Bible Discussion PAGE 135

  • Jesse - in Reply on 2 Corinthians 11:14

    In Romans 9:13 it says "As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated."

    Now that's a pretty serious statement to make.

    The terms love and hate are what are called words of comparison. Obviously, love and hate, there is a comparison there, but the words themselves don't mean He loves them and He hates them, or He loves one more than the other. As a matter of fact, these words are found in the New Testament.

    We think that was harsh but look at this. In Luke 14:26, it says "If any man come to me and hate not his father and mother, and wife and children, and brothers and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple."

    Now that's pretty harsh! You have to hate your mother and your father, and wife and children, and brothers and sisters? Now I can probably pick a couple out of there that I'm glad He said that! But it makes it pretty hard. What do you have to do, go home and show your hate towards them? What's He trying to say?

    The Greek word for hate, MISEO means to love less. It doesn't mean hostility. In fact, Jesus, in Matthew 10:37 says "He that loves father and mother more than me is not worthy of me, and he that loves son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me."

    He's talking about comparisons. The comparison is that Jesus is saying you must love me so much that in comparison to everybody else, it looks like you hate them. I mean it's not even close. Jesus said there cannot be me and somebody else!

    That helps explain in Exodus Chapter 20 where God says you shall have no other gods before me. Except in the Hebrew, it says you shall have no other gods except for me.

    In other words, it's not putting God first, and then we have our other priorities. God says I'm your only priority. Wow! We have no obligation in the flesh. Our one and only obligation is to follow Christ.

    (more to follow:)
  • Chris - in Reply on John 6:38
    Greg, from what is revealed to us in Scripture about the rich man & Lazarus as well as what we understand about death & the destiny of the spirit, I have to understand that upon their death, their physical bodies remained in the grave & what Jesus described was their spirits (whether embodied by another substance or not), were present & active in Hades. I understand that their bodies are still in the grave (or, entombed) awaiting the general resurrection.

    Matthew 27:52,53: I understand speaks of a limited resurrection (of the saints) which pertained to the signs given when our Saviour died & then arose from His grave. We're not told what happened to 'those saints', whether transported into Heaven at Christ's Ascension or lived for a while again till their 'second' death. Maybe, in a similar way to the other Lazarus, Jesus' friend & Mary & Martha's brother, who was raised back to life & then died a second time.

    So, in respect to the 'self acclaimed prophets of the religions': I specifically targeted them as those who claim that they brought God's message & subsequently received a great following of people, yet their bodies were no more different to ours, suffering the same fate in death, their bodies still lie in the grave & their spirits departing & awaiting the same fate in judgement. Therefore, to your: "When you say "their bodies lie in the grave" do you believe that only Jesus is in heaven", I understand, post Ascension, no physical body from the Earth is presently in Heaven or Hell, but their spirits are in that place appointed to them awaiting reward or final judgement. As well, I don't subscribe to 'soul sleep'. How do you see it?
  • Jesse - in Reply on Isaiah 13:10
    Hi Greg,

    The word Huios changes my understanding because it is the only word for our English word son that is applied to Jesus. He is never called a Teknon (son). Jesus is always called the Huios of God. A Huios is someone who stands in line to inherit all things from the Father. That is Jesus Christ. The word Kalos does not mean child so I am not sure what you're asking?

    You ask "Does this understanding of the Greek words mean that God is Jesus and Jesus is God?" I would have to ask who did Jesus claim to be? Jesus claimed to be the Son of God. To the Jews, the phrase "Son of God" was the same as being equal to God Himself. If you recall, they were about to take up stones to kill Jesus for who He claimed to be. Jesus didn't say "Oh no guys, before you stone me, I think there might be a misunderstanding here on who I am claiming to be."

    The Textus Receptus uses more than one word for repent. In Judas' case, in Matthew 27:3 it says Judas repented himself. Now if I stop right there, it looks like since he repented, maybe he was saved. The Greek text uses the word Metamelomai.

