Will. What makes Him happy. If He wants to destroy me I know He is all powerful and can do anything He wants. And if that's what He want's then I do too. It's about Him not me.

    I do not want any to perish. Even the most wicked person. But that all shall come to repentance. This is the Will of the Lord. I pray for everyone. Because the Lord has lead me to do so. I am His. Take care Rob.
  • Chris - in Reply on John 1
    Page 2.

    This same Jesus, fully man & fully Divine, was crucified, buried, resurrected & ascended to the Father's right Hand. Where once, the Word proceeded out from God, the Word now in flesh, raised in a heavenly Body, sits as the Divine Man at God's right Hand. So Jesus, as we too will be in Heaven, can communicate with each other - I see no problem with this (Hebrews 7:25).

    And in regards to polytheism, by definition, is the multiplicity of gods. The Triune God is definitely not a polytheistic god - that would be sacrilege indeed. We don't have three gods in Heaven - there is only One God expressed in three Persons; I think you are understanding the Trinity teaching from a polytheistic perspective - God cannot be understood like that. If you see Jesus or the Holy Spirit as a lesser Entity, then you have not understood the Doctrine of God - all three in the Godhead are equally God & are the One God: co-equal & co-eternal.

    I gave you the example of your personal trinitarian existence, Hugo: you're composed of spirit, soul & body. Do you accept that? Without even one of those 'parts' you wouldn't be Hugo - maybe you could be some type of sub-human or just floating about in spirit form. Or with the Sun in the Universe: a body of hot gases, giving heat & giving light (3 parts of the one). It wouldn't be a sun as we know, if any entity of it was absent. These are of course poor examples to try & explain the Triune God, but I'm trying to show you that a Trinity does not necessarily mean three that are separate from each other, but can also mean three in one, as with God. But in Heaven now, Jesus is seen as separate because of his taking on of flesh & rising in a heavenly Body. We will be like him in Heaven (1 John 3:2). So please rid your mind that Christians entertain a polytheistic belief of God - that is a wicked belief, as you clearly wrote. Blessings.


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