Not a big deal; I thought mentioning the Second Coming I was referring to the Rapture which in reality is the beginning of the Second Coming. When the sign of the Son of Man appears may be around the sixth seal when Jesus is recognized as beginning judgments on earth (which again bolsters my theory). There are verses talking about Christ's victory before the bowl judgments as that basically is when there is no more holding back and the incense of the prayers of the saints take no effect and thus we (I assume it is the resurrected saints) can't get in there to pray anymore and of course no one on earth can pray for more delay as well.
The comments remind me of Matthew 24:49 as to fellowservants that are trying to get the message across about the King coming soon; and the bride being snatched. Zephaniah 2:3 is one of those O.T. nuggets about being delivered before wrath begins. I don't argue about whether it is man's wrath; Satan's or Gods anyway since it is all under God's judgment. What is different is that once the Trib. starts things are all going to happen in sequence all 21 judgments PLUS what the 2 Prophets decide to dish out. Another argument is that Pretribbers left behind will fall for Antichrist; and I may agree partially that those who are NOT praying to escape ALL things to come to pass ( Luke 21:36; see also Rev. 3:10) may either not be real believers or the rapture is a reward issue; all of God's children are saved but some need their garments washed through martyrdom (that is my contention if they have garments in the first place they must be saved; whether or not they are new Trib saints or ones stained that are left behind such as with Zechariah 8:3. However we are to buy oil or be tried as gold in the fire may mean refinement in the Tribulation; but since that is unpopular I won't force the issue and be open to all believers being raptured.
Post Tribbers can be fooled if they think the Beast is making the world ready for Christ also.
God's Words are in the bible and should be approached with reverence and a very humble heart. Never try to force 'your' meaning upon scripture, but allow the Spirit to move you to the correct interpretation. "Light rejected is light denied." Those who don't want to see lose the capacity to see.
Napoleon Bonaparte: "The Bible is no mere book, but a Living Creature, with a power that conquers all that oppose it."
Dear Richard , I'm so sorry ! I must have sent my question to you by mistake ! Please forgive me ! I appreciate your answer but my question wasn't for you , I apologise again :) .
Salvation in this case would be salvation of the body; new and incorruptible. The Spirit is the Holy Spirit who is with us UNTIL the end of the age ( Matt. 28:20).
I will mention that the remnant was 7000 out of all the Jews at that time. We see that principle with only Joshua and Caleb out of the whole generation making it into the Promised Land; Moses of course was saved but his behavior at one time kept him out.
We see also the principle of some receiving the crown or crowns for specific acts when on earth. Let us face it not everyone runs for the prize; some make it into heaven as through the fire ( 1 Cor. 3:15). Christ Himself turned away some would be disciples who didn't want to count the cost. It is possible of course to amend our ways; Christ purges more to sanctify us. There are certainly variations as to how much fruit we have; 30 fold; 50 fold; 100 fold. We can just look around to see those who are undistracted and have their lives balanced; those who are on fire for Christ we should be discerning to recognize. We all struggle with sin there is no doubt; some who claim to be believers aren't even saved while others are in various levels of maturity.
Again not a point to argue about. God can use death in order to prematurely end a life (see 1 Corinthians 11:30) where MANY sleep because they have taken communion unworthily. There are also verses in Corinthians about the body in 1 Corinthians 5:5 where God allows someone to die or get near it to preserve the soul; in other words perhaps they would have been lost if this hadn't happened because they would go so deep in sin as to be reprobate; that is only a theory.
These verses should help clarify as to where many are; and that not everyone gains the same reward just as the other principle that some suffer more in hell (see Matthew 11:21).
Dear Jema: Judging by all the criticism it seems I have hit a nerve with many people. As for your question; if I didn't believe in the literal physical return of Christ then I'd be a heretic; or what is known as a "full Preterist." It seems one of my responses is indicating that Christ has already returned. I'll leave it up to the forum here as to my opinion on the subject-as for that i feel the line has to be drawn as to what is clearly spurious doctrine; for 2 Thessalonians 2:2 makes it clear this has not happened. As to the Rapture and such I would never disfellowship over that issue unless such contention came up when someone asks my opinion that I feel the Lord's will won't be done in communicating His Word.