    Metanoeo means you are repenting of the very life and lifestyle, and the actions that you've committed, and Metamelomai means that you feel bad about the consequences. Again the word used for Judas was Metamelomai. I'm sure he felt sorry for what he did and the consequences of his actions. That is quite obvious to see as he threw the 30 pieces of silver at the priest's feet and said he didn't want it. Well, the priests couldn't put it back into the treasury because it was blood money. So they went outside the city and purchased a field with that money.

    Judas was sorry for what he did (Metamelomai), and he ultimately ended up committing suicide. But he never repented (Metanoeo). He never surrendered his life to Christ. How does Acts 1:18 tell us that Judas had help with his death? Can you see how people might say Judas repented just like the bible tells us to do? Well, he didn't!
  • YisraEL on Isaiah 13:10
    Eating honey out of an unclean (dead animal) carcass is a sin and unholy!!
  • Dianne Hann on 2 Corinthians 11:14
    I am looking for explanation about why God HATED Esau before he did anything bad or good. God LOVED us whilst we were dead in sin. The Bible says God HATED Esau ... I understand God has foreknowledge but cannot understand why He hated Esau (not Esau's sin)!
  • Bro Gereshom - in Reply on Isaiah 13:10
    Greetings to you brother,

    My original question is why the use of my & mine as both possessive adjectives and before the same word "hurt".

    With the greatest of respect to you: the brother in India is correct ! Why?

    'Thy' and 'my' is used with a consonant and 'thine' is used with a vowel sound or as a possessive pronoun: This is thine and this is mine etc. Your(s) is the old or Modern English plural and which we still occasionally use in certain parts of the north of England: thy and thine can still be heard. In my Midland dialect we use 'Yaou' singular you and 'Yuz' which is the plural form of 'You'.

    I agree; English is confusing ...!

    Bro. Gereshom
  • Kags - in Reply on 2 Thessalonians 2
    So "the antichrist" has been here all along? If so, then why has he waited so long to reveal himself as the one true god to all of man? I don't believe he has been here all along. JMO
  • Kags - in Reply on 2 Thessalonians 2
    Galations 5: 1. Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ has made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

    The yoke of bondage is the law. Christ fulfilled the law to save all of mankind. You and I cannot keep the law. It says that in all of scripture. If you think you are getting into Heaven cause of how greatly you keep the law, then it isn't the same Heaven that Jesus talks about. How awful it would be if we had to be in a heaven that was full of people who bragged all day on how good they were on earth and that is how they are in Heaven. It is the complete opposite. No one will be able to boast about how good they were down here.
  • Terry C on Matthew 16
    Amen .. so very true!
  • Jesse - in Reply on Matthew 28

    Jesus said, "Come after me." Now, who is this guy? Who can come along and command people to come? And the term "after me" is literally behind me. And Jesus points this out later that the proper position in following Christ is always behind Him.

    So they are casting their nets, they are fishing, they are conducting their business, and Jesus says come, come behind me.

    But notice what He says. He says two things:

    He says first of all, "I will make you." Jesus is the one who makes us to be what He wants us to be. He says "I will make you to become." This shows a process.

    These are important words. Jesus says "I will make you to become fishers of men." This is a play on words. He is basically telling them that they are fishermen, but I'm going to make you fishers of men. You see, they knew how to catch fish. But Jesus is telling them that He will make them be able to catch men and bring them to salvation.

    It is the Spirit of Christ, or Holy Spirit, that makes us to become fishers of men. God persuades us at the right time to witness Christ to others, but it is God who saves them.
  • Bob on Genesis 22
    Here again we see the friendship between Abraham and God. Abraham waited so long for a son from Sarah and God wants to take him away. Abraham submits after hearing clearly from God and does not argue. He just trusts God and obeys even though he does not fully understand. God himself would have been amazed at the faith and obedience of this man. "would he sacrifice his son, his only son if I ask him to", The answer was yes and God honored him for it because in the future God himself would sacrifice His only son for all the sins of the world. The only difference would be that God would actually go through with it and free mankind from the chains of sin and death by placing it all on His son. Who of us could reject such a great sacrifice and not receive Gods gift to us of "life for life...blood for blood..sinless for sin" on that cross.
  • Greg - in Reply on Isaiah 13:10

    I completely agree with you. Understanding Biblical Hebrew and Greek is essential to gaining a deeper understanding of Scripture.

