Bible Questions & Discussion PAGE 16

  • Bennymkje - 3 weeks ago
    Ro.9:7-8 "Children of promise" (2 of 2)

    But God created man in his own image, so seed of Abraham, Isaac and Ishamel alike come under the covenant. But for Ishmael it is covenant after the flesh while God is specific "In Isaac shall thy seed be called" The children of the flesh are not called the children of God. Isaac showed faith when he obeyed God and it came from his response to the word, which is to be spiritually understood. Everything needful for our life and godliness has been taken care by God in his Son. Only what determined between Ishmael and Isaac was faith. For this reason God loved Jacob and hated Esau. As with Isaac Jacob had faith and it explains what it is to be created 'after his likeness'. Isaac was the heir of promise. So was Jacob even before they had come of age. in so many ways in their choices they were connecting the dots all the way to the Son who as the word become flesh would manifest.

    Esau despising his birthright was his choice. He had a reason, right? "And Esau said, Behold, I am at the point to die: and what profit shall this birthright do to me?/And Jacob said, Swear to me this day; and he sware unto him: and he sold his birthright unto Jacob."(Ge.25:32-33). Esau like one addicted to recreational drugs was almost every day dying for one reason or other. His self indulgence was all that mattered to him. The word of God 'Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry" would have come a shocker!(Col.3:5). In our society of instant gratification, think how many churches would demand that their congregation offer their bodies as living service? Their nationalism is their way of paying the bills for the upkeep of megachurches.

    God is not fooled brethren. There is no substitute for faith which by way of works demand fruits worthy of His holiness.
  • Bennymkje - 3 weeks ago
    Ro.9:7-8 "Children of Promise" (1 of 2)

    "Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called./That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed."

    In the series on the topic of the covenant, Salvation of man solely depends on the word of God, holiness of which is what the name of God signifies. "Iamthe LORD: thatismy name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images."(Is.42:8). Of this his glory is synonymous with his visible image, the Son..In Ph.2:9-11.

    The word of God is like a seed that the Parable of Sower has sown in the heart of man. What is the heart but a spiritual space. "He fashioneth their hearts alike; he considereth all their works."(Ps.33:15) God formed all hearts alike and the word sent forth before the worlds began (Is.55:11) consequently falls on a level playing field. How is it then there is a vast difference in the yield from each? Free will of man must explain this anomaly.. In a good ground itself there is difference. "But other fell into good ground, and brought forth fruit, some an hundredfold, some sixtyfold, some thirtyfold."(Matt.13:8) Prophet Jeremiah would explain it thus, "The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?(Je.17:9) A life unexamined is not worth living since he is like a tumbleweed collecting prejudices, and in our times his world view from internet,- and much worse from dark web, and is he worth more than at the end of it all being consigned to fire?

    But God created man in his own image, so seed of Abraham, Isaac and Ishamel alike come under the covenant. But for Ishmael it is covenant after the flesh while God is specific "In Isaac shall thy seed be called" The children of the flesh are not called the children of God. Isaac showed faith when he obeyed God,
  • Shantel - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    Cheryl1655

    The whole word of God is a PROPHECY of the kingdom of God, including the book of Genesis.

    Adam is Christ, EVE HIS WIFE is mankind, God put Adam in a deep sleep (death on a cross), our Father, by his Spirit, cause Adam (Christ) to arise, and we (EVE) came out of Christ, as ONE FLESH.

    Genesis 5:2 Male and female CREATED (by the resurrection of Christ) he them, and called THEIR NAME Adam (Christ), in the day they were CREATED.

    1 Timothy 2:13-15 For Adam was first formed, then Eve.

    14 And Adam was NOT DECEIVE, but the woman being DECEIVE, was in the transgression.

    15 Notwithstanding SHE (Eve, Christ's wife) shall BE SAVED in child bearing.....

    Revelation 3:12 ...and I will write upon him my NEW NAME ......

    Revelation 12:2 And SHE being with child, travailing in BIRTH, and pained to be DELIVERED.

    John 3:7 ..... YE MUST BE BORN AGAIN ......

    Acts 19:5 When they heard this they were BAPTISED IN THE NAME OF JESUS.

    God Bless You

    God Bless You
  • Shantel - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    BJGibson

    Man was created, by the resurrection of Christ, a new creation.

    Man, by the resurrection of Christ, was created the GLORY of God.

    Isaiah 4:5 And the Lord will CREATE upon every dwelling place on mount Zion (Christ IN YOU), and upon her assemblies, a cloud and a smoke by day, and the shining of a flaming fire by night: for upon ALL THE GLORY shall be a defence.

    Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, I CREATE darkness:I make peace, and create evil, I the Lord DO ALL THESE THINGS.

    Psalms 104:30 Thou sendest forth thy Spirit, and they are CREATED, thou renewest the face of the earth.

    Christ, the GLORY OF GOD, was resurrected by the Spirit of his Father, and we were joint heirs of his resurrection also becoming the glory of OUR FATHER.

    God Bless You
  • Oseas - 3 weeks ago
    John 1:11-13

    11 He came unto His own, and His own received Him not.

    12 But as many as received Him (Jewish and Gentiles), to them gave He power to become the sons of GOD, even to them that believe on His NAME:->JESUS-> Acts 4:11-12;JESUS/JOSHUA IS GOD, NOT the esoteric and kabbalistic and spiritist Jehovah, YHWH, Yahweh, HaShem, Adonai, Yehovah, Elohim, Yahusha,YEHshia, YEHvah.

    JESUS /JOSHUA IS GOD.

    13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of GOD.

    Thus, be Jews or Gentiles,they will be saved if believe in the NAME of JESUS, i.e. as believers in JESUS and obey His Gospel of GOD's Kingdom, that will be established from now on- Revelation 11:15-18.

    1Corinthians 1:21-24 and 30-31

    21 For after that in the wisdom of GOD the world by wisdom KNEW NOT GOD, it pleased GOD by the foolishness of PREACHING to save them that believe. (and wish to meet Him)

    22 For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:

    23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;

    24 But unto them which are CALLED, both Jews and Greeks(Gentiles), Christ the power of GOD, and the wisdom of GOD. ( Ephesians 1:3-8. take a look)

    30 But of Him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of GOD is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

    31 That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.-->Lord JESUS-> the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, which is, and which was, AND WHICH IS TO COME, the ALMIGHTY.

    GOD BLESS

    Get ready
  • Oseas - 3 weeks ago
    John 5:15-17

    15 The man departed, and told the Jews that it was JESUS, which had made him whole.

    16 And therefore did the Jews persecute JESUS, and sought to slay Him, because He had done these things on the sabbath day.

    17 But JESUS answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I WORK. John 10:30- I and my Father are One.

    It was the fourth Day or around 4000 years after Adam.--> Genesis 1:16- GOD made two great lights; the Greater Light to rule the day( 1Thessalonians 5:4-6), and the Lesser Light to rule the night: He made the stars also. JESUS said: John 12:46 -->I am come a Light into the world (like the Sun), that whosoever believeth on me should not abide in darkness.

    And the Lesser light: Who is him? The lesser Light receives light from the Greater Light because he has no light of his own (like the moon). So, who is him?

    And the stars, who are them? By the way, the red Dragon with his TAIL drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth. Who are them?

    Furthermore, the woman is clothed with the Sun, and the Moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars-Re.12:1

    I like so much to decipher biblical enigmas/puzzles.

    Matthew 5: 5 and 14 -

    5- Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.

    14- Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.

    Very profound. GOD BLESS
  • Richard H Priday - 3 weeks ago
    Luke 4:42 And when it was day, he departed and went into a desert place: and the people sought him, and came unto him, and stayed him, that he should not depart from them.

    Luke 5:16 And he withdrew himself into the wilderness, and prayed. (NKJV and other versions said often He would do this)

    Luke 6:12-13 One of those days Jesus went out to a mountainside to pray, and spent the night praying to God. 13 When morning came, he called his disciples to him and chose twelve of them, whom he also designated apostles:

    Matthew 14:23 And when he had sent the multitudes away, he went up into a mountain apart to pray: and when the evening was come, he was there alone.

    With this and of course His agonizing prayer at Gethsemane where no doubt He was familiar with and spent other times in prayer there on His travels we see at various important and crisis points the Lord knew when to be even more focused; in some cases praying ALL NIGHT. This was after an exhausting day running around doing God's work; and often preceded more things the next day. More often than not crowds would come (such as when He discovered that John the Baptist had been martyred) and neither He nor the other Disciples could continue with the respite the Lord Himself initiated in their behalf.

    Try to tell this to the average Christian in our country today. We note in these scriptures there was NEVER a time when any of the Disciples were said to be doing this; although the Lord rebuked them for not being able to cast out a demon without prayer and fasting. I am not aware of ANY verses talking about them in prayer; so it surely is lacking; you would think SOMEONE would ask the Lord if they could spend some time praying but as their naivete about His death supposing He was going to then rule as an earthly king no doubt prevented many of their efforts. Thankfully Pentecost changed things in that regard!

    Hopefully this worm can learn something about prayer and my heart won't always be so cold.