I hope you have noticed that the Word is something and really the only thing that I constantly quote. Any reasonable conversation relies on it. I have discussed the subject of the Rapture before with numerous references from the New and Old Testament; with the basic principle being that God delivers from as well as through certain things. Such is the typology of Enoch and Elijah who were translated as opposed to Lot who escaped just as judgment came. My basic premise is that it is one thing to die as martyrs now and we CERTAINLY need to be cognizant of that fact as something such as the brave girl who was martyred at Sandy Run that it is coming here. The only thing different in the Tribulation is how demonic entities and God's judgments (which ARE immediately upon opening the Seal Judgments which only CHRIST HIMSELF can open) manifest. And as I've stated before the gates of hell will not prevail against the church at present but the saints WILL be overcome in the Tribulation. I will let you look up the verses as I have quoted them often. The worst time in human history ( Matthew 24:21) is something we haven't seen yet when Satan is allowed temporary control over the whole earth; God has to shorten the days or no one survives ( Mark 13:20).
Right yes Jema ,years ago i was in a Church that never canceled services. It just seems like things have changed a lot now that it is later in life.Im 50 now .I dont like how things are evolving.
We should not accept that sin will always play a part in our lives!
God is not a sinner, and if you are a true child of God you will not be saying you can't stop sinning. Worse than telling yourself that you can't stop sinning, is telling others that they can't stop sinning! The phrase misery loves company is so true here. This mindset is wrong, and goes directly agains all of the bible scripture.This thought that you can never stop sinning is from Satan, and he has convinced you that you can't stop sinning. If you believe this , and live this, you will certainly die as a sinner, and never achieve becoming a true child of God.
God's children strive to live without sin, and eventually succeed and win the race! Those who have been born of God (Born Again) should no longer be a part of this world (we have died to this world) and we should no longer be slaves to satan/sin that is inherent to the world.
So, if we are truly Born Again we are now becoming the children of God and not children of this world.
Scripture goes on to state that children of God are gods: I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High. Psalm 82:6
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. John 1:12-13
Matthew 12:50 "For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother."
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect. Matthew 5:48
Hi Gigi, have you scheduled your surgery? I also had the surgery and I see very well. I still have to have reading glasses. No prob. Let me know when you will have your surgery and I'll pray for you. Is it ok if you post it on prayer request? But don't post it at all if you don't want to. I'll still pray for you. From your sister in Christ. God bless you
Hi Raincloud, how are your eyes? I also had cataract surgery a few years ago and everything went well. I still have to have reading glasses but I'm not complaining! lol God bless you
The interpretation of theological and spiritual matters can vary among individuals and religious denominations. The passage you mentioned from 1 Timothy 6:16 is indeed a biblical verse, and different people may interpret it differently based on their religious beliefs and theological understanding.
In the context of the verse, it is stated that God alone possesses eternal or immortal life. This can be seen as a reminder of God's unique and divine nature. The idea that believers are spiritually saved and receive eternal life through their faith in Christ is a common Christian belief.
The concept of being "physically saved" or "spiritually saved" can be a matter of theological interpretation. Some Christians may emphasize the spiritual aspect of salvation, emphasizing the forgiveness of sins and the promise of eternal life through faith in Jesus Christ, while others may also consider the physical well-being and safety of believers.
The notion of believers being spiritually "married" or united with Christ is also a theological concept found in Christian traditions. It signifies a close and personal relationship between believers and Jesus, often described metaphorically as a marriage. This spiritual union is believed to bring about transformation and a new way of living for the believer, yet the explanation doesn't absolve you from your original blasphemous post. There you attempted to use the metaphoric marriage union with Christ in an attempt to undermine Ephesians 5:22-25 which addresses the ROLES and RESPONSIBIlITIES of husbands and wives within marriage union, using the metaphor of Christ and the Church to illustrate these roles, but this metaphor doesn't change the SPECIFIC COMMANDS for the husband and wife within the marital relationships. It would render Ehesisans 5:22-25 to no effect.
Jordyn wrote:
>The word says you are the WIFE of Christ, so these scripture of a wife submitting to her HUSBAND apply as much to you as to any earthly wife.