    I have a couple of questions.

    How does the word "huios" meaning "a son" and "kalos" meaning a "child" change your understanding of Scripture?

    Does this understanding of the Greek words mean that God is Jesus and Jesus is God?

    The word for "repented" means to "care afterwards, i.e. regret." (Strong's #3338).

    If Judas did not repent as "we as believers understand repentance to mean," what does "regret" mean to you? If forgiveness is based upon repentance, why could he not be forgiven? Judas was not a non'believer in Jesus.

    Judas did not commit the unpardonable sin, and he had help with his death (Acts 1:18).
  • Brenda on Psalms 91
    I want share my thoughts on Psalms 91. I share this with anyone who needs to know the Lord protects them and thier family. Joseph prince wrote a book on Psalms 91 and it is very inspiring. I knew the Holy Spirit led me to this book and had me send copies to those who needed it. I was not even going to the store and there it the 91 Psalm Prayer of Protection, by Joseph Prince I was elated and after reading went back and brought several copies. This prayer h as s helped me to realize all I need is faith. God Bless all of you
  • Brenda on Psalms 91:7
    I agree with you this prayer has kept me and my family and I'm so thankful for Gods protection if you have the faith of a mustard seed you will see His will revealed. And see his protection activated. God Bless you. Right now I'm going through a lot of the things you mentioned. My Mother is suffering memory lost but I seek healing. For her.
  • Greg - in Reply on Matthew 28

    The phrase "fishers of men" is a Talmudic expression which means "a fisher of the Law"
  • Jesse - in Reply on Isaiah 13:10
    Thanks, Chris,

    Learning to read Greek has been such a blessing. There are several places in the Greek text where different words are used but are translated as the same word in English. Not just the word carnal, because we see the word carnal in English and we automatically think that it is bad. But words like good, repent, son, and several others, when we see those words in English, we know what good means, we know what repent means, and we know what son means in English.

    I just recently read here someone asking how can Jesus be God, when the bible says He is God's Son? Well, in English, we know what the word son means. But the Greek uses a completely different word. The word Son when applied to Jesus is the word Huios. Son by natural birth is a totally different word. It is the word Teknon.

    Jesus said why did you call me good? There is only one who is good and that it God. Now wait a minute, I know some good people. I think the people here on this forum are good people. But one might argue that Jesus said only God is good. Okay, that is true. Only God is Agathos (Good). People can be good also (Kalos).

    Repent? Someone asked me (Not here) if Judas was saved because the bible says that he repented. Again, the Greek text did not say he repented like we as believers understand repentance to mean. The word repent used for Judas was the word Metamelomai, which means Judas was sorry. He did not repent as in making a decision to change the direction of his life and surrender to Christ. The repentance we know and understand is the word Metanoeo. These are just a few words that literally change the meaning of a verse or passage that I've come to know in my study of the Greek text. I'm happy to share my understanding, and I have been built up by reading the things you share. You have a vast wealth of knowledge and understanding that I hope to obtain someday. But I know that only comes from the Lord. And He's only going to give me what my little pea brain can handle!
  • Heavens - in Reply on Genesis 1
    i think about Genesis 1 he is a good man
  • Jesse - in Reply on Revelation 21
    (Part 3:)

    Lastly, I agree with a lot of what you are saying but not all. I think our disagreement is more of a timing issue than anything else. I completely respect your views and I know we can't agree on everything. Wouldn't that be nice if every believer agreed on every word of scripture? We (The Church) would not be in such a mess that we are in today if we all agreed with everything. But I'm sure we both would agree that that's never going to happen as long as we live in these fleshly bodies!

    Thank you so much for your reply. And thank you for sharing your understanding with me.
  • Jesse - in Reply on Revelation 21
    (Part 2:)

    This is known as the 70th week of Daniel, a week being a seven-year period. I don't know how to get 3-1/2 years out of a week? The 70th week of Daniel is divided into four sections: Pains of Birth (The first 3-1/2 years), the Pivotal Point (Mid-Point of the Tribulation), Perils of tribulation (The last 3-1/2 years known as the Great Tribulation), and then the promise of His Coming (The Second Coming of Christ).