    Agape.
  • Richard H Priday on Matthew 17 - 3 weeks ago
    In this chapter we see Jesus once again referring to His upcoming death burial and resurrection and the extreme sadness it caused the Disciples. We could see 3 reasons for this sudden interruption in the narrative and story for Jesus to say this:

    1) The distraction of the events thus far of what was already most of Jesus' earthly ministry would make the Disciples complacent in thinking this would go on for many more years.

    2) The main goal and focus was on His sacrifice for the sins of man to be accomplished on Calvary. Only at that point could men be able to enter heaven immediately upon death; whereas before they would have to be in Sheol (in the pleasant side).

    3). In His departure; they would be the ones to continue to carry out the ministry through leadership after the Spirit came down at Pentecost and changed them. They would have to be stripped of all their confidence and all die a martyrs death exept for John. None of them would be ready when Jesus was arrested as they all ran away along with Peter. Only the Lord would get them through that.

    In all honesty it is hard here just as it is contemplating what He said in Gethsemane as to the weakness of their flesh and their falling asleep due again to sorrow. God assures us that every tear is known ( Psalm 56:8). No doubt in eternity there will be reward for suffering in faith; we have consolation in what the world can't have. We have to believe that even in our own martryrdom if it comes to that or natural death is to glorify Christ and there are rewards for martyrs ( James 1:12). Paul also was given a reaction of great sorrow when he announced his imprisonment ( Acts 21:10-14). It would appear his death came at a much later date but Paul always focused on ministry and looked forward to being with the Lord; no wonder after the brutality he had to endure on and off for years in various imprisonments beforehand. He knew when his departure was near ( 2 Tim. 4) and Peter as well ( 2 Peter 1:12
  • Chris - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    Hello Cheryl1655. The best way to understand these two chapters in Genesis, is that chapter 1 is a declaration of God's Work in creation on each of the six days. When we get to chapter 2, we read of the seventh day, when God's Work had finished on the sixth, and that God rested (or, ceased from all His Work - not that He was exhausted). Then Genesis 2:4 gives us the answer to your question: "These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created...". So from this point, we are told what God had done in a general way, and now more specifically - with greater detail about His Creation - the focus on man.

    So, as God created plants, He then sent out a mist initially to water them ( Genesis 2:6). He then shows us how He created man first & then woman, those mentioned in Genesis 1:26,27; His detail of them also seen in Genesis 2:7-22 - and that man (Adam) would tend to those plants ( Genesis 2:15) until the woman (Eve) came from his body, to be his companion & help in life. So these accounts in these first two chapters of Genesis, don't show us two separate creations of human beings, but the one creation, where more detail is given of God's creative Work in creating the first two people on Earth.
  • Richard H Priday - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    Some say this is two different versions of creation. I would think that it implies when man was created there was something of man and woman in the soul of Adam. Thus the rib was taken out of Adam but also to have a companion it would be something close to his heart I would expect. That would also explain how spiritually man and woman were of the image of God but physically Eve was taken out of man rather than being created from the dust of the earth. Thus all are in Christ; male; female; Jew and Gentile ( Colossians 3:11). This type of unity is in the Holy Spirit of Christ.

    This would also explain why God instituted marriage; if it was merely a physical thing ( 1 Cor. 6:16-18) it wouldn't matter if one was married or not; but it also involves two souls that are only legitimately married when God joins them together. This is a deep matter but I consider it important also because it explains why same sex relations also is more than just a physical thing. When two individuals have a selfish ambition than the enemy is able to do great damage to their souls. God designed the body and soul of man and woman to function as a whole; as a unit which of course doesn't work with two men or two women.

    Some theologians disagree with my viewpoint; so if it is confusing I won't press the issue. There are admittedly some other parts of Genesis that seem to repeat the same narrative describing perhaps focusing on different aspects. Won't get into that now.
  • Rainwalker - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    Eze 33:14,19
  • Shantel - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    David0921

    The winds of the teachings of man blow hard against the truth of God's word.

    Don't falter in proclaiming truth.

    Man has no freewill, only God's will prevails in his creation.

    Amos 3:7 Surely the Lord God will do nothing without revealing his secrets to his servants the prophets.

    Philippians 2:13 For it is God that worketh IN YOU both TO WILL and TO DO HIS good pleasure.

    We DIED on the cross with Christ, ONLY Christ arose and we as JOINT HEIRS.

    Isaiah 59:21 And this is my covenant with THEM, saith the Lord; My Spirit that is upon THEE (Christ), and my words that I (the Father) put in thy (Christ's) mouth, shall not depart out of thy mouth, nor out of the mouth of thy seed, nor out of the mouth of thy seed's seed, saith the Lord, from hence forth and for ever.