There's a reason for all of this that you have very accurately articulated,
it's the Harlot, the false church, present day Christianity, worldwide, Rev 17:5 the apostasy spoken of in Rev 1, 2 & 3 which ripen & matured with the Roman Catholic's, then as the reformation started tearing down the darkness of popery, they, the protestant did not perfect it, but adulterated themselves with the kings of the earth, the Catholic's the mother, the protestant & all other sects but one, are the Harlots describe here, & then in time, that one also went into apostasy Rev 17:4 all forms of godliness without the Power, some more refine and subtlety dress then others, making a big show of Christian character, works & airy knowledge, but its all from the letter, learnt from the teaching & doctrine of men, in the art of science, as one would any other profession. They practice what the Apostles wrote of, who were lead by the Spirit to do it, but they don't do what the Apostles did in following the dictates of the Spirit which lead the Apostles to do it, Rom 8:14, but follows the learning from the letter & duplicate what they learn & believe they're being lead by the Spirit. NOT !
The Substance is not known here, then they are other that are outright perverted as it is this day.
Yet, God in His longsuffering love has a people within her, whom in Rev 18: calls out "come out of her My people, less you partake of her sins & plagues.
Friends, these are weighty & eternal matters here, let us continue to consider what spiritual state we're truly in, personally & worldwide.
Who will heed His Call, separated themselves from these Harlot's & Abominations of the earth?
The trumpet is sounding, Awake, Awake My Beloved ones, come out of her!
I would add to your statement of Paul in 1Cor 9:27
Though Romans is place before Cor in the bible, it was actually written after Cor
In Pauls ever increasing growth in the Grace in the Lord Jesus Christ, Grace brought him to the perfection, maturity, & confidence that he states in Rom 8:35-39
only sin separates
This clearly show a perfection that can be added too, as we continue steadfastly to grow in Grace until the end 2Tim 4:7
this is the reason he states in Philippians 3:12 & then in Philippians 3:15 it was a contradiction of truths, but that he learnt
John 15:5 & Philippians 4:13 Humility, Micah 6:8
We have the Scriptures as a testimony of Paul's extra ordinary life, all owning to Grace, 1Cor 15:10
God is not a respector of persons, though He does have different placement within His body, yet all are required to be holy!
If pretrib believers be correct, then those of us that believe Jesus returns in the clouds "after"the tribulation..it would be a nice surprise. However, should post trib believers be correct, then pretrib believers will be caught off guard, possibly being deceived by the anti christ, and/ or being unprepared, will suffer great consequence.
Read Matthew 24. And specifically verses 29-30. These are Jesus' very words when asked about the end times. He specifically says that AFTER the tribulation the sun and moon are darkened and that the son of man appears coming in the clouds.
No where does the Bible say that the elect (believers or the saved) will not suffer tribulation. In fact it tells us that the elect WILL suffer tribulation verse 9. Do not mistake or confuse "tribulation"with "Gods wrath". They are not the same.
Jimbob explains it well. And I agree pretrib is one of the greatest deceptions of our times.
When we abide in the Christian doctrine, we give PROOF of the REALITY of our FAITH. Without our righteousness, we will also suffer the loss of opportunity to glorify God. When thinking or behaving unrighteously, we violate our reason for existence, which is to glorify God in everything ( 1Co 10:31). Instead of exalting Him, we bring reproach on His name. Instead of causing others to see our good works and glorify our Father in Heaven ( Mt 5:16), we breed confusion and mockery among unbelievers and we become further obstacles to their salvation.
Your thinking is from a human perspective,not from GOD's perspective. JESUS said: Luke 21:24-And they(the Jews-Israel)shall fall by the edge of the sword,and shall be led away captive into all nations(this part of the verse literally fulfilled against Israel, from 70 to 1948, 1878 years of severe curses and punishments,and plagues- Deuteronomy 28:15-63):and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles(this part of prophecy will literally fulfill in days to come,also according to the Revelation 11:2)until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
Matthew 24:15 -When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation,spoken of by Daniel the prophet( Daniel 12:6-12),stand in the holy place,(whoso readeth,let him understand)
Daniel 12:6-12
6And one said to the man clothed in linen,which was upon the waters of the river,How long shall it be to the end of these wonders?
7And I heard the man clothed in linen,which was upon the waters of the river,when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven,and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time,times,and an half;and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people,all these things shall be finished.
8And I heard,but I understood not:then said I,O my Lord,what shall be the end of these things?
9And he said,Go thy way,Daniel:for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the END.
10Many shall be PURIFIED,and made WHITE,and TRIED;but the wicked shall do wickedly:and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.
11And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away (Jesus' sacrifice has already lasted 738,300 days,and now will be taken away),and the abomination that maketh desolate set up(in the midst of the last week of years),there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.(END of this current world of Devil)
12Blessed is he that waiteth,and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.