    You say that the actual tribulation begins as soon as the man of sin moves from Rome and sits in the temple, and if you are referring to what the Bible calls "The Great Tribulation" then I agree. I am curious as to how you know for sure this man comes from Rome?

    If no man will ever go to the 3rd heaven where the Father, Son, and holy angels currently dwell, where is Paul the apostle at right now? Paul said to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. If the Lord is in the 3rd heaven and Paul is present with the Lord, where is Paul? Paul said in 2 Corinthians 12:2-4 "I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago-whether in the body I do not know, or out of the body I do not know, God knows-such a man was caught up to the third heaven. And I know how such a man-whether in the body or apart from the body I do not know, God knows-was caught up into Paradise and heard inexpressible words, which a man is not permitted to speak. Could that have been Paul himself? And wasn't John caught up to the 3rd heaven? John got to see the throne in heaven and the one sitting on it.

    I do agree that there will be some who will survive the Great Tribulation, the last 3-1/2 years. However, I think it will be very few, not great multitudes. I do thank you for sending me all these scriptures. Please know that I have read all these before and I am familiar with them. They are not new to me.

    (One more very short reply to follow)
  • Jesse - in Reply on Revelation 21

    I agree that all who are found worthy will receive spiritual bodies. But what does it mean to be found worthy? Am I found worthy? I think not. One day when I stand before the Lord, I'm going to know that I don't deserve to be there. I am found worthy not because of anything I did, but because God is going to see His Son in me. You see, I am made righteous through Christ because He alone is righteous. I have no righteousness of my own.

    You say that "the church applies to everyone who will be grafted into the God Family natural born and spiritual." I would agree that the church consists of all believers who have received Christ and have been born of His Spirit. I am not following what you mean about the "natural born" part?

    I also agree with you that there is only one more return to earth by Christ. And yes, the bible is clear that all eyes will see Him. Our technology today makes that possible (Satellite TV, etc.). This return to earth is His second coming. Revelation Chapter 19 says we come back with Him. But I don't believe this refers to us meeting Him first in the air (the clouds), and then immediately coming back down to the earth. Why would we meet Him in the clouds just to come right back down? I see nothing in scripture that supports that thought. I do agree that Christ will come and reign for 1,000 years. I see this as happening after the Tribulation period.

    You mention that "Jesus will be teaching the children of Israel in the Wilderness for 3 and a half years when he returns." Can you share with me where you find that in scripture? I'm not saying I agree or disagree at this point. I just never heard that before.

    As far as the Tribulation Period goes, I still believe it will be a 7-year period. The first 3 years is called the Tribulation. The last 3 years, the bible calls it the Great Tribulation. And the whole time it is called the Tribulation period.

    (More to follow...)
  • Greg - in Reply on Isaiah 58:12
    Raymond Quigano, GOD"S CALENDAR

    page 2,

    I have continually found that those that refute the Dead Sea Scrolls and the book of Enoch have not read them and show their complete dependence and reliance on what man (Catholic church) has declared to be divine writings.

    A breakdown of the Enoch calendar

    1) 12 month, 30 day month, 360 days

    2) + 4 intercalary days (+ 1 occasional leap day) = 365 days

    3) 364 / 7 = 52

    4) Four intercalary days are to be lived but not reckoned, same with the occasional leap day.

    5) Intercalary day (day of remembrance) is inserted at the end of each 3 month cycle.

    6) 1st day of the 1st month is ALWAYS the day AFTER the spring equinox.

    7) 1st day of the 1st month ALWAYS resets to the 4th day of the week.

    8) Enoch lived 365 years.

    The spring equinox is also called the "Great Gate"

    The first day of the first month according to the Enoch calendar is ALWAYS the 4th (FOURTH) day of the week.

    A check for this can be found in the book of Jubilees where it states that the Festival of Shavuot is ALWAYS the 15th day of the 3rd month and is ALWAYS the FIRST day of the week.

    So if you count backwards to the 1st day of the 1st month it will ALWAYS be the 4th day of the week.

    (Enoch 72:32-34) states that there is a separation day that is to occur at the spring equinox which separates each year. It is the day after day 364 and it does NOT have a day attached to it.