    Amos 2:7 Can two (as one flesh) walk together, except they BE AGREED?

    God Bless You
  • Cheryl1655 - 3 weeks ago
    Genesis 1 27, made man and women at the same time , Genesis 2 21 Adam's rib to make women explain so who was the first women made ?
  • Bennymkje - 3 weeks ago
    Ge.26 "The Covenant"

    The everlasting covenant is not merely provisions made under seven days but it is Person specific. God "Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen."(1 Ti.6:16). Jesus Christ is the visible image of the invisible God. Abraham's blessing came through Jesus Christ- after his likeness'. The same blessing is now passed on to Isaac, who is the heir of promise. The covenant based on After the Man is the only legal covenant since it is validated by God and the Word. ( John 1:1)

    Speaking of the seed in itself, Isaac obeyed God by remaining in Gerar. So the word sent forth by God bore fruit in Isaac. He is after the likeness of Jesus Christ and he stands as a double for him because of the word. if the word worked with Isaac, it similarly must work with every other is it not? Faith is what worked with Isaac who became the heir. " He that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?/Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works."( John 14:9-10)

    On day three the provision of the tree bearing fruit referred to believers who stands as double for Jesus Christ. Jesus said, I am the Way" So what is faith with works. Those who follow the way and learn of him, Being branches abiding in him they bear fruits.

    Similarly the covenant refers to God dividing the waters above and below the firmament on day two.(Ge.1:6-8)

    However much the king of Gerar grudge Isaac regarding the wells his servants had dug, he could not prevail over him. God made the waters available from His store. (26:32-33). The name Beersheba is associated with "Unto this day". The Spirit always has used this phrase in association with Jesus Christ . The covenant worked with Isaac because he was the heir of promise
  • Giannis - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    Hi again BJGibson, 2/2

    This is why I cannot accept a predestined choice of God, which means whom He wants to save He saves and whom He doesn't want to save He doesn't save. This sort of action doesn't fit to the idea I have of a God who is a righteous God full of love and mercy for all His creation. I can not also accept a regeneration before faith. We have been having this discussion with brother David and sister GiGi lately. Because again if God does that then He chooses whom He loves and who is going to love Him. But you can't do that. People have personalities, have egos, have free wills which means they follow what they love, and if this is the sinful world, like Lot's wife, God simply doesn't intervene. God tries to make us love Him but without forcing us in any way. When he foreknows that we will believe then He helps us in all possible ways, but again without intervening in our free will. Like a father who talks and talks and talks to his child hoping to make him choose to do the right thing in his life.

    About God's external appearance. To me it is really dificult to accept that in Heaven I will have to live with a God who is in a form of a shadow or a cloud or something vague and fluid. When He says that we will see His face I believe that He means it.

    Does God has a personal name? People have names so to be distinguised from other people. But God? His names in both OT and NT are descriptive of one of His characteristics, ie Lord of Powers (allmighty), Eternal, Self Existing (Yahweh), Father (in NT). That was also the case with people in ancient times. If you pay attention the names given to new borns were after a characteristic they had, Adam(made of dust), Eve(life), Isaac(lough), John(God's gift), Jesus(Savior) etc. Nowadays this is not the case any more but in those ancient times that was the case. I believe this is the reason that ahe aswered Moses about His name. I believe He meant that " I am who I am, the God, I don't have a name". Just an opinion
  • Giannis - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    Hi BJGibson, 1/2

    Well it sounds strange that God may had felt lonely in the past, but let us think that mankind has been in existence only for the last 6500 years which is not even a droplet in the ocean of God's infinite existence. Surely there were angels around before mankind, but we don't really know for how long. We don't know what was there before the angels were created. Maybe nothing but God. But maybe something.

    As you said God who is Love wanted to share His love with other persons, so He created angels and humans. And here is where, I believe, free will comes in. God didn't want robots or programmed computers to live with but individuals with personalities. But once one has a personality of his own, he has a free will as well. And if he has free will, nobody can control him, he does what he wants to do. So both angels and humans can choose whom they wish to love and follow. God can not force them. So some angels rebelled against God, because they simply wanted to do so, not because somebody(God) somehow controlled them and made them sin. Same with humans.