You are correct, there is no 7 year great tribulation; the word does tell us, the great tribulation lasted from the time Christ entered the garden till he DIED on the cross.
Christ has already come the second time, as a thief in the night, you don't see the thief?
Hebrews 9:28 So Christ was once offered for the SINS of many, and to those who look for him he shall APPEAR THE SECOND TIME without SIN unto SALVATION.
John 16:7 For I tell you the truth, it is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter WILL NOT COME unto you, but if I depart, I will sent him to you.
John 15:26 ....but when the Comforter IS COME ....... even the SPIRIT of TRUTH ..... he will testify of me ......
Colossians 1:27 ..... this mystery ..... Christ ON YOU ......
only a few are living fully surrendered?.. you don't know this to be true.. do you recall what God said to Elijah?.. go read it, I have reserved unto me.................. how many? that have not bowed a knee to baal.. there is no pre trib ""rapture".. go study pal, forget what the evangelical political rhetoric has caused you to misunderstand. Peace and love in Christ.
It doesn't drag me down, but does concern me when unbelievers stumble into these churches which have become so carnal that the unbeliever doesn't see much difference between the Christian and regular unbelievers. The bible the very WORDS OF GOD says this and that and they witness it being IGNORED or explained away since it was inconvenient to follow.
I am just a voice crying out in the wilderness... A conscience if you will. Letting people know to prepare for judgment. For it will start in the house of God. A lot of people in the Church "think they are saved." So great is Satan's power of deception that the tares truly suppose themselves to be Children of the kingdom!
Paul urges all those claiming to be spiritually saved to "examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith; test yourselves"
2 Corinthians 13:5 (KJV) 5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?
[[[When we abide in the Christian doctrine, we give PROOF of the REALITY of our faith.]]] So it makes me really question the salvation of these Western Christian women who don't submit to their husbands, and the majority honestly probably don't."
I can't tell you the enormous amounts of pushback I get from both "Christian" men and women on Ephesians 5 and even more pushback on 1 Corinthians 11 "head coverings during corporate worship whenever I bring it up.
Usually, the go-to scripture for these feminist Christians is Galatians 3:28.
Paul urges all those claiming to be spiritually saved to "examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith; TEST yourselves."
2 Corinthians 13:5 (KJV) Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?
I discussed the other day about the Rosh Hashanah last trump concept that made it plausible that the Rapture would be this weekend. Clearly it went by again with no Rapture.
When we look at various events in scripture; we see the surprise element. Surely those watchmen who are asleep or not preparing others will be surprised when He comes (as many will be watching on high holidays such as this and Pentecost).
( Luke 12:35-40). The enemy camp is taken easiest this way in a successful ambush. Watching and waiting with patience is more than a one or two day spectator sport. It does seem that SOME warning comes before the bridegroom arrives ( Matt. 25:6); although some say this is deliverance perhaps before the second coming or even the midpoint of the Tribulation for the Jews or those on earth at that time. In any event; the idea that the Lord delays His coming brings laziness and sin ( Matthew 24:48-51) and results it appears becoming a statistic stuck in the Tribulation at best in verse 51 if not lost forever.
I am a Pre Trib person because it seems clear to me DECADES ago the enemy could have taken over the whole world and certainly we are on "borrowed time" today; the "restrainer" in 2 Thess. 2:6 has to be the Spirit working through the church.
The fact that only a few are really living fully surrendered today shows why in large part the salt and light has reduced to allow the level of ecil we see widespread today. This is in the world as expected but in the Laodicean church that typifies Western churches and that of many other countries in the world today.
Let us continue to warn others to flee the wrath to come ( Luke 3:7); whether it be imminent unexpected death or being stuck in the Tribulation. Remember that Christ comes as a thief to take His precious treasure ( 1 Thess. 5:2; Malachi 3:17). A thief such as this doesn't care about the profane; just the sacred objects of His affection.
Actually, there is no 7 year tribulation period. I mean, it doesn't really matter how long it is, but nowhere does it specify 7 years. Common, "misunderstanding".. one day equals a year in the prophetic, as we see in the 70 weeks concerning the messiah.. Jesus of course. Not meaning this argumentative in any way either.
