1 Timothy Chapter 2 Discussion

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  • Patty Tozi for verse 4
    The ending of time - is the beginning of seeing God's true Love for us. The war is on for our soles. Evilness is fighting God's Angel's now. The fight is on. No straddling the fence any more. Who do you choose in these times? Make up your mind. For our Lord comes as a thief in the night. No more chances to choose once He comes. I cannot express how it will be. More poweful then ever imagined.. In a dream l saw the clouds opening with our Lord Jesus and His mighty angels coming down. So powerful the mountains moved. Can't hide. You had your chance. Meet your beginning and your ending of your life. He is here !!!
  • Bob Hilt for verse 4
    DJ - I do not much care for Lexicons of the modern era and yes publishers are changing the meaning of words. what does being gay mean? Happy or a sodomite?

    Henry Thayer has a lexicon and he was a Unitarian that did not believe in the deity of Jesus and his word definitions reflect this. I had a Strong's concordance from the 1980's and the word definitions are not the same as the modern ones.

    Gerhard Kittel has a Greek Lexicon that is an absolute standard in Bible colleges and he was an early member of the Nazi party of Hitler. So should we trust a Nazi to tell us what the words in Greek really mean? This is not a conspiracy theory as it is well documented. Kittel was to face war crimes after WW 2 and he died before trial.

    Zondervan is the exclusive printer of the NIV Bible.

    Zondervan is the largest printer of Bibles in the English speaking world. They are owned by Harper Collins which prints gay p orn and the Satanic Bible for the church of satan. Their parent company is the News Corp we know as Fox TV.

    Bad tree = bad fruit. They are changing the word definitions.
  • Precious Muchemwa for verse 4
    What does it mean to dream of a bible verse (Isiah 42 and Isiah 44)
  • Chris for verse 4
    I've looked at those Isaiah references you gave & could not find any reference to "dreaming of a Bible verse". Is this what you meant or maybe you have had a verse come to you in a dream? If you can give extra information about what you're thinking.
  • Precious Muchemwa for verse 4
    I dreamt someone telling me to read Isiah chapter 42 and chapter 44 so l wanted to know what these chapters might mean in the spiritual realm. Maybe there is something I should know that I am not aware of in the waking life.
  • Chris for verse 4
    It would be difficult to give some spiritual meaning or significance to you from these chapters, since you will need to read them yourself, asking the Lord to speak to you through your reading of them & in light of what you may be going through in your life.

    Another person can only explain the account there, but won't be able to give you the special word to you, unless the Lord directs him. Maybe, you could read those chapters & find something there that seems to warm your heart. And if you don't understand it, maybe we could give the meaning and/or application.
  • Precious Muchemwa for verse 4
    Amen. Thank you so much.
  • Israel Kuda for verse 12
    I agree with Paul 100% and I believe the Bible does not contradict itself.

    It is true a woman should not teach out of her womanhood or femininity. When she teaches, she is preaching/teaching not as a woman but as a member of the body of Christ, one together with other men and women. The womanhood in her should keep silent in church and be subject to her husband but the new creature in her cannot certainly be forbidden to speak the Word. In any case it was women who brought the first news of the resurrection and it was a woman (Anna) who blessed the then baby Jesus, speaking in the temple (the church). Was it not a woman who preached to the whole city and brought the whole of Samaria to Christ in John chapter 4? They later graduated in their belief (v42), after they had come to hear of the Lord first hand but their first instance of belief (v39) was at the testimony of the woman! Yes women were considered property in the Jewish traditions but now Christ has come to redeem them that are under the legalistic tendencies and nitty-gritties of the law that we might receive the adoption of sons and now we are all sons of God by faith!

    It would be foolish to be legalistic and petty by clinging to do's and don'ts in taking this verse at its literal value; any saved Spirit filled, baptized believer can speak in church for there is neither male nor female but we are all one in Christ Jesus!
  • Bethany for verse 12
    "But i suffer not a woman to teach". You have to remember and know that back then women were not taught nor as a whole literate. Women who tried to teach often had no idea to what they were speaking because they were not taught, and that led people astray. Paul would have also known that Deborah was a female prophet who taught the word of God. I believe women can be pastors, but they should not be the sole authority. A female pastor could work with a male pastor or come in for lessons and teaching, but should not be the sole authority in the church unless there is no one else to teach. We are all called to share the word of God. "Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection." Since women were not taught Paul was very for the rights of women. Look at it as if you were in school, when a teacher is talking you are to learn and be silent, so that you may hear and understand.
    Just to put my two cents in, was Paul addressing a specific problem that specific church was having? What was the issue? Paul himself encourages believers to listen to the teaching of the women running some congregations of the time.