    By why did God wanted personalities who only themselves decide what they want to do? Just think, who would like to get married to a woman who was compelled to mary him and had no other option. Nobody, we all like to be with people who love us. Similarly God wanted to share His life with people (and angels) who love Him. So He gives options to people And He tries us in this life and our choice here will follow us in the afterlife, as He also gave options and tried the angels too. It would be very easy for God to appear to mankind, but in such a case everybody would kneel infront of Him, they liked it or not. So what does He do? He keeps Himself in the shadow and tries people. The ones who will eventually respond to His love and love him will become His "wife'(figuratively), His children. This is why I cannot accept a predestined choice of God, which means whom He wants to save He saves and whom not.
  • David0921 - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    Thank you GiGi for those thoughts.

    May God in His sovereign mercy lead us into truth as we search the scriptures. Praying constantly that God might open our understanding as we compare scripture with scripture applying the principles that God Himself lays down in His Word.
  • David0921 - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    Momsage,

    "Freewill" relative to salvation is not taught in the Bible. God does all the work in accordance with His Will, not our will.

    Romans 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

    Ephesians 1

    3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ: 4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: 5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, 6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. 7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

    Ephesians 2

    1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins; 2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: 3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. 4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, 5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;) 6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

    7 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus. 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
  • Ronald Whittemore - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    Hi Giannis,

    I agree God's angels work in our protection but there are angels on the side of Satan as we see in Daniel 10, battles go on that we do not see and this will continue until Satan and his angels are cast out of heaven to earth permanently, in Revelation 12.

    In the Bible, we see the possessions of people are done by devils/demons, or unclean spirits, Mark 5:1-5 Mark 16:9 Matthew 15:22, and others, as in Matthew 8 there was a legion of them in two men and they asked Jesus to cast them into pigs.

    I understand rebelling or fallen angels wreak havoc and cause division they will influence, entice, and persuade, people. My understanding is they cannot continue to possess someone, and we will have spiritual battles Ephesians 6:12. I have seen possession of someone, and I had a being lay across me in bed when I awoke it looked like a burlap cloth and its hand over my face. I was able to free my mouth and only said Jesus and it was snatched up and was gone. I can only say it had a body and it was large.

    This was in the 90s and during a time when these things happened, I started reading my Bible again and during this time I was saved. My wife and I went to several different churches and in one church the youth group went to an assisted living where my wife worked. She had gotten close to one of the ladies.

    My wife was not there when the youth group went on a Saturday, that Sunday the lady over the youth group was telling the church about their visit and said a woman died while they were there. She described it as peaceful, and they were praying. She said the name of the lady and it was the lady my wife was close to, me and my wife both heard the woman say this.

    My wife was upset so we left and went by the assisted living and that lady, or no one died. I talked to the preacher, he asked many of the church and no one heard the woman say that this woman died while they were there, we never went back to that church. There were other things.

    God bless,

    RLW
  • Bennymkje - 3 weeks ago
    Ge.17:21 "But my covenant"

    "But my covenant will I establish with Isaac, which Sarah shall bear unto thee at this set time in the next year."

    God having explained covenant according to the flesh contrasts what it meant as a covenant according to the Law of the Spirit entailed. The Spirit of the everlasting Covenant places Isaac as the heir of promise and not Ishmael. The word "But" reinforces the superlative merit of the blessings conferred on the man in his Son who is his 'only begotten Son. The sign of the Word augurs his everlasting life and blessings of the Son on whom God has from testified,"And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased."(Matt.3:17)

    "And the angel of the Lord said unto her, Behold, thou art with child and shalt bear a son, and shalt call his name Ishmael; because the Lord hath heard thy affliction." God named indeed Ishamael but his testimony did not come from God as with his Son. According to the flesh his testimony came from his brethren, "And he shall dwell in the presence of all his brethren" as the Angel of the Lord forewarned Hagar. (16:11-12).

    God left off talking with Abraham after promising him Isaac as the heir of promise. " Isaac, which Sarah shall bear unto thee at this set time in the next year" is the seed in itself planted by God. The everlasting covenant under day three is not stating vegetation as part of the covenant but the word of God. The tree of life or tree of righteousness is merely a sign. "And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so." (1:11)

    We know the seed requites time to show the kind of tree it shall become. It is what we see in the life of Isaac who totally obeyed God. "And the LORD appeared unto him, and said, Go not down into Egypt; dwell in the land which I shall tell thee of."(Ge.26:1-6) "And Isaac dwelt in Gerar."
  • Bennymkje - 3 weeks ago
    Ge.17:7-13 "Covenant in the flesh" (2 of 2)

    "For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love" (Gal.5:6). Circumcision availeth nothing where God's breath in is has shown us the way. We are to worship him in Spirit and truth. "For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live."(Ro.8:13)

    "And he that is eight days old shall be circumcised"

    The seven days in the Covenant refer to the Day that God has appointed for the Son. So of what significance is the eighth day. While the command number Seven signifies completion or whole we have the lower parts where Jesus went in Spirit and preached to the souls in prison. The Psalm of David does not leave the lower parts from God's providential eye. "My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth./Thine eyes did see my substance," (Ps.139:15-16). The number Eight has its relevance. The body of four and twenty elders is a memorial ibefore the throne of heaven (8x3). Covenant in short of the flesh shows the way to the life in the Spirit. It is what Jesus offered the nation of Israel."In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink."( John 7:37)
  • Bennymkje - 3 weeks ago
    Ge.17:7-13 "Covenant in the flesh" (1 of 2)

    "And my covenant shall be in your flesh for an everlasting covenant."