Thank you for your response, your words of encouragement mean a lot to me, as well all the relevant scripture regarding worshiping God in Spirit and Truth, and overcoming sin. I agree with all, and if we our honest with ourselves and take the time to evaluate our true walk with Christ we should be conforming to the scripture you mentioned such as 2 Corinthians 5:17 and 1 John 1:5-6 and if born again should have a mind like Christ 1 Corinthians 2:16
Scripture tells us we can have a mind like Christ! Not conformed to this world, but have renewed minds, and prove what is good, and acceptable, and perfect will of God Romans 12:2 Sinning is not acceptable to God, and for Christians to maintain the steady drum beat that they can't stop sinning is unbelievable per all of the scripture telling us that we are required STOP sinning, even including Jesus telling us that with Faith nothing is impossible for us! Matt 17:20
We are supposed to be as HOLY as Jesus and walk like him.Through the Spirit of God we CAN stop sinning. He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked. 1 John 2:6 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother. Matthew 12:50 The Bible emphasises several times that we are supposed to be holy:Ye shall be holy: for I theLordyour God am holy. Leviticus 19:2
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect. Matt 5:48 Frankie, I think we can both agree that being perfect is without sin. But the multitude of worldly Christains say they can't ever be perfect and will always be sinners in this life - so they are saying Jesus/God is lying in Matt 5:48 and they are not accepting this Truth!
Paul Apostle in his wisdom, wrote :1 Corintians 2:7-10
7 But we speak the wisdom of GOD in a mystery, even the HIDDEN wisdom, which GOD ordained before the world unto our glory:
8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which GOD hath prepared for them that love Him.
10 But GOD hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of GOD. (Even the hidden wisdom and mystery of His Plan of restitution of all things,the Genesis,describing His works of restoration of creation - Acts 3:18-24. As JESUS said when He came in the fourth Day: My Father worketh hitherto, and I work- John 5:17,(in fulfillment of Genesis 1:26: Let us make man in OUR image, after our likeness:... JESUS being the brightness of His glory, and the EXPRESS IMAGE of GOD's PERSON... Hebrews 1:3
The comments remind me of Matthew 24:49 as to fellowservants that are trying to get the message across about the King coming soon; and the bride being snatched. Zephaniah 2:3 is one of those O.T. nuggets about being delivered before wrath begins. I don't argue about whether it is man's wrath; Satan's or Gods anyway since it is all under God's judgment. What is different is that once the Trib. starts things are all going to happen in sequence all 21 judgments PLUS what the 2 Prophets decide to dish out. Another argument is that Pretribbers left behind will fall for Antichrist; and I may agree partially that those who are NOT praying to escape ALL things to come to pass ( Luke 21:36; see also Rev. 3:10) may either not be real believers or the rapture is a reward issue; all of God's children are saved but some need their garments washed through martyrdom (that is my contention if they have garments in the first place they must be saved; whether or not they are new Trib saints or ones stained that are left behind such as with Zechariah 8:3. However we are to buy oil or be tried as gold in the fire may mean refinement in the Tribulation; but since that is unpopular I won't force the issue and be open to all believers being raptured.
Post Tribbers can be fooled if they think the Beast is making the world ready for Christ also.
Napoleon Bonaparte: "The Bible is no mere book, but a Living Creature, with a power that conquers all that oppose it."
We see also the principle of some receiving the crown or crowns for specific acts when on earth. Let us face it not everyone runs for the prize; some make it into heaven as through the fire ( 1 Cor. 3:15). Christ Himself turned away some would be disciples who didn't want to count the cost. It is possible of course to amend our ways; Christ purges more to sanctify us. There are certainly variations as to how much fruit we have; 30 fold; 50 fold; 100 fold. We can just look around to see those who are undistracted and have their lives balanced; those who are on fire for Christ we should be discerning to recognize. We all struggle with sin there is no doubt; some who claim to be believers aren't even saved while others are in various levels of maturity.
Again not a point to argue about. God can use death in order to prematurely end a life (see 1 Corinthians 11:30) where MANY sleep because they have taken communion unworthily. There are also verses in Corinthians about the body in 1 Corinthians 5:5 where God allows someone to die or get near it to preserve the soul; in other words perhaps they would have been lost if this hadn't happened because they would go so deep in sin as to be reprobate; that is only a theory.
These verses should help clarify as to where many are; and that not everyone gains the same reward just as the other principle that some suffer more in hell (see Matthew 11:21).