    It is the time from the end of the 364th day until the spring equinox.

    The day after the 364th day is intercalated.

    The Enoch calendar is a holy priestly calendar that is based on 364 days ONLY.

    The extra time until the equinox is used to calibrate the New Year. That time is not counted. The calendar is perfectly rectified every year.
  • Greg - in Reply on Isaiah 58:12
    Raymond Quijano,

    I hear you loud and clear and completely agree.

    I will do my best to keep God's calendar and not the ridiculous Gregorian calendar that has everyone fouled up.

    The Book of Enoch from the Dead Sea Scrolls gives us the Solar Priestly Calendar.

    The Book of Enoch covers topics on the solar priestly calendar, origins of demons and giants, why some angels fell from heaven, an explanation of why the Great Flood was morally necessary, and the thousand-year reign of the Messiah.

    The Book of Jude speaks of these fallen angels and Enoch is mentioned as having preached against them (Jude 1: 14-15).

    Sabbath days remain constant on the Enoch calendar in relation to the spring equinox; but they will rotate on the Gregorian calendar.

    Enoch lived 365 years (and possibly .242)

    The spring equinox is the great equalizer of the calendar and is the leap day that rectifies the calendar every year (day 365.242), look at (Ps. Ch. 19)

    March 20, 2020 (sunrise to sunrise) was the 365th day of the solar year (the day of the spring equinox), making March 21, 2020 the first day of the first month of the New Year (and the 4th day of the week)

    The 364 day Enoch solar calendar runs off the 365.242 day solar cycle

    When does the day start? Look at (Genesis 1:16, 18, 19:33, 34, Exodus 10:13, 16:22-27,

    We are specifically commanded to use the SUN as the sign for days, Sabbaths, months, years, Sabbaths of years, jubilees, and feasts, and for all seasons of the year.

    The LUNAR cycle for the year is 354 days

    The Enoch solar calendar is 364 days (+ 365th and day of spring equinox)

    The moon is to be for light upon the earth at night (Genesis 1:14, Psalms 136:9, Jeremiah 31:35), for seasons (Psalms 104:19), and for a witness to the covenant of David (Psalms 89:37).

    The ONLY calendar that can reckon Daniel's 70 weeks is the Enoch calendar.
  • Bob Grove on Ecclesiasticus 40:5
    No wonder they took this book out of the KJV it is packed with wisdom , I'd hate to be in the shoes of them come judgement time !
  • Greg - in Reply on John 6:38

    When you say "their bodies lie in the grave" do you believe that only Jesus is in heaven.

    If that is true, how do we understand what happened with the rich man and Lazarus?
  • Kay - in Reply on John 6:38
    See you there, hapily, gratefully, smiling and crying (for joy) at the same time. His church, his bride, New Jerursalem, we who wait for him, love him, receive his words and obey them. We have little time left here so Lord, teach us to number our days and apply our hearts to wisdom. Hold that fast til he comes and keep praying to escape all the things that are coming upon this world and be found by him living in joy. But how, with the terrors and hatred that will be coming at all of us from everyone, everywhere as these very last days are here. I'm still trying to love my enemies that pursue and make prey out of me, but my natural reaction is to hate them. Stephen and Jesus are our examples, love and pray for those who persecute you. God will perfect that which concerns us. Be strong. See you there. Love you.
  • ASHU on Matthew 28
    when Jesus said to Simon called peter and his brother Andrew casting a net into the sea and he said to them "follow me and i will make you fishers of men.

    also in Mark 1:17.

    what does Jesus meant by '' I will make you fishers of men''.
  • Godbless on Acts 1
    Please, i need a study bible and christian matterials, that can help me grow in faith. Thanks.
  • RAYMOND QUIJANO on Isaiah 58:12
    Pope Gregory Calendar Or Gods Calendar of Genesis Chapter one

    which one would you keep?
  • Praise on Isaiah 13:10
    That is Revelation all about God and the forces of darkness and when God gave John a vision not the one that baptized Jesus he saw a new earth and a new heaven.
  • Praise on Isaiah 13:10
    For that God caused Satan "Because you have done this you wil move on your belly and eat dust all he days of your life and a woman's son shall destroy your works.

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