    What is the purpose of the covenant but concord between two equal parties? Fellowship of God, between the Father and Son is treated as an accord; Both parties being Spirit the Man component on one part does not affect the covenant and it is understood the aspect of flesh on the part of the Son does not affect the other entity. "Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,/To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved."(Ep.1:5-6). Good pleasure of his will is in harmony with the holiness of God. Holy is his name, to which we shall come anon. Here we are fixing the relevance of flesh in the World of the Spirit where faith is the language. The world unseen and the worlds made to appear have their own colour and speech. We can explain the nature of flesh in terms of the Word which was God.

    The word is both sound and a sign. When God sends the Son he is qualified as the only begotten Son meaning that he is a sign and the Son of man consequently explains the Man component which was with God in the beginning.. In v.7 God tells Abraham, "And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee.". "And to thy seed after thee" is done after he changed the name of Abraham to mean the Father of many nations. So the question of Ishmael born of the bondswoman has to be settled. This 'illicit' union between two parties of unequal position is now being regularised in the covenant. The change of name makes it holy, to be precise. The circumcision as a sign has only validity as much as their flesh is concerned. It is similar to infant baptism, where parents intercede on behalf of the child.
  • Chris - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    Page 3. GiGi

    And to also consider the other mystery, of which you addressed: what about the infants, the mentally/physically infirmed, or those who've never heard of Jesus - what is their state before God? Though not clearly revealed to us, except for possible snapshots, we can only entrust these souls to a Merciful God, Who makes no mistakes to the right outcome for all & we do our part to give them every opportunity to hear & respond, if they can. And this has spurred many to go to far-off unreached people groups, hazarding their lives (some having lost theirs), so that others might have an opportunity to hear of God's Love & Forgiveness, & of renewed changed lives.

    So, I've tried to address at least most of your points here GiGi; but in relation to your subject, "God's sovereign freedom of His will that is unconditioned by any source or action outside of Himself", I agree that God is Sovereign in every situation & His Will will be performed, but could we also say that His Sovereign Will can only be declared/seen when all His Attributes (some of which are His Mercy, Love, Foreknowledge, Longsuffering, the Gift of Himself in Jesus) must combine together to form that Sovereign Will? Or, is His Will separate from His other Attributes? Something to consider, I think. Blessings & thank you for provoking our thoughts.
  • Chris - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    Page 2.

    So, we have the mystery here: did those at Mars Hill who believed Paul, repent while still unsaved, or were they under the conviction of the Holy Spirit, or were they regenerated first so they could repent & believe? From the order you gave, I note that you've written 'Regeneration before Belief, Repentance, Conversion, & Redemption'. Whereas, my order would be, Repentance, Belief, Redemption/Regeneration/Conversion. And as stated elsewhere, my understanding of Regeneration is synonymous with Re-birth. So if one is regenerated before believing & repentance, then why the need for believing & repentance, for he has already been given re-birth & converted?

    As far as the creation, the holiness, & the rebellion of some angels are considered, like many things in the Word, it's simply not possible to form hard & fast views & beliefs. But in regard to humanity, as you stated, "Some (humans) to be elected to receive salvation and most of humanity not chosen by Him before the creation of the world", places our understanding at a different level pertaining to angels. If what you believe is truth, then it would be wrong for God to relegate most of humanity, not chosen by Him, to an eternal hell. Why? Because those unfortunate people will have to suffer because God ordained them to suffer. How then does such a belief stand against the Scriptures that say that He is not willing that any should perish? Because He has willed that many will perish. To me this would be incredibly baffling, making God to be an ogre, indiscriminately saving some, causing others of His creation to perish. This I can't accept or reconcile in any other way, than stated elsewhere: that the Gospel comes to all, for all are sinners - what we do as sinners in response, in concert with the Holy Spirit working in the life so touched, fits all the Scriptures much better and makes the preaching of the Gospel all the more necessary & timely (at least the apostles regarded it so).

    Onto Page 3.
  • Chris - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    Page 1.