Agape; Rich P
I hope you have noticed that the Word is something and really the only thing that I constantly quote. Any reasonable conversation relies on it. I have discussed the subject of the Rapture before with numerous references from the New and Old Testament; with the basic principle being that God delivers from as well as through certain things. Such is the typology of Enoch and Elijah who were translated as opposed to Lot who escaped just as judgment came. My basic premise is that it is one thing to die as martyrs now and we CERTAINLY need to be cognizant of that fact as something such as the brave girl who was martyred at Sandy Run that it is coming here. The only thing different in the Tribulation is how demonic entities and God's judgments (which ARE immediately upon opening the Seal Judgments which only CHRIST HIMSELF can open) manifest. And as I've stated before the gates of hell will not prevail against the church at present but the saints WILL be overcome in the Tribulation. I will let you look up the verses as I have quoted them often. The worst time in human history ( Matthew 24:21) is something we haven't seen yet when Satan is allowed temporary control over the whole earth; God has to shorten the days or no one survives ( Mark 13:20).
We should not accept that sin will always play a part in our lives!
God is not a sinner, and if you are a true child of God you will not be saying you can't stop sinning. Worse than telling yourself that you can't stop sinning, is telling others that they can't stop sinning! The phrase misery loves company is so true here. This mindset is wrong, and goes directly agains all of the bible scripture.This thought that you can never stop sinning is from Satan, and he has convinced you that you can't stop sinning. If you believe this , and live this, you will certainly die as a sinner, and never achieve becoming a true child of God.
God's children strive to live without sin, and eventually succeed and win the race! Those who have been born of God (Born Again) should no longer be a part of this world (we have died to this world) and we should no longer be slaves to satan/sin that is inherent to the world.
So, if we are truly Born Again we are now becoming the children of God and not children of this world.
Scripture goes on to state that children of God are gods: I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High. Psalm 82:6
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. John 1:12-13
Matthew 12:50 "For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother."
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect. Matthew 5:48
In the context of the verse, it is stated that God alone possesses eternal or immortal life. This can be seen as a reminder of God's unique and divine nature. The idea that believers are spiritually saved and receive eternal life through their faith in Christ is a common Christian belief.
The concept of being "physically saved" or "spiritually saved" can be a matter of theological interpretation. Some Christians may emphasize the spiritual aspect of salvation, emphasizing the forgiveness of sins and the promise of eternal life through faith in Jesus Christ, while others may also consider the physical well-being and safety of believers.
The notion of believers being spiritually "married" or united with Christ is also a theological concept found in Christian traditions. It signifies a close and personal relationship between believers and Jesus, often described metaphorically as a marriage. This spiritual union is believed to bring about transformation and a new way of living for the believer, yet the explanation doesn't absolve you from your original blasphemous post. There you attempted to use the metaphoric marriage union with Christ in an attempt to undermine Ephesians 5:22-25 which addresses the ROLES and RESPONSIBIlITIES of husbands and wives within marriage union, using the metaphor of Christ and the Church to illustrate these roles, but this metaphor doesn't change the SPECIFIC COMMANDS for the husband and wife within the marital relationships. It would render Ehesisans 5:22-25 to no effect.
Jordyn wrote:
>The word says you are the WIFE of Christ, so these scripture of a wife submitting to her HUSBAND apply as much to you as to any earthly wife.
I am going to be gone all day, I will respond to you when I get home tonight.
God Bless YOU!
I suppose could also have been some sort of meat from other animals too.
But Thanks for the feed back.
There's a reason for all of this that you have very accurately articulated,
it's the Harlot, the false church, present day Christianity, worldwide, Rev 17:5 the apostasy spoken of in Rev 1, 2 & 3 which ripen & matured with the Roman Catholic's, then as the reformation started tearing down the darkness of popery, they, the protestant did not perfect it, but adulterated themselves with the kings of the earth, the Catholic's the mother, the protestant & all other sects but one, are the Harlots describe here, & then in time, that one also went into apostasy Rev 17:4 all forms of godliness without the Power, some more refine and subtlety dress then others, making a big show of Christian character, works & airy knowledge, but its all from the letter, learnt from the teaching & doctrine of men, in the art of science, as one would any other profession. They practice what the Apostles wrote of, who were lead by the Spirit to do it, but they don't do what the Apostles did in following the dictates of the Spirit which lead the Apostles to do it, Rom 8:14, but follows the learning from the letter & duplicate what they learn & believe they're being lead by the Spirit. NOT !
The Substance is not known here, then they are other that are outright perverted as it is this day.
Yet, God in His longsuffering love has a people within her, whom in Rev 18: calls out "come out of her My people, less you partake of her sins & plagues.