    Is there too much being made by some of this particular passage? What is the history of it?

    As Christians, there is no male or female when it comes to the things of God. Throughout history God has used women in the church as Pastors, Evangelists, Deacons, Elders, Teachers.

    Do we sometimes get all tied up in something we shouldn't even be worrying about? Might it be good to keep in mind that we are living under the freedom, both spiritual and social, that we have in Christ? Did Christ save us so we could be bound to laws, regulations, procedures that limit our ability to proclaim His Gospel?

    IMO: Don't let petty, legalistic issues like that bound you up, weigh you down and bundle you up in a confusing mess of do's and don'ts. In Christ there is no male or female. The Gospel can be preached and taught and proclaimed by male, female, donkey or rock. What is important is the proclamation of Christ, not whether your dress is too short, your hair too long, your shoes too bright, your tie is tied wrong, you wear jeans and sandals, you are male, female, child or octogenarian.

    Clearly, Paul was addressing pagan customs of the time and people that were steeped in ways of doing things that might not have been beneficial to a group of Christians meeting in homes and other venues. He was establishing order in the congregations. But we are living in the 21st Century and things have, of necessity, changed. And change is OK.

    We are called to tell people about Christ, not about rules we must follow if we want to be Christians, that is, Spirit filled followers of Christ.

    I, for one, don't really understand 1 Timothy 2:12 in its entirety. And there are other things said we don't fully understand. But "I press on!".
  • Chris for verse 12
    Michelle, the purpose of Paul's letter to the Church in Galatia was because in their midst, were Jews & Gentile believers. There was a group (Judaizers) who still held onto Jewish law & traditions, meaning that both God's Grace & human effort are needed for salvation. Or, in another way, one had to become a Jew before becoming a Christian. Paul said that this was heresy. He goes on in Chap 3 to say that Abraham was justified by faith & not by any works plus faith, so all believers, whoever they are, are God's children: whether Jew or Gentile, bond or free, male or female. There is still an order in the Church to be observed that does not detract from our glorious & equal position in Christ.
  • D W L
    James 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