    Thank you GiGi for your thought-provoking comments here, as also on the Character Traits of God, now His Sovereignty & being Superlative. So, to continue here.

    Going through your list of mankind's condition before God & God's Work towards man's renewal, I will list those, & other points, with verse(s), & in the order that I understand them.

    a. Man's total depravity ( Romans 3:9,10,23).

    b. God's Love & Mercy for all sinners ( John 3:16: 'loved the World' of sinners, not only the Elect; 2 Peter 3:9: 'God suffers long, not willing that any (all sinners) should perish'.

    c. God's Foreknowledge, Predestination, Calling, Justification, Glorification ( Romans 8:29,30: Paul shares this order pertaining to believers, where the logic is, if God foreknew those who would be His, it is understood that He also knew those who would reject Him). And through His Knowledge, God chose us before the foundation of the world to be holy & blameless people ( Ephesians 1:4).

    To what have we been predestined to? To be conformed to His Son's Image (v29), according to God's Purpose ( Ephesians 1:11), & to be adopted into His Family ( Ephesians 1:5).

    Calling. Various types of Calling given in the Bible, but pertaining to salvation: 1 Peter 2:9, 'having called us out of darkness (our sinful state without God) into His marvellous light (our forgiven state with God & His Son). Do we then just transition from darkness to light without a work of God the Spirit in us? And it is to this point that our discussions have focussed. Paul in Romans 8 is speaking to believers, so the matter of repentance wasn't mentioned, but may have been implied here.

    However, Paul in Acts 17 spoke to the idolatrous Athenians, 'that God calls on all men everywhere to repent'. And here we read that unregenerate men were called to repentance. Continued on Page 2.
  • Richard H Priday - 3 weeks ago
    Godly sorrow vs worldly sorrow

    I have covered this topic before but wanted to explore the "commonality" issue as well between these two states. It is sobering to think that the son of perdition; Judas Iscariot himself was so burdened by his betrayal of a "righteous man" that he hung himself. There are a lot of things we can learn from this. He obviously used to his advantage the notoriety of Christ to pilfer moneys that may have been donated anonymously; and perhaps even followed along feeling that it earned him prestige to be able to see such miracles in the presence of Jesus and the other Apostles. Even the enemy of our souls isn't so stupid as to try to directly attack Christ or go beyond what he is granted; but will lead the world to attack Christ at His return. Pride is what causes a fall; in Judas' case; he could have been like Peter and wept because he abandoned Christ; or like the thief on the cross who made a last minute plea at the site of his death a short time later. Pride it would seem kept Judas from confessing his sin to the rest of the Disciples; or asking God for forgiveness. It is possible that he genuinely felt bad for seeing the suffering that was inflicted on Christ from a human level or perspective. Many professing Christians may not even have such emotions that they should about Christ's suffering as a man.

    We all; of course to be saved have to have Godly sorrow which takes into account God's Holiness and Christ being the Son of God; part of the Godhead and what He had to condescend to and suffer more than any other in our behalf. It is LOVE that brings us to true repentance; where His Spirit testifies with our spirit that we are children of God. In that sense then it is the only way we can truly love ourselves; because we recognize it is He who lives in us. He grants us life before we can ever be made righteous. We all should feel SOMETHING emotionally as a response but only He can free us from ourselves.

    Agape.
  • GiGi - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    Chris,

    Pt. 3

    His wisdom and counsel is beyond our ability to know and understand; and that we are to submit ourselves to His sovereignty in all these things and trust in Him as truly good, loving, gracious, and merciful. His reasons for choosing as He has are mysterious to us, but in perfect harmony with His nature. And these choices are really His business to act on and not ours to criticize.

    I often think that if one must chose to believe the gospel, then what happens to those who have not heard, are too young to understand, or too impaired to discern it, too deaf to hear it, etc. Are all of these damned? I am not aware of any bible verse that speaks of an "age of accountability" for infants and children, nor that they get a pass because they cannot make an informed choice to believe. I do know that Jesus said that we are not to prevent children (including infants) to come unto Him because theirs is the kingdom of heaven. So, there must be a way for God's saving grace to reach these humans with regeneration and faith even though their understanding is not yet mature enough to fully understand their need to be saved from sin and the content of the gospel. Jesus also said that only those born of water and the Spirit can come into the kingdom. So how does God apply this to infants and children should they die before this "age of accountability" if they are in a state of depravity, dead in sin, separated from God, and unregenerated?

    These are very profound things to consider. I know I do not have all of the answers from a biblical perspective. But I do have my viewpoint based on what I do find in Scripture. And in so many ways, a viewpoint is really what any of us have as we search the Scriptures for answers and a mindset that is like that of God in Christ.