Friends, these are weighty & eternal matters here, let us continue to consider what spiritual state we're truly in, personally & worldwide.
Who will heed His Call, separated themselves from these Harlot's & Abominations of the earth?
The trumpet is sounding, Awake, Awake My Beloved ones, come out of her!
in love & truth
Well said,
I would add to your statement of Paul in 1Cor 9:27
Though Romans is place before Cor in the bible, it was actually written after Cor
In Pauls ever increasing growth in the Grace in the Lord Jesus Christ, Grace brought him to the perfection, maturity, & confidence that he states in Rom 8:35-39
only sin separates
This clearly show a perfection that can be added too, as we continue steadfastly to grow in Grace until the end 2Tim 4:7
this is the reason he states in Philippians 3:12 & then in Philippians 3:15 it was a contradiction of truths, but that he learnt
John 15:5 & Philippians 4:13 Humility, Micah 6:8
We have the Scriptures as a testimony of Paul's extra ordinary life, all owning to Grace, 1Cor 15:10
God is not a respector of persons, though He does have different placement within His body, yet all are required to be holy!
Grace & Peace to you
If pretrib believers be correct, then those of us that believe Jesus returns in the clouds "after"the tribulation..it would be a nice surprise. However, should post trib believers be correct, then pretrib believers will be caught off guard, possibly being deceived by the anti christ, and/ or being unprepared, will suffer great consequence.
Read Matthew 24. And specifically verses 29-30. These are Jesus' very words when asked about the end times. He specifically says that AFTER the tribulation the sun and moon are darkened and that the son of man appears coming in the clouds.
No where does the Bible say that the elect (believers or the saved) will not suffer tribulation. In fact it tells us that the elect WILL suffer tribulation verse 9. Do not mistake or confuse "tribulation"with "Gods wrath". They are not the same.
Jimbob explains it well. And I agree pretrib is one of the greatest deceptions of our times.
Gods Word is True, Jesus is the Truth
Your thinking is from a human perspective,not from GOD's perspective. JESUS said: Luke 21:24-And they(the Jews-Israel)shall fall by the edge of the sword,and shall be led away captive into all nations(this part of the verse literally fulfilled against Israel, from 70 to 1948, 1878 years of severe curses and punishments,and plagues- Deuteronomy 28:15-63):and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles(this part of prophecy will literally fulfill in days to come,also according to the Revelation 11:2)until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
Matthew 24:15 -When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation,spoken of by Daniel the prophet( Daniel 12:6-12),stand in the holy place,(whoso readeth,let him understand)
Daniel 12:6-12
6And one said to the man clothed in linen,which was upon the waters of the river,How long shall it be to the end of these wonders?
7And I heard the man clothed in linen,which was upon the waters of the river,when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven,and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time,times,and an half;and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people,all these things shall be finished.
8And I heard,but I understood not:then said I,O my Lord,what shall be the end of these things?
9And he said,Go thy way,Daniel:for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the END.
10Many shall be PURIFIED,and made WHITE,and TRIED;but the wicked shall do wickedly:and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.
11And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away (Jesus' sacrifice has already lasted 738,300 days,and now will be taken away),and the abomination that maketh desolate set up(in the midst of the last week of years),there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.(END of this current world of Devil)
12Blessed is he that waiteth,and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.
One is not spiritually saved, one is physically save.
Your saved from DEATH, the gift of God is eternal (IMMORTAL) LIFE.
1 Timothy 6:16 Christ ONLY hath IMMORTAL LIFE----your physically married (made ONE) with Christ.
God BLESS YOU!
You are correct, there is no 7 year great tribulation; the word does tell us, the great tribulation lasted from the time Christ entered the garden till he DIED on the cross.
God Bless YOU!
Christ has already come the second time, as a thief in the night, you don't see the thief?
Hebrews 9:28 So Christ was once offered for the SINS of many, and to those who look for him he shall APPEAR THE SECOND TIME without SIN unto SALVATION.
John 16:7 For I tell you the truth, it is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter WILL NOT COME unto you, but if I depart, I will sent him to you.
John 15:26 ....but when the Comforter IS COME ....... even the SPIRIT of TRUTH ..... he will testify of me ......
Colossians 1:27 ..... this mystery ..... Christ ON YOU ......
God Bless YOU!
I am just a voice crying out in the wilderness... A conscience if you will. Letting people know to prepare for judgment. For it will start in the house of God. A lot of people in the Church "think they are saved." So great is Satan's power of deception that the tares truly suppose themselves to be Children of the kingdom!