    James 2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

    James 2:20 View whole chapter | See verse in context

    James 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead

    Luke 6:46 Jesus said why call me Lord Lord and DO NOT the things which I say --

    2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God.
  • Michelle for verse 12
    God also says that there is neither male or female, Jew or Greek, slave or free man, but that we are all one in Christ Jesus and, further, if we belong to Christ, that we are Abraham's descendants and heirs according to the promise. To preach that women should be silent and not teach or usurp authority over a man is to bring yourself under the bondage of the flesh, because the word teaches us that there is no male or female when you walk in the spirit
  • Key words.... "But I" not God, but Paul is saying personally himself and gave the reasons why. If a pastor take over a church there may be rules of conduct
    from the organization or former pastor. It's always important to know what is God and what is "I". I believe Paul had good reason for this and gave this counsel to Timothy as a young pastor. There are definitely preachers and teachers in the bible like Deborah the prophetess in Judges, Priscilla and Aquila in Acts. Paul was concerned with the women absurbing authority over the man (becoming the pastor or shepherd). Guess what, he was right! In some cases this has happened. Women can not cover the man, but them preaching is not sin.
  • Alex
    PPL need to realize that the Woman Paul is refering to is the CHURCH that will be healed in CHILD BIRTH which is the heavenly birth. Thats y he is saying as we have born the image of the earthy we must also bear th image of the Heavenly which is the H.G. A new heart and new spirit is what we need. As the CHURCH IS THE BRIDE of Christ.We are dead to the law by the body of Christ that we should be MARRIED to Another even to him that was raised from the dead that we should bring forth FRUIT (CHILD BIRTH) unto God.The curse started at Adam N Eve but it can only be lifted by CHILD BIRTH,Th child being the H.G. A NEW HEART A NEW SPIRIT I.E YOU ARE MADE CLEAN BY THE WORD/SEED I HAVE SPOKEN UNTO YOU
  • David
    Paul , in corinthians lays a huge reprimand on them for telling the woman to keep silent in the church, goes so far as to say, if you insist on being ignorant, be ignorant. So in Timothy he is not contradictory. He is speaking about a woman and the man. Those are singular. A man and his wife or Jesus and the church. We know the scriptures say in Christ there is neither male nor female. We also know a man and wife are one, neither male nor female, but both as one. Take the scriptures in their entirety, everything has to fit, if it doesn't it's our understanding that lacks, not Gods word.
  • RM
    It behooves us to understand, that the people at the time of the apostles had very real issues like we do today. Timothy, Paul, John, all of them had to address these issues as they arose even as we have to address issues in the church today. We need to apply them to our own situations with wisdom. We need to stop teaching tradition as doctrine.
  • Freedom Now
    Why do people question or ignore what God tells us He is Love and His Guidlines are for our Good. Woman are Precious to God and Created to be Loving Helpmates for Men but we are not to be in Authority over them in Marriage or in the Church and Preach in Authority to Men. We can share God's Truth to Men, Woman and Children and correct error with Scripture if needed as confirmed in the Bible.
  • Freedom Now
    Why do people question or ignore what God tells us He is Love and His Guidlines are for our Good. Woman are Precious to God and Created to be Loving Helpmates for Men but we are not to be in Authority over them in Marriage or in the Church and Preach in Authority to Men. We can share God's Truth to both Men, Woman and Children and correct error with Scripture if needed as confirmed in the Bible.
  • Mark
    Why a woman should not teach ?
  • Steve
    "Because women in Ephesus at this time were uneducated and secluded, Paul was warning that they could be misled by the false teachers trying to lure new Christians away from the church Paul wanted to establish. Those circumstances don't necessarily exist today, because many women, when trained, have gifts that can bring blessing to both men and women." By Jill Briscoe
  • Freedom Now
    Steve, people question negitivly or ignore what God tells us1Cor14:34-40 He is Love and His Guidlines are for our Good Woman are Precious to God and Created to be Loving Helpmates for Men but we are not to be in Authority over them in Marriage or in the Church and Preach in Authority to Men. We can share God's Truth to Men Woman and Children and correct error as confirmed in Scripture or Creation.
  • Church
    women are not to teach men or have spiritual authority over men because Eve was deceived
  • RM
    We are all brethren in Christ, none is higher than the other. We can all teach as we are led by the Spirit and the Word of God. A child under the authority of the Word of God can lead, why not a woman? Tradition has placed women in a very unfortunate position which is not according to the will of God who would have all men free. Women are not to be subjected to anyone. God is the head of the woman as well as the man. United in Christ, all should submit to each other, yielding one to another as directed by the Spirit and Word of God. Where the Spirit of God is, there will be harmony. No harmony? Question your individual allegiance.
  • D W L
    RM -- There are were 12 apostles Paul all men, there were 70 Luke 10"17 sent out to preach and heal all men. I have not found in the KJV bible where women were sent out but told to be keepers at home. Titus 2:5 To be discreet, chaste, keepers at home, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God be not blasphemed. 1Timothy 5:14
  • Freedom Now...
    Church some respond negitivly or ignore what God tells us1Cor14:34-40 He is Love and His Guidlines are for our Good He is not a Male Chovevist. Men are to Love us sacrificialy we are their Helpmates but we are not to be in Authority over them in Marriage or in Church and Preach in Authority to them.But we can share God's Truth to Men Woman and Children and correct error with the Bible or Creation.
  • Chris Johnson
    The question is Why do you think Paul addressed the behavior of women in church?
  • Michael Little
    Paul is telling the Women she should stay in her lane, But with out Women where would man Be in this world today. GOD gave man Woman for a reason. A help meet Mate.
  • RM
    The curse brought on by sin, that women are subjected to me, is lifted in Jesus. There is neither male nor female, jew nor gentile, bond nor free. Every man who has been made free in Jesus will see woman for what she is, his equal. Jesus set the example first. Mary was allowed to sit in a place reserved only for the most honored of scholars, at the feet of the rabbi. This was to show all present that he did not view women as second class as was the popular view. Please not also that a woman was the first messenger of the gospel. He told Mary to go spread the news of his resurrection.
  • DL
    "...in due time..." Paul alone is apostle to the Gentiles that's us , to testify "in due time" that the Father made the Son to be the ransom for all our sins by faith in His blood, without works. That's why, through Paul, Christ said His blood is shed for all while earlier He'd said He was sent to NONE but the lost sheep of Israel. Paul revealed truths from Christ that had been hidden in God.

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