    I will leave this post for now having brought up some matters that pertain to God's sovereign freedom of His will that is unconditioned by any source or action outside of Himself.

    Have a good day in Aus.
  • Richard H Priday - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    Really the transfiguration answers all these questions. These were in the case of Elijah someone translated who never died; and Moses someone who died but whose burial spot was hidden. Nonetheless; they conversed with each other and with Christ and in some way were made known to the 3 Apostles who saw it (Peter; James and John I believe).

    One could argue that Samuel was truly brought up as he spoke the truth to Saul and the witch also seemed shocked. We also have Lazarus and the rich man in hades who also conversed along with Moses again from what I remember.

    Finally; we have the saints under the altar in heaven asking how long until justice comes and they were told until their fellowservants deaths were complete. We also will rule and reign with Christ; David will be also there ruling as well and obviously in some way recognizable. We also can look to the conversation of John with a fellowservant (either an angel or a deceased believer) as further evidence.

    I feel it is necessary to explore this subject based on first of all the fact that only saved people are in heaven. What is most important is their unique gifting and the fruit of their service as the real essence or meaning of recognition. The outer appearance of course and the old nature is what man sees dying in this present world as we all turn to dust; the fallen state of the soul also is destined for eternity in darkness and confusion. Having been conformed to His image brings uniqueness and meaningfulness to our eternal relationships there.

    Hope this helps.

    Agape; Rich P
  • GiGi - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    Chris

    Pt. 2

    But the most important aspect of all is the glory of God in being gracious to whom He determines He will be gracious to and merciful to whom He chooses to be merciful to.

    So, I will begin with this because this has been on my heart in all of this discussion.

    I believe that all that God does concerning creation is to bring glory to Himself. In acting on all of the perfect attributes of His divine nature He not only glorifies Himself within the Trinity, but also displays His glory to all of creation and in all that He does in time and space (all that is outside of Himself).

    In my post on His sovereign grace, I spoke of how He allowed sin to dome forth in creation and how He dealt with the angels who sinned and those who did not in the first rebellion of created beings towards God.

    I think that most humans would agree that God's election of the angels He would not allow to sin in the rebellion and the damnation of the fallen ones is just and righteous. Most humans have no concern that God did not chose to redeem the fallen angels nor do most humans not question that God in His wisdom and sovereignty chose to elect more angels than not to remain sinless forever.

    But when it comes to humanity, humans have more concern and humanitarian attitudes concerning God sovereignly choosing some to be elected to receive salvation and most of humanity not chosen by Him before the creation of the world. It is natural for us to feel concerned why God did not elect everyone, or that there are billions of people who will go into the lake of fire, since He is certainly capable of electing everyone and bringing all to salvation by grace, We can be disturbed by what He chose because we certainly would determine salvation to all instead of for some. This aspect of God's sovereignty baffles me, but I know that I must remember that we are His creatures and He is the Creator; that He is really more not like us than similar to us; cont. to part 3
  • GiGi - In Reply - 3 weeks ago
    Good Evening Chris,

    It has been a busy week with plumbers, construction workers and electricians taking turns at the house. Plus, with the new baby in the house we are taking turns entertaining, holding, and helping her get to sleep until it is time for mom to feed her again.

    I wanted to get back to you concerning the present conversation about regeneration, election, predestination, and salvation. This is such an important and worthwhile discussion for all believers.

    First of all, we can each be so thankful to God for His sovereign grace towards us of which He saves us. We can be assured that we have been elected by God to receive all of the promises of complete redemption in His Son our Lord, Jesus Christ. So, in a very real way, we are on the other side looking back in time for us as we consider how God worked in our own lives to bring us to salvation. And that is a blessed place to be when considering this topic.

    I wrote an entry today about God's sovereignty and His complete freedom in His will to bestow grace to those He would save.

    If you read that you may see more of why I believe that regeneration (being born from above (jn, 3: 1-8) precedes us believing the gospel message and trusting Jesus for our salvation.

    Tonight I wanted to itemize some terms that have been put forward in this thread and then exchange our views on what these terms mean biblically.

    I think the best way to start is to discuss the condition of every human prior to the new birth. So, that term is often spoken of as human depravity.

    Then we can speak about God's election from eternity past.

    Foreknowing

    Predestination,

    Election

    Then move on to how we come to faith in Jesus.

    Calling



    Regeneration,

    Belief,

    Repentance

    Conversion

    Redemption

    Then we could speak about the great unmerited benefits God bestows on those who have become reborn

    forgiveness of sins

    justification

    adoption as children of God

    sanctification

    glorification


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