Paul urges all those claiming to be spiritually saved to "examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith; test yourselves"
2 Corinthians 13:5 (KJV) 5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?
I can't tell you the enormous amounts of pushback I get from both "Christian" men and women on Ephesians 5 and even more pushback on 1 Corinthians 11 "head coverings during corporate worship whenever I bring it up.
Usually, the go-to scripture for these feminist Christians is Galatians 3:28.
Paul urges all those claiming to be spiritually saved to "examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith; TEST yourselves."
2 Corinthians 13:5 (KJV) Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?
I discussed the other day about the Rosh Hashanah last trump concept that made it plausible that the Rapture would be this weekend. Clearly it went by again with no Rapture.
When we look at various events in scripture; we see the surprise element. Surely those watchmen who are asleep or not preparing others will be surprised when He comes (as many will be watching on high holidays such as this and Pentecost).
( Luke 12:35-40). The enemy camp is taken easiest this way in a successful ambush. Watching and waiting with patience is more than a one or two day spectator sport. It does seem that SOME warning comes before the bridegroom arrives ( Matt. 25:6); although some say this is deliverance perhaps before the second coming or even the midpoint of the Tribulation for the Jews or those on earth at that time. In any event; the idea that the Lord delays His coming brings laziness and sin ( Matthew 24:48-51) and results it appears becoming a statistic stuck in the Tribulation at best in verse 51 if not lost forever.
I am a Pre Trib person because it seems clear to me DECADES ago the enemy could have taken over the whole world and certainly we are on "borrowed time" today; the "restrainer" in 2 Thess. 2:6 has to be the Spirit working through the church.
The fact that only a few are really living fully surrendered today shows why in large part the salt and light has reduced to allow the level of ecil we see widespread today. This is in the world as expected but in the Laodicean church that typifies Western churches and that of many other countries in the world today.
Let us continue to warn others to flee the wrath to come ( Luke 3:7); whether it be imminent unexpected death or being stuck in the Tribulation. Remember that Christ comes as a thief to take His precious treasure ( 1 Thess. 5:2; Malachi 3:17). A thief such as this doesn't care about the profane; just the sacred objects of His affection.
Agape.
GBU.
Thank you for your response, your words of encouragement mean a lot to me, as well all the relevant scripture regarding worshiping God in Spirit and Truth, and overcoming sin. I agree with all, and if we our honest with ourselves and take the time to evaluate our true walk with Christ we should be conforming to the scripture you mentioned such as 2 Corinthians 5:17 and 1 John 1:5-6 and if born again should have a mind like Christ 1 Corinthians 2:16
Scripture tells us we can have a mind like Christ! Not conformed to this world, but have renewed minds, and prove what is good, and acceptable, and perfect will of God Romans 12:2 Sinning is not acceptable to God, and for Christians to maintain the steady drum beat that they can't stop sinning is unbelievable per all of the scripture telling us that we are required STOP sinning, even including Jesus telling us that with Faith nothing is impossible for us! Matt 17:20
We are supposed to be as HOLY as Jesus and walk like him.Through the Spirit of God we CAN stop sinning. He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked. 1 John 2:6 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother. Matthew 12:50 The Bible emphasises several times that we are supposed to be holy:Ye shall be holy: for I theLordyour God am holy. Leviticus 19:2
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect. Matt 5:48 Frankie, I think we can both agree that being perfect is without sin. But the multitude of worldly Christains say they can't ever be perfect and will always be sinners in this life - so they are saying Jesus/God is lying in Matt 5:48 and they are not accepting this Truth!
GBU
Paul Apostle in his wisdom, wrote :1 Corintians 2:7-10
7 But we speak the wisdom of GOD in a mystery, even the HIDDEN wisdom, which GOD ordained before the world unto our glory:
8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which GOD hath prepared for them that love Him.
10 But GOD hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of GOD. (Even the hidden wisdom and mystery of His Plan of restitution of all things,the Genesis,describing His works of restoration of creation - Acts 3:18-24. As JESUS said when He came in the fourth Day: My Father worketh hitherto, and I work- John 5:17,(in fulfillment of Genesis 1:26: Let us make man in OUR image, after our likeness:... JESUS being the brightness of His glory, and the EXPRESS IMAGE of GOD's PERSON... Hebrews 1:3
God bless